Author Topic: Cam #2  (Read 1628 times)

Offline AndreasMergner

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Cam #2
« on: January 27, 2013, 10:06:57 AM »
I made a Cam last year as my second molded cheese.  It turned out pretty well, but then I read how you are *supposed to* make it and realize I made a couple mistakes, most importantly, the cold ripening.  I used iratherfly's classic Cam in 10 steps recipe.

I'm using P/H milk because I figure my technique still needs improving before I invest my time to drive 40 minutes to the only local source of raw milk.  I also only have MA11 for ripening cultures.   I really should get some others that everyone seems to be using.  I need a recommendation on which (several?) I should get! 

Make went well, I think.  I hit all the pH and temp markers.  The molded curd seemed nice and soft which seems different from any other make including my cams last year.  I tried to keep stirring to a minimum since all of my cheeses seem to end up too dry.

pH at molding was 6.36 and was 5.95 at demolding/salting.  They ended up a little thicker than last time I made them.  Here they are in the ripening box ready to go in the cave.



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Offline Tiarella

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2013, 10:44:32 AM »
congratulations!  They look quite nice.  Don't know if iratherfly's recipe mentions it but when the PC growth gets going you're supposed to tap/press it down regularly.  moving to colder temps in time seems important as well and I often seem to miss the day I really should be doing that.   >:(

Offline AndreasMergner

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2013, 01:06:32 PM »
Thanks!  I'm pretty happy with the make (so far).   :P

I didn't read the part about tapping the mold down in iratherfly's recipe, but I have read that before.  Good thing you reminded me because I already forgot! 

Offline BobE102330

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2013, 07:25:57 AM »
I like the flavor I get using Flora Danica in my Camembert. It can be used in any recipe that 200 easy cheeses calls for an aroma meso culture.

Offline Boofer

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2013, 09:18:29 AM »
I also only have MA11 for ripening cultures.   I really should get some others that everyone seems to be using.  I need a recommendation on which (several?) I should get! 
I know there have been discussions in the past about what cultures a new cheesemaker might get, but I don't seem to have that link at hand. Can anyone else point Andreas to the right info? It's something that should be in the FAQ board.

I have found reasonable success with the following:
  • TA-61 thermophilic for Swiss, Parmigiano, Romano, Mozzarella
  • Alp D meso/thermo mix (LL, LLC, LLD, ST, LBH, LBL) for semi-hard and hard cheeses
  • Aroma B or Flora Danica mesophilic (LL, LLC, LLD, LMC) for Havarti, Baby Swiss, Gouda, Edam
  • MA4000 meso/thermo mix (LL, LLC, LLD, ST) for Brick, Cheddar, Gouda, Colby, Camembert, Brie
  • MM100 meso (LL, LLC, LLD) for Gouda, Edam, Cam
  • Propioni shermanii for eye/hole development in alpines
  • PLA (B. linens, Arthrobacter nicotianae, Geotrichum candidum, Debaryomyces hansenii) for morge treatment of rinds in hard cheeses
  • SR3 (Brevbacterium linens) for rind development and protection and paste maturation(orange)
There are certainly a lot more cultures available, but these have been the framework for a lot of the cheeses I have made. I keep them in their original foil pouches and vacuum-seal them after opening to protect them from moisture in my freezer. Seems to work very well. The TA-61, Alp D, Aroma B, and MA4000 were also mother-cultured to extend/expand the culture and save a little money.

I didn't include Penicillium roqueforti (PR) or Penicillium candidum (PC) because you can grab them from store-bought cheeses.

I've grown really fond of Alp D and PLA. They're wonder cultures for me.

HTH.

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Offline Tiarella

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2013, 10:39:57 AM »
Who makes the Alp D?  I haven't seen much about that one.  Sounds interesting.   :)

I use mostly the MA4000 series and MM100 series although I also use some adjunct cultures such as MD88 or LM57 sometimes.  I have PC VB and Geo13 although I'm wondering about a different Geo when I run out of this one.  I do also have TA61 for the parms.  I also have been appreciating the Mycodore for rind development.  I like how it makes the cheese smell like fresh mushrooms.  (I haven't tasted one yet because they are still aging but I do always smell the cheeses when I check them, give those that need it a little massage, etc.). With all the wiping out of moist boxes of certain cheeses it can feel almost like I'm changing cheese diapers.  :-\

Offline AndreasMergner

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2013, 02:38:46 PM »
Thanks for all that great info, Boofer!  What are the acronyms LL, LLC, etc.?  I would like to get a few of those, but why can't you blend a meso and thermo to get a mix instead of buying the already mixed type? 

