Author Topic: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)  (Read 2045 times)

Offline Boofer

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Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« on: May 28, 2013, 08:50:50 PM »
Definition of N'EST-CE PAS?
: isn't it so?

Origin of N'EST-CE PAS?
French
==================================================
Chasing the success of my first effort with this cheese, I decided to jump right in and repeat it.

The song remains the same...without the added cream.

This was made on Sunday. Today it seems almost finished shedding its excess whey. It is in its minicave in the cave which has been reset to 57F. The minicave lid has been cracked slightly to allow the exit of the excess humidity. In the the next day or so I will salt the cheeses which should expel additional whey.

The brick mould was filled to the top with curd and I am still hoping that the height of the cheeses is further diminished, although that didn't seem to be a big problem with the first effort.

This is expected to take 8 weeks to reach optimum ripeness.

-Boofer-
« Last Edit: May 29, 2013, 06:13:42 PM by Boofer »
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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2013, 05:24:52 PM »
Those look nice.  Looking forward to see how this goes.  Hmmm, could you insert a couple of layers of needle point matting, with maybe something solid between them, as a vertical wall in your mould so that you don't need to cut the final cheese when they come out?  Sort of a duplex mould?  I'm only thinking this because I recall some discussions about the ripening of the cut edge being less than the others. 

- Jeff
The wise do not always start out on the right path, but they do know when to change course.

Offline Boofer

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #2 on: May 29, 2013, 06:22:31 PM »
Those look nice.  Looking forward to see how this goes.  Hmmm, could you insert a couple of layers of needle point matting, with maybe something solid between them, as a vertical wall in your mould so that you don't need to cut the final cheese when they come out?  Sort of a duplex mould?  I'm only thinking this because I recall some discussions about the ripening of the cut edge being less than the others. 

- Jeff
Yeah, this has worked out okay in several of my makes, but today I decided I needed a better solution and took the plunge. Stop the madness! Along with a couple replacement cultures I grabbed two Taleggio moulds. They should improve my desire for square cheeses immensely. The brick mould will be relegated to Esrom, Tilsit, or whatever else comes along that may need to be a brick shape.

Good idea of yours though, Jeff. Thanks for that.

This afternoon, a little bit ago, I flipped these cheeses. Already I see a bit of Geo coming out. Good stuff. The cut side in the #1 make didn't seem to be a problem. I don't foresee it being a problem here either.

The wife will probably go into a melt-down when she hears I bought the two new moulds. ::)

-Boofer-
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Offline Tiarella

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #3 on: May 29, 2013, 06:47:36 PM »

I bought the two new moulds. ::)

-Boofer-

Need photos of the new molds please.....!   ???  can't imagine them.    But you'd love the Tellagio (sp?) mold with divider I got from Yoav.  Is that what you got?

Offline Boofer

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #4 on: June 06, 2013, 08:14:39 AM »
Here's an updated link which shows the new Taleggio mould.

I had seen the dimensions of the Taleggio mould, but somehow I had this vision that it would produce a similarly-dimensioned cheese as the brick mould. Viewing them side by side, it is quite obvious that I was having an extreme day dream. :o

The spreadsheet gives me the volume of curds that the mould will accept, which is larger than the brick mould, but I don't know what the optimum volume would be to create a properly thick Taleggio. Anyone done this before with this mould? The brick filled to the brim will settle curd to a little thicker cheese than the style seems to demand.

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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #5 on: June 06, 2013, 01:40:12 PM »
Hmmm, my gut instinct is to suggest that the same height of curds will compress to the same thickness.  If you want a slightly thinner cheese, base the height on 90% of the brick's height.  You can then calculate the volume of curds that would hold, and use that to calculate how much milk to used based upon your make experience with the brick (i.e. your current makes fill the brick, and you can work out the brick's volume, etc).

- Jeff

P.S.  My guts have been wrong before, and believe me, when they are it is not pretty.
The wise do not always start out on the right path, but they do know when to change course.

Offline Boofer

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2013, 06:38:16 PM »
My guts have been wrong before, and believe me, when they are it is not pretty.
Boy, you've got some guts. :P

If I were to use the same recipe and volume of milk that I have been using with the brick mould, I believe that would give me 81% in the Taleggio mould. That might be acceptable. I guess the only true test is to follow that logic and make the cheese. Once done, it can be tweaked up or down as required.

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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2013, 07:32:42 PM »
Ok, 81% would suggest, if I'm right in my assumptions, that you should end up with a cheese that is roughly 4/5ths the height of what you're currently getting.  Will be interesting to see if that's the case.

- Jeff
The wise do not always start out on the right path, but they do know when to change course.

