Author Topic: Newbie - Aging cheese issues  (Read 3999 times)

roleneroux

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Newbie - Aging cheese issues
« on: March 05, 2016, 08:44:02 AM »
Hi everyone!

I am new at cheese making, only recently started. It feels like I more success with my first few attempts of making cheese, when I didn't know what I was doing.
The more I am reading up and experimenting with new things, the more mistakes and bad cheeses I am ending up with. I know its still early days, just feeling
a little frustrated so early on in my new journey and just need some pointers.

I moved in my boyfriends who owns a Jersey dairy. I had to take advantage of using this creamy rich raw milks. I am only using small batches at a time, 5 - 10lt, as that
is the largest amount I can heat up at a time. I have made amazing creamy Blue cheese, Camembert etc, but when it comes to the harder pressed cheeses, things fall apart.

The entire process works amazing up until I take them out the press. They keep their shape, do well soaking in brine, drying etc, but then I get stuck.

Initially, I wanted to vacuum seal my cheese after drying. I don't want to make really old cheese just yet, only aging them for 1-2 months. I thought it would be a waste waxing them as the wax is very pricey in South Africa. I tried a few, they seemed fine at first, but then I had lots of moisture in the bag and gas. It made the rind's slimy and it smelt bad. I then opened up all the cheeses, tried to dry them again, seal them, and the same happened. I am assuming the cheese can not breath. Can anyone give me pointers on using a vacuum sealer successfully?

I then attempted to try a natural ride. I put nothing on, just kept cleaning the rind with salt and vinegar water. Those cheeses are tasting extremely dry  :-\.

Last night I tried to oil a natural rind with olive oil and then bandage it with cheese cloth. I will have to wait and see what those come out like.

I managed to purchase a PVA cheese paint. I read good things on the paint. The cheese can breath, no mould will grow, helps reduce moisture loss etc. I read up that you can use this cheese paint by itself, for aging cheese for short periods. If you are going to age cheese for many months, I would imagine waxing it over the paint is best, but mine only need aging for 6-8 weeks. Would using this paint alone, 2-3 layers, be sufficient and not let the cheese dry out? My cheeses are max 1kg as this is the biggest mold I have.

I am just concerned about taking this paint coating off when the cheese is ready to eat. Does it peel of very easily or does it stick to the cheese as I really do not want
another cheese to go to waste if this does not work. How often to I paint it? When do I put the first coating? Any help would be appreciated.

Below is my Farmhouse Chive Cheddar I made yesterday. It is in brine at the moment. I have no idea what to do with it next. Vacuum seal? Paint? Natural rind? Bandage? HELP??

Offline Andrew Marshallsay

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Re: Newbie - Aging cheese issues
« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2016, 10:01:13 AM »
Hi Winterfell

Welcome to the forum and to cheesemaking.
The first thing to say is "Don't despair!"
There are a number of variables which might be considered. What temperature are you storing your cheeses at?
For cheeses that haven't been bagged, what is the humidity? These factors are important in the affinage (fancy French term for aging) of cheese.
With your bagged cheeses, it may be that they need wiping with brine before bagging to prevent the growth of micro organisms. Also be aware that vacuum bagged cheeses are best allowed to breathe for a while after opening. I have had bagged cheeses produce gas and I have had bagged, and waxed, cheese which were rather wet when opened. This is not necessarily a problem if they are allowed to dry out.
- Andrew

Offline Al Lewis

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Re: Newbie - Aging cheese issues
« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2016, 03:47:33 PM »
Hello and welcome to the forum.  I think I may have the answer to your problem.  At least OzzieCheese does and I know where to find it so have a good long read of this thread by our good Aussie friend Mal.  BTW you can wash and re-melt that cheese wax.

http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,13778.0.html
Making the World a Safer Place, One Cheese at a Time! My Food Blog and Videos

Kern

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Re: Newbie - Aging cheese issues
« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2016, 07:55:12 PM »
Welcome to the Forum, Winterfell.  You'll find lots of good information here, albeit you sometimes have to search for it using the search box under the CheeseForum.org logo.  Be sure to pick the area where you want to search using the drop down list.  I usually select "entire forum" for complete results.

Too many years ago to count I learned that there are four categories of learning:

Unconscious Incompetent:  This is the first time golfer who hits a "smoking" drive on the first hole and figures he's now got the game mastered.  Also, you on your first cheeses.
Conscious Incompetent:  This is the first time golfer at hole #5 with a loosely counted score of 53 realizing that some knowledge and lessons might be in order.  Where you are now.
Conscious Competent:  The golfer several years later after many lessons and rounds with a handicap of 14 and getting better.  Where most regulars on the CheeseForum are now.
Unconscious Competent:  Professional golfers with tons of muscle memory who rarely think much about the fundamentals of hitting the ball.  Where multi-generational European cheesemakers mostly reside.

