Author Topic: My 4th Brie  (Read 2952 times)

Offline Boofer

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #15 on: July 19, 2013, 07:07:01 PM »
It seems like linuxboy advised against it at some time or another. I'd be afraid to chance it. The rind has indeed gone through a lot of modification getting to the retail point. PC from a Cam/Brie and PR from a purchased blue cheese are a couple that have been easily and safely purloined.

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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #16 on: July 20, 2013, 01:37:19 AM »
Thanks Boofer.  That was my recollection too.  Nice to have someone either to confirm, or at least share in the hallucinations! :)

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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #17 on: July 22, 2013, 01:30:11 PM »
Anyway, got good coverage today (day 23) so wrapped in foil and moved to the regular fridge.  Feels pretty close to ripe now, so will probably try this on the weekend.  :)

- Jeff
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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #18 on: July 27, 2013, 12:20:39 AM »
Well, we were at day 28, which is normally fully ripe or very close.  However, as the mould did develop slowly, it looks like this is just on it's own time course.  Coverage is good, the rind not too thick, etc, but as the slice image shows, it's not ripe.  I was a surprised though, as when I pressed on the centre is felt quite soft.  Bit of slip skin at the edge, but that's not surprising as the edge developed mould early and was ripening in while the faces were just bare for ages.  Anyway, the cheese weighs in at 972g, or did before I took the slice out of it.  It will continue to ripen as it's big enogh that the faces provide enough mould to continue the process.  I figure it will be about 2 weeks before it's ready though.  Currently, it has that fresh cheese chaource semi-lactic type of taste to the chalky bit.  So, it's not bad, but it's not brie either!  Getting there though.

- Jeff
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Offline Boofer

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #19 on: July 27, 2013, 01:55:10 AM »
How thick is this, Jeff? Very curious. The mold-ripened technique is elusive to me. Like you, I have felt some that seemed nice and soft when pressed, but disappointingly chalky when opened. We just need patience. You're getting there though. :)

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Offline jwalker

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #20 on: July 27, 2013, 10:41:02 AM »
How thick is this, Jeff?

-Boofer-

That's what I was wondering , the uncut ones look very thin in the photos , but it looks thicker in the cut piece.

I've had real good luck with Bries , and curiously , the thicker ones seem to ripen faster and more evenly , usually age in the cave for four weeks and then two weeks at 38 degrees in the cold fridge , that's for the two gallon batches which are about 2-2 1/2 inches thick.

I have two one gallon makes about 1-1 1/2 inches thick and they are a little more solid (maybe dried out a little more?) , and don't seem to be ripening much more.

I usually use P/H store bought milk , but in one make I used farm fresh milk , that one has a very strong flavor , I'm not really fond of it , it's sort of like I can taste the pasture the cows were grazing on , my neighbors liked it , so I gave it to them.

I guess it's all what a person is used to , but I will probably use P/H milk for future Bries.
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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #21 on: July 27, 2013, 02:12:10 PM »
It's about 2.5 cm thick (an inch).  The cut one has an angle to it that makes it look thicker.  I'll get it sorted.  I've had really good luck with this milk before (it's creamline), so now it's a matter of replicating that.  I realise, the best result I've had the cheese was about 200g lighter, so I think I'm not expelling enough whey, and the curds are too wet when going in the mould. 

- Jeff
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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #22 on: August 09, 2013, 05:56:35 PM »
Just an update.  Ripened all the way through now, and gets quite runny at room temp.  Just a slight bitterness around the rind but not unpleasant.  Quite nice actually.  Will try and get a photo next piece, as this one seems to be disappearing fairly quickly.  That's a good sign.

- Jeff
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Offline Smurfmacaw

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #23 on: August 09, 2013, 06:42:58 PM »
Great job!  I think the problem for hobbyist cheese makers is the inability to exactly duplicate every little thing, so it's hard to determine when exactly a bloomy rind is ripened perfectly by time alone.  I'm sure there are folks that can tell just by touching it the stage of ripeness......  I do really enjoy this type of cheese though just because of the interesting transformations that take place.  Oh yeah, and the cheese tastes really good too.

