Author Topic: REAL bread  (Read 988 times)

Offline Alpkäserei

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REAL bread
« on: November 21, 2012, 08:50:39 PM »
many people make bread. unfortunately, it seems that so many people only know about quick yeast risen breads, or basic sourdoughs
we're making some bread, real style. this involves both a leaven like you would use for sourdough, and a long ferment. Few people know the wonders of real fermented bread
so here's what we have
made our leaven tonight to make the bread tomorrow morning.
the leaven is water, a little sugar to jump start things, milk, and flour
add to this, a bit of cultured yesast ( you can culture your own easy enough, but i just used storebought) and a few sources of bacteria. i used the water off of raw sauerkraut, scrapings from the rind of a cheese, and
the inside of stale bread. this is all mixed together and let to ferment till morning.
Guät git's dr schwiizer Chäser


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Offline AndreasMergner

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Re: REAL bread
« Reply #1 on: November 21, 2012, 09:49:32 PM »
I agree!  When done that way, it is amazing!  Well, I have a culture that I feed regularly and do an overnight ferment.  Also important is a decent oven (cook the bread on brick) and high heat.  I made a temporary brick oven outside this Summer. 

Alp, do you put anything on the outside?  I like freshly ground wheat berries and sesame seeds.  Poppy seeds are great too. 


Offline mightyMouse.tar.gz

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Re: REAL bread
« Reply #2 on: November 22, 2012, 12:35:22 AM »
many people make bread. unfortunately, it seems that so many people only know about quick yeast risen breads, or basic sourdoughs
we're making some bread, real style. this involves both a leaven like you would use for sourdough, and a long ferment. Few people know the wonders of real fermented bread
so here's what we have
made our leaven tonight to make the bread tomorrow morning.
the leaven is water, a little sugar to jump start things, milk, and flour
add to this, a bit of cultured yesast ( you can culture your own easy enough, but i just used storebought) and a few sources of bacteria. i used the water off of raw sauerkraut, scrapings from the rind of a cheese, and
the inside of stale bread. this is all mixed together and let to ferment till morning.

Here Here!! IMO, its hard to have really good flavorful bread without a longer fermentation. There is a huge difference in depth of flavor between something cranked out of a bread machine, and something that has been made using a nice mature yeast or yeast/bacteria culture and several proofings.

I am curious, what do you mean when you say: "basic sourdoughs".
// bad cheese exception handling
try { Cheese myCheese = new Gouda(); } catch (NastyCheeseException e) { throw new CultureContaminationException(); }

Offline Tomer1

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Re: REAL bread
« Reply #3 on: November 22, 2012, 04:09:21 AM »
I use a natural leven which I maintain, it too a few makes (few generation\feedings) untill I got good co2 production and decent rise.
Also when it over acidifies and dies you need to again, feed it 4-5 times to get it healthy again.

And yes, long fermentation in the fridge will give you very complex flavor and aroma without over souring of the dough.
I find that sugar is not required as there is plenty in the flour, slowely released by enzyme activity in the presence of water. (I like fairly wet levins, 80-120% hydration)
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Offline bbracken677

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Re: REAL bread
« Reply #4 on: November 22, 2012, 07:57:43 AM »
One of the things I have done in the past is to create the "sponge" (yeast, flour, sugar, water) and then only use part of it to make bread. I then refresh it with more flour, sugar and water and stick it back in the fridge. After a while it has taken on characteristics of it's own and you get a truly unique flavor.
It must be refreshed every day or 2 or it will go rancid. You can also get creative and occasionally add a honey or a touch of brown sugar.


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Offline Alpkäserei

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Re: REAL bread
« Reply #5 on: November 22, 2012, 08:46:13 AM »
The best bread I have ever eaten came from the mountains of Switzerland.
This bread is a hearty, whole grain bread yet is not as dense as a lot of the home made bread I have had. Sure, it's not as light as whipped store bread, but bread shouldn't be that light anyway.

I watched this bread being made a time or two, and found their secrets:
1. The use of a leaven, which is much more rigorous and healthy than cultured yeast.
2. The use of a super long fermentation. They would mix and knead the dough one evening, roll it out the next morning, and ferment it until baking the following evening.
3. The use of barley. Almost all Swiss flour, I have since come to find out, has a significant portion of barley. Barley is a lighter grain than wheat. It also adds a great sweet nuttiness to the bread.
4. Mixture of sourdough and yeast leavens. This lets you do the long fermentation at room temperature without producing too much acid in the bread.

I used some active, thriving cultures to start my leaven, and so this morning I had a very active, strong CO2 producing stuff.
The yeast used was pre-activated in some warm sugar water for about an hour before havign the bacteria mixed in.
The scrapings were taken off of the rinds of some fairly young cheeses, which still have active bacteria working on their surfaces.
The sauerkraut is fairly fresh, and it is raw. In addition, the batch of sauerkraut I took the water from has a strong acid, and super active culture. Sauerkraut is made mostly with wild lactobacilli. At any rate, the active cultures are lactic-acid bacteria which is what I want for my sourdough.


By basic sourdough, what I meant is that the process the baker uses is basic. They probably didn't make their starter but got it from someone else, and then they just use it to make a quick rise recipe.

Guät git's dr schwiizer Chäser

Offline Alpkäserei

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Re: REAL bread
« Reply #6 on: November 22, 2012, 10:35:05 AM »
Guät git's dr schwiizer Chäser

Offline H-K-J

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Re: REAL bread
« Reply #7 on: November 22, 2012, 11:33:39 AM »
Very Nice :P my wife and I make our own white loaf bread at least twice a month.
can't remember the last time we bought a loaf from the store
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Offline Al Lewis

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Re: REAL bread
« Reply #8 on: November 26, 2012, 07:22:22 PM »
I make a cottage loaf on occasion but really enjoy making Kaiser rolls from a recipe I found on-line.  Use to buy them as a kid from Stone's Bakery in Baltimore, across the street from Jack's Corned Beef.  Can't find good ones here.