Author Topic: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info  (Read 716 times)

Offline steffb503

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Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« on: November 18, 2013, 05:24:26 AM »
I typically vac seal my cheeses but upon some reading, I feel like I would like to try this method.
I don't seem to find any real how-to.
My favorite makes are Edam, Emmenthal, and Gouda.
Seems like these all do well with a cream coating.
I am sure you all have discussed this before so if there is a link I would greatly appreciate it.


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Offline linuxboy

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #1 on: November 18, 2013, 09:32:13 AM »
What do you want to know? You paint it on, making sure the rind is dry to the touch and the cheese does not weep residual whey.
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Offline Spoons

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #2 on: November 18, 2013, 12:19:58 PM »
Just remember that the cheese still breath with the cream coating on. It's not as air tight as a vac seal or even a wax coating. Some people add wax after the cream coating to prevent breathing and rind development.
- Eric

Offline Digitalsmgital

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #3 on: November 18, 2013, 11:25:39 PM »
I have had some difficulty finding PVA at the usual sources. I don't need a 55 gallon barrel, just enough to cover a few small batches of gouda. Online, or in the Los Angeles area would be fine too.
Regards, Dave

Offline steffb503

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #4 on: November 19, 2013, 05:33:17 AM »
So when the rind is sufficiently dry I simply paint on the cream?
Do I need to do anything else like wax or seal. I do not seem to have the set up for wax at all.
But with just a vac seal I do not have a defined rind. I love the look of cheese with the cream.
Will the cheese I mentioned do well with just a cream?
How long can the age ? Is there a point where they breath too much?


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Offline linuxboy

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #5 on: November 19, 2013, 07:07:10 AM »
Quote
So when the rind is sufficiently dry I simply paint on the cream?
Yes
Quote
Do I need to do anything else like wax or seal.
What do you mean by need to? You don't even need to use cheese cream. Does it help to stop moisture loss if you wax or seal? Yes. Should you? Up to you.
Quote
Will the cheese I mentioned do well with just a cream?
Moisture loss will slow down by 50% or so.
Quote
How long can the age ?
Until the cheese is done. It's the same as normal aging. using cream helps conserve more moisture and sell more water in the cheese
Quote
Is there a point where they breath too much?
It's a constant rate of loss, varying with cave humidity.
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Offline steffb503

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #6 on: November 19, 2013, 07:36:53 AM »
Thank You

Offline jwalker

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #7 on: November 19, 2013, 08:25:22 AM »
I have had some difficulty finding PVA at the usual sources. I don't need a 55 gallon barrel, just enough to cover a few small batches of gouda. Online, or in the Los Angeles area would be fine too.


I get mine at cheeseandyougurtmaking.com , they are very good and the shipping is fast.

http://cheeseandyogurtmaking.com/cheese-making-supplies/cheese-making-waxes-coatings/white-coating-for-cheese-making.html

I had one break during shipping , it was dropped or something , they replaced it right away , great people to deal with.

It costs about $14 or so for a 2 pound container , it goes a long way.
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Offline jwalker

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2013, 08:55:16 AM »
Or check this out:

I don't know if one could buy these on a small scale though , it would be interesting.

Natural cheese ripening with Pack-Age™
Pack-Age™ is a cheese ripening bag that naturally ripens your cheese – with no coating needed. There’s nothing else on the market like it, because Pack-Age™ not only gives your cheese natural taste, texture and a dry rind, but will also helps you increase volume, reduce waste – and cost.
440-package
Because Pack-Age™ is perm-selective it supplies just enough moisture to hard and semi-hard cheeses while maintaining an effective oxygen barrier against mold-growth on the surface. And this level of protection grows even more when you use Pack-Age™ in combination with our natural yeast and mold inhibiter, Delvo®Cid.

Today we have several European cheese producers using Pack-Age™ commercially; while various medium sized and larger cheese makers are now testing it for different cheese types. What’s more, in extensive testing the Dutch Dairy Research Institute (NIZO) found that the cheeses ripened with Pack-Age™ retained their flavor and texture despite reducing moisture loss by 50%.

Benefits
Natural ripening with no need for coating
Improved quality by more consistent drying through cross-section
Improved yield with less moisture loss and no cutting loss
More sustainable with a reduced carbon footprint
Added value through greater volume, realizing a dryrind instead of a thick dry crust.
Technical info
Traditionally, there are two main processes for ripening hard and semi-hard cheeses like Gouda, Edam, Manchego and Emmental. The first, called natural ripening, involves coating the cheese after brining so that the cheese air-dries and a hard crust is formed during ripening. The second involves brining followed by airtight packaging, so that the cheese stays soft and doesn’t form a crust. Although they provide some benefits, both processes also have drawbacks in terms of cost, yield, taste and texture.

Pack-Age™ helps overcome these drawbacks by combining the best of both worlds giving cheese makers tighter control of both the moisture level and the gases (like oxygen) passing through. The film's permeability enables the cheeses to be dried naturally in air during ripening so they develop their own natural taste and texture.

This new technology has been tested for taste and texture by the Dutch Dairy Research Institute (NIZO). During the ripening process, each cheese was shown to develop its own balance of taste and texture. Comparative research from the NIZO demonstrated that the Pack-Age™ film preserves this balance, even with the 50% reduction in moisture loss provided by the use of Pack-Age™ compared to naturally ripened cheese.
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Offline Sailor Con Queso

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2013, 01:14:24 PM »
JW - What's your source for this info? Is there a USA supplier or a web link?
A moldy Stilton is a thing of beauty. Yes, you eat the rind. - Ed
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Offline linuxboy

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2013, 01:23:19 PM »
Sailor, that's a DSM product (attached). talk to them.

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Offline Spoons

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #11 on: November 19, 2013, 05:34:31 PM »
Is cream wax frost sensitive? I'm asking because that;s what they say on Glengarry's website, but nowhere else have I seen that posted. It's already getting a little frosty in my corner of the world, so I was wondering if it would be safe to order some this winter.
- Eric

Offline Digitalsmgital

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2013, 05:45:36 PM »
Is cream wax frost sensitive? I'm asking because that;s what they say on Glengarry's website, but nowhere else have I seen that posted. It's already getting a little frosty in my corner of the world, so I was wondering if it would be safe to order some this winter.
Yeah, I see that they won't even ship it come December.
Regards, Dave

Offline jwalker

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #13 on: November 20, 2013, 09:50:57 AM »
They're not far you it seems , you could have it shipped by Greyhound or other Courier and probably have it the same day.

Or drive over and pick it up if you want it bad enough .

I think it separates when frozen , so you have to be careful with it , I order extra just before November , to make sure I have enough for the winter.
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Offline linuxboy

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Re: Cheese cream? Can I get some more info
« Reply #14 on: November 20, 2013, 10:19:41 AM »
PVA tends to form a hydrogel after a frost-defrost cycle. So it's not a good idea to expose it to freezing temps.

[edit] meaning, it won't be paintable any more. It'll thicken and harden.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2013, 10:36:30 AM by linuxboy »
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