Author Topic: Robiola Due (my second robiola)  (Read 1387 times)

Offline Spellogue

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Robiola Due (my second robiola)
« on: October 22, 2012, 10:48:36 PM »
I made a robiola with just a touch of cow's milk three weeks ago.  I intended to directly inoculate the milk with the molds in the the vat, but forgot, so I decided to use an atomizer instead.  The geo took over, brainy with bright yellow highlights.  The PC tried, but just couldn't make much of a showing at this party.  The cheeses are pretty. There are two more tiny ones formed in cup molds.  They smell a bit, uh, sulphury.  I'm wondering if that's normal.  I took a few spots of grey mold of with a brine wipe last week.  It hasn't come back.  I'm wondering if I should leave them on their present course or wash them with brine with any regularity.   
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Offline Spellogue

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Re: Robiola Due (my second robiola)
« Reply #1 on: October 22, 2012, 10:51:33 PM »
My make notes on this one:

CA9G. 9/30/12  robiola due 
2 quarts fresh goat milk 
1 quarts refrig goat milk
1 pints p/h cow milk 
Bring to 80
Starter cultures 
3/16 tsp meso 101. 10 min
1/32 tsp thermo C
Calf rennet 1/16 tsp
14 hrs clean break
Ladle into camembert mold and  two mini cup molds,  Drain with no weight 48 hrs. Flipping after 12.
Dry Salt with 1 Tbsp air dry 12 hrs
Pinch geo candidum
Pinch pen candidum  in 3% brine spray.  Leave at room temp 24 hrs.   eRipening box for 2-3 weeks. 
Affinage:  10/15.  Wiped w/ 3% brine to control mucor and poil de chat that was starting to form 10/18 geo kicking into force, brain like wrinkly, bright yellow highlights.  Smell is a bit canine, a bit sulphury.  
I can resist anything but temptation.      ~ Oscar Wilde

Offline iratherfly

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Re: Robiola Due (my second robiola)
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2012, 02:14:33 AM »
It's strange that your geo took so long to show up, don't you think? When did you spray the PC?  I usually do it well after the Geo shows up.
I would also do it at 68-72°F instead of 80°F and give it a generous 24 hours. This is important for both the taste and for the geo recovery time.
As far as cultures, I would use Flora Danica or MM100, or Probat 222 or Aroma B for that.  No thermo at all. Thermo can stiffen up the texture.

Robiolas are usually like tiny little baked goods. I love making them. They age so fast!  Here's are a couple of them I made a few months ago:

Offline Tiarella

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Re: Robiola Due (my second robiola)
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2012, 05:48:32 AM »
awash,  I love cheese photos!!!!!

Offline iratherfly

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Re: Robiola Due (my second robiola)
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2012, 01:21:25 PM »
 :)  :)  :)

Offline Spellogue

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Re: Robiola Due (my second robiola)
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2012, 08:24:22 PM »
So, more of a lactic coagulation is traditional then.  That will help a lot. I'll keep the temp lower and extend ripening time on 'robiola tre.'. I'll also eliminate the thermo and stick to MM100.  I saw the thermo in a recipe and figured it was more Italian, but it did make the paste a tad crumbly/cottage cheesey. 

I combined the geo and PC in the same spray liquor.   You would have split them into two different spritzes?  I usually vat inoculate but forgot.  I might try spraying again though, if you think the results are better for robiolas,  It would seem so if that's what got you the results in those photos.  They are all fabulous looking cheeses!  I especially like those fluted ones.  I went straight to the fridge after spraying and 24 hours at room temp.  That might have delayed the geo show too.  Would you keep at a higher temp until signs of geo showing up, then spray w/ PC?

I'll step up the cows milk to closer to half.  Creamline next time.  They did age very fast.  We ate one of the little ones at 4 weeks and it was delicate and tasty.  We opened the larger one in the photo 10 days later and it was so much stronger and tending toward bitter on the attack.  The finish was short and pleasant though.  It was already getting toady.  I just thought the larger one would take longer to peak.  I was mistaken.

