Author Topic: My orange sourdough starter!!  (Read 742 times)

Offline andreark

  • Medium Cheese
  • ***
  • Location: San Francisco Bay Area - Delta Area
  • Posts: 79
  • Cheeses: 1
  • Default personal text
My orange sourdough starter!!
« on: February 06, 2014, 08:00:57 PM »
I am making a Taleggio type cheese and my garage frig is too cold for BLs to grow.(or so I understand)  So I put the cheeses and their plastic box in my sourdough frig.....Now a week later, the cheeses are
still white.  But when I removed my starter to feed it, , , it was orange.  I don't really care if I get a 'stinky' loaf the next time I bake, but will the sourdough yeasts harm the cheese in any way?

andreark

Offline linuxboy

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Ukiah, CA
  • Posts: 3,986
  • Cheeses: 199
  • www.wacheese.com
    • Washington Cheese Guild
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2014, 08:14:39 PM »
no, but if you do have an excess of yeast, you can start to get some off flavors. it's about concentration on the rind.
Taking an extended leave (until 2015) from the forums to build out my farm and dairy. Please e-mail or PM if you need anything.

Offline andreark

  • Medium Cheese
  • ***
  • Location: San Francisco Bay Area - Delta Area
  • Posts: 79
  • Cheeses: 1
  • Default personal text
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2014, 09:54:35 AM »
My kitchen bread frig is a large wine cooler.  I've moved my sourdough starter to the garage (temp there fine for a while).  Do I need to wash my kitchen frig?  I will keep the Taleggio in it till it ripens.

Thanks a bunch for your answer.

andreark

Offline graysalchemy

  • Mature Cheese
  • ****
  • Location: Manchester
  • Posts: 130
  • Cheeses: 5
  • Default personal text
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2014, 10:21:46 AM »
I find my sourdough can pick up a whole host of fauna if it is not looked after. Between use I keep it in the fridge but on one occasion I left it in a cupboard in the kitchen at room temp, not particularly warm we don't do warm here in manchester  ;), but when I went to refresh it mid week it had changed colour and was smelling rather like our springer spaniel, or should I say a wet springer spaniel. After throwing most of it and rejuvenating it, it was back to normal in a few weeks, actually better than ever.  :D :D

Offline andreark

  • Medium Cheese
  • ***
  • Location: San Francisco Bay Area - Delta Area
  • Posts: 79
  • Cheeses: 1
  • Default personal text
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #4 on: February 07, 2014, 10:43:31 AM »
I'm sorry, I didn't phrase my question well.  I was not asking if I should clean out the frig for future use with my
sourdough starters,  I was asking if I should clean it out for further aging of the Taleggio.  Will the SD yeasts
affect my cheese?

(I have been making and teaching sourdough techniques for years.  I realize that the bread starters won't be damaged.
They are VERY vigorous.)

Thanks,

andreark


Offline Geo

  • Mature Cheese
  • ****
  • Location: Tasmania, Australia
  • Posts: 376
  • Cheeses: 31
  • Default personal text
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #5 on: February 07, 2014, 02:34:16 PM »
The yeasts could well colonise your cheese, so I would recommend sanitising.

Offline linuxboy

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Ukiah, CA
  • Posts: 3,986
  • Cheeses: 199
  • www.wacheese.com
    • Washington Cheese Guild
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2014, 03:28:39 PM »
Quote
The yeasts could well colonise your cheese, so I would recommend sanitising.
Yeasts are really not a big deal PROVIDED that there's enough of a population of b linens and other coryneforms to start growing quickly after the initial deacidification from the yeasts.
Taking an extended leave (until 2015) from the forums to build out my farm and dairy. Please e-mail or PM if you need anything.

Offline andreark

  • Medium Cheese
  • ***
  • Location: San Francisco Bay Area - Delta Area
  • Posts: 79
  • Cheeses: 1
  • Default personal text
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2014, 11:56:04 AM »
Sorry, linuxboy, but I don't understand what you mean. (Obviously a beginner)  I started this Taleggio 10 days ago and there is no sign of color.  When (and what is ) does this deacidification  take place? And how do I recognize it?