Offline Boofer

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #8 on: June 29, 2013, 08:44:50 AM »
Seems like this is at the midway point. The rind has been taking an interesting turn. The core appears still fairly firm when pressing lightly on the middle.

-Boofer-
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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #9 on: June 29, 2013, 01:20:57 PM »
Seems like its got a wire frame!  Interesting development.  Out of curiosity, how is the thickness relative to your previous makes?  Were our calculations anywhere near accurate (One of the curiosities of the English language is in the proper use of the possessive pronoun with respect to predicted outcomes; in the unknown result case, it is proper to use "our", as in "our calculations", in the case of a known result of high accuracy, it is proper to use "my", and in the known result of being wildly off the mark, the term is "yours", this is just how English works! :) )

- Jeff
The wise do not always start out on the right path, but they do know when to change course.


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Offline Boofer

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #10 on: July 01, 2013, 08:14:57 AM »
Don't confuse this with a cheese that could be done in the Taleggio mould. The form factor, quantity of milk (except for the cream), and thickness are identical to the previous make.

With reference to the possessive pronoun use of "our", my understanding is a shared experience. ;)

When I wiped/rubbed these cheeses and the Saint Paulins this morning the "wire frame" has become exaggerated. I'd say shrinkage is a factor.

Tomorrow is week five. Three more weeks to go before cutting. I hope it holds up and doesn't implode during that time. ::)

-Boofer-
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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #11 on: July 01, 2013, 01:28:16 PM »
Doh!  Of course, this is from the brick mould make that you started with!  Sigh.  Not enough coffee before posting.  There's never enough coffee! :)

- Jeff
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Offline Spellogue

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #12 on: July 01, 2013, 11:59:47 PM »
I'm gearing up to christen my new taleggio mold from Yoav and this may be just the right make.  I've been dreaming about making something like petite pont l'eveque for some time now.  (I say "something like" because I'll use goat's milk). Thanks so much for posting your notes in these two threads, Boofer.  I offer you a cheese for such generous effort.  You are a gentleman and a scholar. 

And a cheese to you too, Yoav.  I'll stick to the ARN on my first try, as tempted as I am to bust into that new packet of PLA.

I aspire to such fine cheese as you both have depicted here.
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Offline Boofer

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #13 on: July 02, 2013, 08:34:27 AM »
Thanks for the cheese, Mike. I will interested in your first Taleggio-moulded cheese.

You're very generous with your compliments about my rendition of this cheese style but I'd say it wouldn't be appropriate for the Taleggio mould. Not enough milk...too few curds. Instead, I'd like to suggest you christen your new mould with Jim Wallace's Taleggio recipe. Having recently acquired Taleggio moulds myself, that will be my recipe of choice for the first cheese out of the gate. It uses a bit more milk than this make.

I'm also curious how the ARN works out for you. I've made a number of cheeses with PLA and they've turned out fairly well, but I acquired some ARN recently and I have yet to use it in anything.

This is a small cheese compared to what the Taleggio mould will produce. Man, now that I'm typing this and pondering the poor Taleggio mould out in the garage with nothing for it to do...and all that rich summer milk.... Nope, must be patient.:(  Tick, tick, tick....

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Offline Spellogue

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Re: Pont l'Évêque...n'est–ce pas? (#2)
« Reply #14 on: July 02, 2013, 02:27:18 PM »
What?  No room for a taleggio I the cave network, Boofer?

I'm rarely doing larger than a 2 gallon make now until we get all the kids weaned.  I was thinking about filling just two of the 4 divider spaces in the taleggio mold, but that might be a dicey move.  I might try a two quadrant fill for the first time with a more flexible cheese.  I was inspired by Jeff's recent posts to make feta again.  Perhaps that will be a better subject cheese for the partial fill experiment.

I've liked the cheeses I made with ARN, but the results I got were a bit variable because of the different ripening conditions I used. I'm sure. I keep learning.  I didn't realize there was geo in the ARN blend until just recently.  When I first started making more classic style cheeses I ordered "b. linens" and ARN is what I came in the order.  The b.l strains are supposed to be ivory to orange, but I've obtained more brown and burnt orange shades when using it.  Flavor and aroma were good, but I don't have anything to compare it to since it's the only b.l. source I've used up to now.  I'm holding off on opening my new packet of PLA.

I have a recent 1 gallon make that I vat innoculated with 1/16 tsp ARN.  I'm about to start washing it this week.  I'm wondering if it is still viable as I had it stored next to some white mold packets that went clumpy on me.  I'm thinking he geo in the blend might be dead, but I still have hopes for the b.l.  It's pretty tenacious stuff.  Should be interesting to see what develops.
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