Author Topic: Did a 7 Pound Emmental  (Read 22644 times)

Offline Al Lewis

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #30 on: March 18, 2015, 09:22:42 PM »
Alp doesn't make emmental.
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Stinky

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #31 on: March 18, 2015, 09:35:56 PM »
Well, he made a recipe for it a while back.

http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,11069.0.html

Or wait he never actually explicitly stated...

Damn.

Okay, then.

I guess I'll make a different cheese this week? Hrm.

Offline Al Lewis

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #32 on: March 18, 2015, 11:58:44 PM »
Trust me Stinky I did the research.  They use milk with a 50% reduced fat content for emmentaler in Switzerland. ;)  Ask Alp.
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Stinky

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #33 on: March 19, 2015, 12:32:41 AM »
"Emmentaler Cheese is a whole cow's milk cheese. Although once produced only in Switzerland, the name is not protected so France and Germany are both big producers of this Swiss like cheese. The paste of this cheese is pale and buttery witrested in cooking with it, Emmentaler is a wonderful melting cheese. It is considered a pillar of fondue making; it is also wonderful in sandwiches and sauces. If you are looking for a specific wine pairing, try Jura Blanc, but don't be a fraid to experiment. This cheese was made to be enjoyed with a glass of wine so try it with your favorite and it will probably be a wonderful combination."

http://www.french-at-a-touch.com/Gourmet/Cheese/emmentaler_swiss.htm

I believe you, I'm just going to have to make another type of cheese tomorrow. :/ Maybe one that can be waxed for sure so I have room for an Emmental next week? Hm. What would be the consequences of whole milk? From my sources it looks like it can be done with whole milk?

Stinky

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #34 on: March 19, 2015, 12:36:08 AM »
Also in this Bulletin of the USDA, it doesn't specifically state anything about the milk for Emmental, but says that "Swiss" cheese is, in contrast to Emmental, made from half skimmed milk, which to me implies that it's whole milk.

shaneb

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #35 on: March 19, 2015, 12:38:28 AM »
When they say "whole cows milk" maybe they just mean it is cows milk, not a mix of goat, sheep, whatever. Not that they mean it's full fat.

Shane

Stinky

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #36 on: March 19, 2015, 12:47:04 AM »
This is true... although I would guess "all cow's milk" would be more typically used there. Who knows.

Offline Al Lewis

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #37 on: March 19, 2015, 01:33:30 AM »
Also in this Bulletin of the USDA, it doesn't specifically state anything about the milk for Emmental, but says that "Swiss" cheese is, in contrast to Emmental, made from half skimmed milk, which to me implies that it's whole milk.

Since when is "skimmed milk" whole milk.  Whole milk means nothing has been removed.  Skimmed means they took the cream, and fat solids, out.  BTW  Emmental is NOT made in the U.S.   To discuss this cheese review the AOC from Switzerland.  It gives the accepted recipe and aging for this to be called emmentaler.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2015, 01:13:11 PM by Al Lewis »
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qdog1955

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #38 on: March 19, 2015, 08:05:09 AM »
Al----sorry, didn't mean to cause any controversy----we all know there are lot's of discrepancies in various recipes and we all should know that American terminology and practices aren't always correct. I would think the Swiss have a pretty good handle on how to make an Emmental.
  The main point I was curious about-----I'm pretty sure the Swiss aren't using a 2% cow-----are they skimming the cream off the top to get to that percentage of fat they are looking for? And how do they know when they've reached that point?
  This has a direct bearing on when I am using raw Jersey, and that definitely has to much fat for some cheese I make, and how to go about lowering the fat content without wasting any product.
Qdog

Offline Al Lewis

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #39 on: March 19, 2015, 01:06:03 PM »
No problem Qdog, from what I have read they skim the cream off of the milk.  Alp tells me that the percentage they shoot for is 50% so that's what I based my recipe on.  You're certainly right about the recipes.  I've seen plenty that call for whole milk to make emmental and parm however I wouldn't use it for either. 
« Last Edit: March 19, 2015, 01:11:05 PM by Al Lewis »
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Stinky

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #40 on: March 19, 2015, 02:16:26 PM »
Al----sorry, didn't mean to cause any controversy----we all know there are lot's of discrepancies in various recipes and we all should know that American terminology and practices aren't always correct. I would think the Swiss have a pretty good handle on how to make an Emmental.
  The main point I was curious about-----I'm pretty sure the Swiss aren't using a 2% cow-----are they skimming the cream off the top to get to that percentage of fat they are looking for? And how do they know when they've reached that point?
  This has a direct bearing on when I am using raw Jersey, and that definitely has to much fat for some cheese I make, and how to go about lowering the fat content without wasting any product.
Qdog

Someone probably measured how much fat is gotten off by skimming... it's definitely not all of it.

Offline awakephd

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #41 on: March 19, 2015, 06:22:15 PM »
FWIW, I think if you use whole milk in a parm-type style, you are heading more towards a Romano -- ??
-- Andy

Offline Al Lewis

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #42 on: March 20, 2015, 04:38:45 PM »
Not sure Andy as I've never looked at the recipe for the romano but I believe, I could be totally wrong, that the long aging cheeses need the fat restricted as it tends to turn rancid if aged too long.  That's why the fresh cheeses, such as brie and camembert can be made with triple cream.
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Alpkäserei

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #43 on: March 20, 2015, 04:58:07 PM »
OK here's the scoop on fat content,

In Switzerland, butter making is/was very important.
In fact, Alpine cheese ultimately descend from butter making, believe it or not.

In the Middle Ages, it was more important to make butter than to make cheese -this is cultured butter that can be stored and transported without turning rancid

So then, cheese was made out of part of the milk, and from the skim left over from butter making -which still has all the protein.
As time went on, cheese became more important and a traded commodity, so more milk was used just to make cheese, but butter is still made in large quantities.

So the part skim milk used in Swiss cheeses has more to do with the historical connection with butter making than anything else.
A lot of alpine cheeses today are made with full fat milk or mostly full fat, just because it is not as practical today to try to make and store a lot of butter when it can be had for cheaper from the valley dairies.

But things like Emmentaler, which is made in lower elevations, continue to be made with part skim because butter is produced, and also because it's part of the character of the cheese. A full fat cheese has a different texture than a part skim cheese.

If you look at the label for many US made Swiss-style cheeses, even these will say part skim milk.

For an Emmentaler, you don't really want the fat.
Usually if you want a light, pliable, flexible texture like what is desired in an Emmentaler you want to skim 1/3 to 1/2 the fat off

Unfortunately for me, the government in Indiana does not approve of the method used in Switzerland to let milk sit in shallow pans and then manually separate the cream, I have to use a mechanical separator.

Offline Al Lewis

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Re: Did a 7 Pound Emmental
« Reply #44 on: March 20, 2015, 05:46:54 PM »
Thank you for clearing that up Alp.  As usual, your knowledge of alpine cheese is invaluable to us.  AC4U for being a fountain of knowledge! ;D  Thinking about doing another Mutschli buddy!  Busy this weekend but may go for an 8 gallon make next weekend.  Or maybe a Raclette. The emmental is coming along great.  With the white wine/brine wash it has that slight dusting of white you get on a good rind and nothing else.  I just mist it on with a spray bottle every evening and wipe it off with a paper towel. ;D
« Last Edit: March 20, 2015, 09:06:38 PM by Al Lewis »
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