Thank you all for responding,

andrea

Offline linuxboy

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Ukiah, CA
  • Posts: 3,986
  • Cheeses: 199
  • www.wacheese.com
    • Washington Cheese Guild
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #8 on: February 08, 2014, 05:27:10 PM »
b linens requires the surface to have a ph of > 5.6 to start growing. Tallegio is typically 4.8 after salting. To get the pH up, yeasts consume lactic acid and make way for the b linens. If you do not have yeasts, b linens cannot grow. If you have too much yeast and not enough b linens, the yeasts will take over  and the b linens population will not be high enough to ripen the cheese properly.

You recognize it if b linens starts taking off (color and smell) after 4-6 days.
Taking an extended leave (until 2015) from the forums to build out my farm and dairy. Please e-mail or PM if you need anything.

Offline andreark

  • Medium Cheese
  • ***
  • Location: San Francisco Bay Area - Delta Area
  • Posts: 79
  • Cheeses: 1
  • Default personal text
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #9 on: February 08, 2014, 09:20:54 PM »
Linuxboy,

Thanks for answering.  I must have too much yeast, there is no orange color AND there are small white blotches like Camembert.  Yeast?

Thanks again,

andrea

Offline John@PC

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Hartsville, SC
  • Posts: 531
  • Cheeses: 39
  • Default personal text
    • Perfect Cheese
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2014, 07:02:37 AM »
2 related questions:  The taleggio recipe I've used called for "a pinch" of b. linens added with the starter and washing the finished cheese with a salt solution while aging to discourage unwanted mold and encourage b. linens.   How is the result different than using a corynebacteria / salt solution wash like you do for smear-ripened cheeses?  Also, if you use a b.linens wash do you need to replace it with a fresh solution every so often or can you let it sit in your cave and "ripen" along with the cheeses?  I've had my little b. linens brush-and-jar in my cave for over 6 months and add salt solution when it starts getting depleted.  Is this kosher  :-\ or should I be changing it instead of adding to it?

Online ArnaudForestier

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Madison, Wisconsin
  • Posts: 1,470
  • Cheeses: 41
  • Default personal text
    • Paul's FB
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2014, 08:24:38 AM »
John, I'd have to confirm, but I seem to recall Francois saying that is not only kosher, but desired.  My mistake if I've recalled wrongly, of course, but that seems to be the recollection.
- Paul

Offline jwalker

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Creston BC Canada
  • Posts: 648
  • Cheeses: 66
  • I thought I was indecisive , now I'm not so sure!
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2014, 09:51:35 AM »
John , I've been doing the same thing , and it seems to be working.

I've been keeping my jar in the refrigerator , not sure if I should be leaving it out at cave temp or not though.

No..........I'm not a professional CheeseMaker , but I play one on TV.

Online ArnaudForestier

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Madison, Wisconsin
  • Posts: 1,470
  • Cheeses: 41
  • Default personal text
    • Paul's FB
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2014, 10:11:32 AM »
John, found the Francois quote, from 2011:

Quote
It's supposed to be stinky.  As long as you use a clean cloth every time, keep the brine covered and in a fridge I don't see the problem.  I have no issue keeping solution for 3 months.  If it did get really nasty I would just boil it and redose, not make fresh.  I do this with brine as well, it gets better with time, even after boiling.


- Paul

Offline jwalker

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Creston BC Canada
  • Posts: 648
  • Cheeses: 66
  • I thought I was indecisive , now I'm not so sure!
Re: My orange sourdough starter!!
« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2014, 11:44:22 AM »
John, found the Francois quote, from 2011:

Quote
It's supposed to be stinky.  As long as you use a clean cloth every time, keep the brine covered and in a fridge I don't see the problem.  I have no issue keeping solution for 3 months.  If it did get really nasty I would just boil it and redose, not make fresh.  I do this with brine as well, it gets better with time, even after boiling.



So it should be kept in a fridge , that's good to know , I haven't been using a rag , but a brush instead , I do wash it out well after every use.

And as for the brine , I have been keeping mine out on the porch over the winter , it has been as low as -20 , I have an extra fridge that I will keep it in over the summer months.
I've had the same brine for about 6 months now , and it smells great , I think it really adds an extra dimension of flavor to any cheeses brined in it.
So far it is fine , but I may boil it at some point , if I think it needs it.
No..........I'm not a professional CheeseMaker , but I play one on TV.