Author Topic: Emmentaler lets try this again  (Read 11532 times)

Offline Alpkäserei

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #135 on: December 07, 2012, 10:43:04 PM »
You could always age it as a hard alpine, like an Alpkäse. If the PS has not grown, it is entirely possible it will turn out this way. But this would require a much longer, rather than shorter, aging period.

Emmentaler is flavored by PS fermentation, and its primary flavor is that of proprionic acid. If we have a mountain style cheese however, such as Emmentaler's cousin (or perhaps father?) of the Bernese Alps, Berner Alpkäse, then we have a lactobacilli-flavored cheese (that is, a hard nutty, spicy flavor) But this takes a lot of time to properly develop. You would have to let your cheese set no less than six months to get the right character, and over a year is better. 2 years is ideal, and 3 years is incredible stuff.

The nice thing about an alpine cheese, you can cut it in half and seal off the one part and let the rest of the cheese continue to age. It is not like some soft cheeses where the aging process stops as soon as it is opened.
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Offline Tomer1

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #136 on: December 08, 2012, 08:23:03 AM »
Quote
you can cut it in half and seal off the one part and let the rest of the cheese continue to age.
Is this is when they melt the exposed end with heat over a fire?
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Offline Alpkäserei

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #137 on: December 10, 2012, 06:41:42 PM »
That is Raclette, or its precursor (some say just a version of the same cheese) Brätchäs. It used to be melted over an open fire and the goo scraped off onto stale bread, potatoes, etc. A tradition originating in central Switzerland. I don't know how or why the cheese ended up with a French name (I suspect Wallis had something to do with it)

A cut open cheese can be wrapped tightly with paper or foil or even the open end smeared shut if you want to age it more. In my experience, cutting open a hard Swiss style cheese doesn't actually have that much affect on flavor.

You can just even leave the cut end exposed and it will dry out and harden, this just will give you a little sliver of cheese that needs to be discarded. It is not like when the cheese is fresh and it will split and mold and all that stuff.
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Offline H-K-J

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #138 on: December 10, 2012, 08:08:44 PM »
Al, If I do decide to cut I can just vacuum bag maybe? :-\
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Offline Boofer

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #139 on: December 11, 2012, 08:37:44 AM »
My Swiss-styled cheeses do just fine with vacuum-bagging.

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Offline Al Lewis

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #140 on: December 17, 2012, 04:06:54 PM »
I've looked into vacumn bagging my 4 pound wheels but it seems I would have to cut them in half first as the vacumn sealer I have, FoodSaver, only has 10" wide bags.

Offline Boofer

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #141 on: December 18, 2012, 08:24:12 AM »
I've looked into vacumn bagging my 4 pound wheels but it seems I would have to cut them in half first as the vacumn sealer I have, FoodSaver, only has 10" wide bags.
Are you sure they're 10 inch and not 11 inch? I think the standard sizes are 8, 11, and 15 inch widths.

I use the 8 and 11 inch rolls and the larger size accommodates my 4 lb wheels just fine. If you need a little extra room, DJDebi has a thread in here somewhere about making larger bags.

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Offline Al Lewis

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #142 on: December 18, 2012, 08:58:24 AM »
Thanks Boofer, I'll have to pull it out of the box and measure it again.  I just bought a load of bags and thought I got every size so maybe the ones I looked at weren't the biggest.

Offline H-K-J

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #143 on: December 20, 2012, 04:51:34 PM »
The cheese has been mindin it's P's-n-Q's looks very good ;)
I will have to post some of my pix's since it has been in the cool box/cave smells wonderfull
I have been washing it once a week and flippin it in between.
Finally finished up my make notes on my blog it took awhile but Im-uh slow typer 
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Offline bbracken677

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #144 on: December 20, 2012, 05:13:27 PM »
Loved the blog!  Very cool H-K-J! 

Hope this turns out well...sooner or later I will be giving the swiss type a go. Love swiss cheese!


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Offline H-K-J

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #145 on: December 22, 2012, 06:08:54 PM »
Gave the Swiss it's weekly wash, smells so nice :)
will flip and wash the other side tomorrow then just flip for awhile, when I lightly push on the cheese it is quite pliable.
The surface is kind-of wrinkly, I think that started when I rubbed it with salt the one time Oh well :-\
It is now 7 weeks old, I have to fuhgetaboudit sooo tempting :P
I better get another Stilton going so I have something else to babysit :)
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Offline Al Lewis

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #146 on: December 22, 2012, 06:16:49 PM »
What ya washing it with buddy?  I'll have to do the same to mine now that it's in the cave.  Been washing it with vinegar/brine to keep the mold off while witting outside of the cave.

Offline H-K-J

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #147 on: December 22, 2012, 06:21:32 PM »
1-qt water, 1/4 cup wine, 2-Tbs canning salt
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Offline Al Lewis

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #148 on: December 22, 2012, 06:37:30 PM »
Thanks a million, I'll start on that tomorrow. ;D

Offline Alpkäserei

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Re: Emmentaler lets try this again
« Reply #149 on: December 22, 2012, 07:14:40 PM »
The wrinkles can happen, don't worry about it. As long as you don't see any cracks (which I don't see why you would at this point) there is nothing to worry about. There is a fairly good chance that these will go away eventually. And if they don't, no problem there other than cosmetic.

The cheese looks good. A nice color, a well matured rind for 7 weeks old. Wait a few months and you will see a beautiful deeper brown or red color to the rind, if it isn't first overtaken with geo dust.

Salt rubbing is something that should start from the beginning. It's hard to just break right into it. Though it is a very good way to go for a lightly flavored rind. With the route you are taking, you will have a very characteristic and noticeable washed rind flavor to the cheese. And mind you, don't cut off that rind when you go to eat it! This will wind up more of a handmade alpine style cheese, less like large factory made Emmentaler. I think you will be pleased with the results.

One thing, with a cooking schedule (temp, times, etc.) more like an Emmentaler, this may not be a concern but with a good alpine cheese, there is often a significant texture change that occurs around the 6 month time period. There can be a huge difference between a 5 month and a 7 month cheese because of this significant ripening time. This is part of the reason why Swiss law mandates that Berner Alpkäse can be sold no younger than 6 months (in reality, this will mean that you are always buying last year's cheese when purchasing from a small producer) AN under mature alpkäse can be rather crumbly and almost dry and hard. But the change that occurs transforms it into a smoother, more consistent, more palatable cheese. It is only after this change occurs that these cheeses will begin to take on their characteristic spiciness and nuttiness. This is why I try to recommend to people, don't go less than 6 months and go a year if possible.

Emmenaler seems to not have this crumbly stage. Maybe due to a combination of lower cook temp and the activity of p. shermannii. I would suspect that propianic acid would contribute to a quicker breakdown of the paste.

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