Do you think the PLA is better than just using b linens plus geo? 

Offline H-K-J

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2013, 04:12:52 PM »
 AndreasMergner

MM100-101
the cultures in the packet
(LL) Lactococcus lactis subsp. lactis
(LLC) Lactococcus lactis subsp. cremoris
(LLD) Lactococcus lactis subsp. lactis biovar diacetylactis
(freeze-dried direct set/DVI-Direct Vat Innoculation)
act as if it were impossible to fail.

Offline Boofer

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2013, 06:38:08 PM »
Who makes the Alp D?  I haven't seen much about that one.  Sounds interesting.   :)
See the attached.

With all the wiping out of moist boxes of certain cheeses it can feel almost like I'm changing cheese diapers.  :-\
:o  :P  Whoa! Thanks for that lingering image...(must scrub mind out thoroughly!)

why can't you blend a meso and thermo to get a mix instead of buying the already mixed type? 

Do you think the PLA is better than just using b linens plus geo? 
You can certainly mix your own "custom blend" for whatever you want. Someone else has already determined an optimal blend so why should I try to figure out something better?

PLA, as you can see, includes 2 linens cultures (B. linens & Arthrobacter) as well as a yeast and Geo. My experience has been very good using it.

I've included the Alp D and PLA docs plus a couple culture selection docs.

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Offline AndreasMergner

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2013, 02:53:09 PM »
Thanks for all the great info! I will definitely have to order at least some of these very soon.

I think the Cams are doing well.  I've been wiping out the containers twice a day and flipping them.  They now are getting some Geo slime (now I know what that is!) on the sides and it looks like the ends have both cream and snowy white colors on them.  Something good is happening!  It is too subtle for pics, but I'm sure I'll have something more interesting to show in a couple of days.


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Offline AndreasMergner

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #10 on: February 08, 2013, 04:13:58 PM »
The last couple days I have opened the ripening container to a smell similar to white wine.  I think I might have some linens growing on the cheese, although I'm not sure if the smell is coming from it or not.  I don't know what Geo smells like.  I do know that I have not gotten much PC growth yet.  They have stayed pretty moist and I've tried to dry them a bit over the last few days by leaving them out for a bit.

I'd love to get a bit of wisdom on whether I'm on the right track or not.  The recipe says to expect PC bloom at around 2 weeks and I'm at 12 days so if they fully bloom in 6 more days that is no problem...but that smell has me a little worried. 

In the pic you can see a very slight orangey-ness just to the right of the top corner facing you....or maybe it is too slight.  :)


Offline BobE102330

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #11 on: February 08, 2013, 09:26:48 PM »
They look a bit dry, like a batch I made that had trouble growing PC.  I ended up wrapping mine when I had about 30% PC coverage and they eventually got a thick PC coat, almost too thick. It went from under ripe to liquid in a week. What is your aging temperature? 

Offline AndreasMergner

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2013, 05:08:58 AM »
52 degrees F. That's helpful info. They were much wetter a few days ago and slimy. They were wet and an not moist, plus the smell got me paranoid of linens since it happened to my Stilton.

Offline mtncheesemaker(Pam)

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2013, 09:16:31 AM »
Here's what works for me:
After draining and removing the cheeses from their molds, I keep them in their ripening box, loosely covered, at room temp on the kitchen counter. I'm religious about keeping any accumulating moisture wiped up and turn them daily. They usually begin to bloom in 3-4 days. When they are fully bloomed, I move them to the colder room and continue to flip them daily, wipe the box, and pat down the mold.
I also quit using Geo as it seems to always lead to the dreaded slip skin.
It took me several tries to figure out what works for the milk I use and the conditions that I have.
Pam

Offline AndreasMergner

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Re: Cam #2
« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2013, 11:37:09 AM »
Pam, thanks for that info. 

I have been wiping out moisture every day (twice a day for the first 5 days).  I had good Geo growth, but PC has been a bit slow.  I don't remember a problem last time I did it and I think I used Geo then also.  I think I read that slip skin can be prevented by wrapping and refrigerating the cheese to allow the PC to grow deep into the cheese while the Geo is dormant at that temp.  This is the first time I will be trying that technique so it is only what I have read!  I don't think I did anything drastically wrong, so hopefully it will turn out ok.