Offline george (MaryJ)

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #24 on: August 10, 2013, 05:30:27 AM »
I thought cams/bries wouldn't continue to ripen once cut?  How are you achieving this amazing feat, Jeff?  Is it because it's already so thin that it doesn't take much?  Inquiring minds want to know ...  ;)
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Offline Boofer

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #25 on: August 10, 2013, 10:01:09 AM »
I thought cams/bries wouldn't continue to ripen once cut?  How are you achieving this amazing feat, Jeff?  Is it because it's already so thin that it doesn't take much?  Inquiring minds want to know ...  ;)
Hello, george! How've you been?  :)

I saw the post-cut ripening with my Pont l'Eveque so it can happen. True, not in the exact same ballpark as Cams/Bries, but rind-ripened nevertheless.

And a cheese to the cheesemeister down there. Good job, Jeff.

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Offline Spellogue

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #26 on: August 10, 2013, 11:27:28 AM »
I thought cams/bries wouldn't continue to ripen once cut?  How are you achieving this amazing feat, Jeff?  Is it because it's already so thin that it doesn't take much?  Inquiring minds want to know ...  ;)

A better way to state or consider this might be to figure that bries/camemberts won't ripen 'properly' once cut. 

The proteolitic action will continue once the cheese is cut, but it will be uneven.  I find that once cut the liquifying layer oozes past the cut edge and escapes to some extent, even under refigeration, and the cheese will slump.    The rind then, at a more advanced stage, is in closer proximity to the firmer portion of the pâté without the full range and amount of enzymes that would have been in the disturbed gooey portion.  (Is there a standard term for that layer of the paste just under the rind?).  The continuity of the cheese's ecosystem will have been disrupted.  The rind's mycillium and substrate will have been disturbed. This not only slows down the process, it introduces a different and less desireable landscape for the microbial action.

All that said as most of us have seen, it's not necessarily the end of the road for an underdeveloped bloomy-rinded cheese that's been cut.  The result of continued ripening will be different, stunted, and perhaps imperfect, but this is an art not a science.  My experiences are mainly with goat bloomies, which in some cases progress rather quickly, but I suppose most cow's milk cheeses will behave quite similarly.
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Offline Boofer

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #27 on: August 11, 2013, 12:29:14 AM »
The proteolitic action will continue once the cheese is cut, but it will be uneven.  I find that once cut the liquifying layer oozes past the cut edge and escapes to some extent, even under refigeration, and the cheese will slump.    The rind then, at a more advanced stage, is in closer proximity to the firmer portion of the pâté without the full range and amount of enzymes that would have been in the disturbed gooey portion.  (Is there a standard term for that layer of the paste just under the rind?).  The continuity of the cheese's ecosystem will have been disrupted.  The rind's mycillium and substrate will have been disturbed. This not only slows down the process, it introduces a different and less desireable landscape for the microbial action.
Yeah, that about covers what I'm really seeing. ;)

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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #28 on: August 11, 2013, 01:30:57 PM »
I think it also helps that this is 20 cm in diameter, so about 8 inches across.  Cutting a wedge out of one side doesn't disturb most of the cheese so much.  Also, the gooey layer, while it leaks out, seems to slow down the ripening of the inner paste if it develops too quickly (otherwise known as slip skin).  It seems to me, in my limited experience with this type, that draining that off might help recover the process a bit.  Hard to say though, as I never have two of these to compare what happens in a non-cut one. 

Still, to say that they don't continue to ripen is inaccurate.  That it changes how they ripen, however, seems to be more the case.  I'm pretty sure that I need to get more whey out of the curd before moulding though.  I had one turn out near perfection, but comparing my notes I see it weighed quite a bit less.  And, my recollection of the cheese out of the mould was that it was more firm (less moisture) than the subsequent ones.  There's a bliss point I'm missing, but I think I now know where it is.

- Jeff
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Offline george (MaryJ)

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Re: My 4th Brie
« Reply #29 on: August 12, 2013, 05:31:14 AM »
Hey Boof!  Not too shabby - but I'm wondering if my cheese-making days may be over.  There is waaaaaaayyyy too much critter hair floating around this (new to me) house!  I'll have to keep working on it.

And thanks to all for the answers about the ripening - I should have known that a factoid picked up from the fabulous Cheeseforum.org would include the word "properly" in it.   ;D
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