Good luck to you and keep on learning.   

Offline OzzieCheese

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Re: Newbie - Aging cheese issues
« Reply #4 on: March 06, 2016, 02:47:51 AM »
Awwww.. Thanks Al !  It is so wonderful getting accolades from ones peers.

@Winterfell.  The gasing problem might be due to other factors, including the temperature you are aging your cheese at.  Another might be the cultures you are using as some are more CO2 producers than others.  I also might be some bacteria that got into the cheese as you are making the Cheese, cleanliness will help here...  While brining is one way to get salt in, I've found that the Cheddars store and age better when the curds are salted after the milling stage and then pressed.  It also quickly slows down the Culture activity.

My favourite way to age these is by 'Cloth Bandaging' but that also depends on the availability of Lard (rendered Pork fat).  I would try to avoid butter as it tends to go rancid.  I have heard that 'Crisco' vegetable shortening is also quite good.  I too don't like wax as there is no gas transfer and sometimes just tastes funny.  Bees wax, now there is something I have yet to try :)  When I'm lazy I vacuum seal and then when I'm feeling a bit more 'Zen' I'll pull them out of the vac bag and bandage them...

Hope that helps   

-- Mal
Usually if one person asks a question then 10 are waiting for the answer - Please ask !

Beans

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Re: Newbie - Aging cheese issues
« Reply #5 on: March 06, 2016, 05:03:47 PM »
Don't give up on vacuum sealing.  Its cheap, effective, and easy to accomplish.  Once in a while cheese will come out a little slimy and stinky but after a good dry will be just fine.  Cheese making is stinky business, it just is.  Are you living on a dairy? that must be convenient for cheese making :>

2WheelFun

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Re: Newbie - Aging cheese issues
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2016, 09:46:08 PM »
Bees wax, now there is something I have yet to try :) 

-- Mal

OzzieCheese,  our first-ever waxing attempt came about because we didn't have any cheese wax and had a nice new 100% beeswax candle sitting around.  The 1-month-aged gouda cheese came out tasting strongly of honey!  That doesn't sound so bad, and could perhaps be used to good effect, but wasn't our intention.  For this gouda it wasn't entirely complimentary, either. :(   It looked nice, though.  I'd be curious if the source or refining of the beeswax comes into play.  Maybe we had some especially fragrant or unfiltered wax!  It would be interesting to hear if other people have had different results.

MrsKK

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Re: Newbie - Aging cheese issues
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2016, 10:46:24 PM »
I vacuum seal cheese, but I wait until it has aged for at least 6-8 weeks, the only times I didn't give it that much time, there was a lot of whey in the bag and the cheese went really sour.

Look up ripening boxes on the forum, they've been almost life changing for my cheese making. And if the rind gets dry after that point, I coat with rendered pork lard.

roleneroux

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Re: Newbie - Aging cheese issues
« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2016, 11:57:47 AM »
Thanks for the info guys. I haven't had time to come back to the site lately to read all the comments, but I think I have managed to fix many of my problems.
I guess I just need to keep experimenting and practicing doing things in different ways. Since that post, I have made only a few small adjustments and feel much more
confident and excited about the whole thing.

I do however believe the problem of gas was more due to my cheeses not being pressed hard enough to remove all the moisture. Also possibly vacuum sealing them when they
were too wet. I have found that putting a layer or 2 of PVC cheese coating on, helps it to dry for longer without drying out too much. Then vacuum sealing after a few weeks produces no
gas.

This week I made my first attempt at using wax, over my PVC coating and was surprised at how easy it works. Probably easier and cheaper than the vacuum bags. Looks
way more professional in any case. I will see what these cheeses look like in a few weeks.

I was brave enough to offer to make cheeses for my sister-in laws wedding. People loved them. Attached some pics of my first waxed cheeses as well as the spread at the wedding. My wedding is in November. I am making all the cheeses for the canape's as well as mini camemberts for all guests as favors. This is one bride who will be stressed out over her cheeses and not how I look on the day :)


Offline awakephd

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Re: Newbie - Aging cheese issues
« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2016, 01:31:53 PM »
Looks beautiful - a cheese for you!
-- Andy

Duntov

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Re: Newbie - Aging cheese issues
« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2016, 10:03:21 PM »
A cheese for you also.  Looks great!!

Offline Fritz

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Re: Newbie - Aging cheese issues
« Reply #11 on: September 12, 2016, 11:40:10 PM »
I'm sure my invite went missing in the mail system .....looks awesome ! A cheese and best wishes to your sister-in-law :) can't wait to see the spread for your special day !

F