Looking forward to making Robiola Tre.  Alas, I will likely have to wait until April when my goats freshen again.  They are dried off 2 weeks now, but we did our first breeding of the season today. It'll be all cows milk cheeses until spring. 
I can resist anything but temptation.      ~ Oscar Wilde

Offline iratherfly

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Re: Robiola Due (my second robiola)
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2012, 12:08:10 AM »
I think you would get wonderful results with lactic coagulation.

I was suggesting that you inoculate the Geo into the milk -because you need it to ripen this cheese rapidly anyway.
Then, once the rind looks nice -follow up with a little bit of a PC spray.

This method will give far more control and better results when compared with inoculating PC and Geo in the milk together. Too often you get too much PC growing too fast.

Do you not have a cave? Going on room temp and then fridge is moving between two extremes. A bit like using really high heat to cook something gentle, and then making up for the burning by putting it on simmer - when what you really need to do is to cook it on medium heat. does that make sense? Room temp will put the geo on overgrowth mode and fridge makes it too slow.  Also if you are trying to go for that classic Robiola of northern Italy / Piedmont - think cool weather Italian alps.  How warm is your room at room temp?

When it comes to surface-ripened cheeses, you have to remember that the rind is what ripens them.  A large cheese or a small cheese - the rind will begin to ripen at the same time and make its way towards the center at the same rate of speed.  So with a large format you must be very vigilant because otherwise by the time the ripening effect reaches the center of the cheese -the surface may be far too ripe. This is why the form factor is important and a good practice is to make the cheese wide and low. This way you have two large rinds in close proximity to one another and the cheese ripens well.  On the other hand, if you take the same amount of curd and form it in a barrel shape it will fail to get to the center.

Offline Spellogue

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Re: Robiola Due (my second robiola)
« Reply #7 on: November 20, 2012, 12:12:37 AM »
Thanks for the advice and clarifications, Yoav.

That's right, no cave as of yet.  I'm trying to line that up by spring.  Room temp was about 68 degrees at the time, we're keeping around 72 now with the woodstove cranking, but cheesemaking slows down here in the winter.  Going to a 46 degree section of the fridge would still be a shock.  I hadn't considered the effects but it makes a lot of sense.  That screeching slowdown probably contributed to the slipskin too.

On my next robiola make I'll use the vat/spray method you describe for the geo and PC. I'll definitely aim at controlling the temp better, even if I have to resort to the ice chest method.  After the traditional first chèvre of the season I'll probably jump right into a few robiola. 
I can resist anything but temptation.      ~ Oscar Wilde

Offline rosawoodsii

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Re: Robiola Due (my second robiola)
« Reply #8 on: December 18, 2012, 05:45:39 PM »
I'm making Robiola today.  Is there more than one type?  The recipe I have from cheesemaking.com doesn't call for Geo or P. Candidum.    The last batch I made was delicious, cut into it in two weeks--but was it Robiola without the Geo and Pen?
Joy

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Re: Robiola Due (my second robiola)
« Reply #9 on: December 24, 2012, 01:02:17 PM »
Robiola is apparently a style category that spans a wide variety.

Robiola di Roccaverano has no rind.  Robiola Bosina is soft ripened with a velvety bloomy rind.  Robiola Rochetta has the brainy rind typical of geo.  Mine shown above turned out like a Rochetta even though I was aiming for more of a Bosina because my PC bloom never took off. 

One aspect that many robiolas seem to have in common is that they are typically blended milk cheeses; cow, goat, and/or sheep.

It's all good.

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Re: Robiola Due (my second robiola)
« Reply #10 on: December 24, 2012, 07:40:16 PM »
Robiola di Roccaverano has no rind.  Robiola Bosina is soft ripened with a velvety bloomy rind.  Robiola Rochetta has the brainy rind typical of geo.  Mine shown above turned out like a Rochetta even though I was aiming for more of a Bosina because my PC bloom never took off. 

It's all good.

All good, but they must all be very different.  I guess I've been making Ribiola de Roccaverano.  No rind, ages 3 weeks to a few months, but I never made it beyond 4 or 5 weeks.  Now I have another to try. :D
Joy