Raw Cow's Milk - Questions?

[mgable]

I just started making cheese ( pepper jack and a manchego ) both ageing now. I am waiting to try them to see if I am making good tasting cheeses. I just bought 3 gallons of whole milk at sams club last night to make a Havarti where I met a friend who has goats, I inquired about getting some goat's milk in the future and he told me his brother has a couple cows. well his brother called me last night and he will sell me raw cows milk for $ 3.00 a gallon. My questions are: Do I need to pasteurize? Should I mix it with the store bought milk or just make 2 separate cheeses? Do I need to do anything different when using raw milk?( less rennet less starter culture etc.)  He said his milk has a high fat content do I need to skim a little cream off ? What is the difference in the final cheese using raw milk as compared to store bought.

[MrsKK]

I only make cheese from raw milk, from my own cow.  I know my own practices, I know how clean she is and I know how healthy she is.  Therefore, I don't feel a need to pasturize my milk before drinking it or using it to make cheese.

If you do make cheese with it and it is aged for more than 60 days, you won't need to pasturize, either, because the developing acidity in the cheese will be enough to kill off any microorganisms anyway.  I would not mix the milk, as the store milk usually requires the addition of calcium chloride for cheesemaking, while raw milk does not.

As to the skimming question, it depends on the type of cheese you are making.  When I make cheddar types, I leave all the cream on.  When I make mozzerella or parmesan, I skim the cream.

I will let someone else address the "difference" question, as I've never used pasturized milk for cheesemaking.

Have fun with it!  $3 a gallon is downright cheap for raw milk, IMHO.

[siegfriedw]

Your are correct that $3.00 Per gallon is a real good price for raw milk but it's far  more than a commercial dairy gets paid for their milk when they wholesale it.

 It is even a good price for any milk. I know it costs me more than $3/ gallon to produce my own but I am small scale.

This is part of the reason all the small dairies are going out of business.

With regards to "raw" milk vs pasteurized the debate continues but there are many cheese "Experts" who will swear that raw milk is better - and it makes sense to me.

The Weston Price foundation is a big advocate for raw milk see http://www.westonaprice.org

and if you want to know specifically about the benefits of raw milk as they relate to cheese check out this site: http://www.rawmilkcheese.org/index_files/aboutus.htm

[pamaples]

I will jump on the raw milk bandwagon. I only use raw milk from my own goats. Like Karen, I know they are clean and healthy. IMHO pasteurised, homogenized, factory-farm milk is bad for you.

I make yogurt primarily and non aged fresh cheeses. I am thinking of getting another goat and branching out into aged cheeses but haven't been too pleased with my results at several attempts thus far.....

Pam

[DeejayDebi]

I definately prefer raw milk for my cheeses. I don't have a cow or a goat but I do get it from licensed certified dairies that are tested regualarly.

[Lady]

Adding my newbie observations - I seem to get a higher yield when I use raw milk verses pasteurized milk.  But that may also be partially determined by the animal the milk comes from (my raw milk is from Jersey cows while most store-bought pasteurized milk is from Holsteins).

[Sailor Con Queso]

Raw milk is the only way to go if you can get it. Much firmer curd, much better yield, MUCH better flavor. The only downside is that raw milk tends to change with the seasons, weather, field that they are grazing in, lactation cycles, etc. So your cheeses may not be a consistent as they would be with processed milk. The other downside (Oh well there are 2  ) is the cost. At least in my area, raw milk runs about $6 a gallon unless you "BUTTER" up to a farmer and maybe trade a little bit. Store bought milk can be had at Kroger's for just $2 a gallon. The old caveat - "You get what you pay for" is definitely true.

[pamaples]

Well the other thing about $2.00 store milk is the contamination with antibiotics and growth hormones fed to the cattle on the feed lot "dairies". I shudder every time I go past one of those "dairies" and see the inhumane situation the cattle are in; standing around in manure filled paddocks in the sun or crowded under a too small pole building shade structure in groups of 200 or more. The flies are numerous outside the pesticide-sprayed boundary and the stench is overwhelming for miles which ever way the wind is blowing. Wholesome raw milk makes better everything. From yogurt to cheese to baked goods.

[DeejayDebi]

I agree with you Pam!

[Sailor Con Queso]

..and when a cheese doesn't turn out as well as expected, it's easy to blame it on the milk or pasteurization or homogenization. The problem may actually be residual antibiotics (or growth hormones) and not the milk itself. Mother Nature makes good stuff. We should quit messing with her stuff. 

[siegfriedw]

Cant agree more with the last few posts. That's why I have my own dairy goat herd.

[FRANCOIS]

Ok, now I have to pipe up.  Firstly, there are no antibiotics in store bought milk.  It's illegal and every farmers samples are tested before the tankers are unloaded in every state in the US.  Secondly rBGH is hardly used in the US at this point and some labeling requirements do exist.  It is very unlikely that the milk you purchase contains it.  Thirdly there are considerable numbers of certified organic dairies that are disgusting feed lot dairies, operated by the same corporations that produce ceonverntional milk.  I formerly owned and operated a raw milk dairy and I can tell from my own experience that there are raw milk dairies that are just as disgusting and unsafe as feed lots.

I always usd to tell my customers you need to know your farmer and know where the milk comes from.  See the operation, the animals and the equipment.

The plant I work in now uses only pastuerized milk.  We produce award winning cheeses that are shipped world wide.  We consistently place along side raw milk cheese at competitions, even beating out some of the traditional makers for categories such as parmesan.  It is possible to produce incredible cheeses with pasteurized milk and it's possible to produce inedible glop with raw milk.  It depends on the skill of the cheesemaker.

[Sailor Con Queso]

Francois, you're absolutely right about the corporate run "organic" dairies. In my opinion, the concept of "certified organic" (milk or vegetables) has become nothing more than a marketing scam. The rules have been slanted towards the corporate farms in a way that excludes or makes it really difficult for good, small farmers to qualify. Here in Kentucky most organic farmers are choosing not to become "certified". So, you're right - know your farmer. I buy from a woman that has just 2 Jersey cows that produce about 50 gallons a week.

Our local food co-op swears that their organic milk is better because it doesn't contain antibiotics or rBGH. I appreciate your valuable insight and I will definitely discuss this with the co-op. The real irony is that their organic milk probably comes from the same corporate milk processors that supply cheap milk to the regular grocery stores.

[DeejayDebi]

I have used both raw and pasteurized and I really like the creaminess better from the raw milk cheeses. Maybe I just like the extra cream in my cheese. 

I do agree that some organic farmers are not clean and sanitary about their production. I drove by a few while looking for milk. Poor cows were covered in muck and flies and didn't look happy at all. I couldn't encourage animal crulety like that.

The lady I have been getting it from lately is almost neurotic about her farm. I would almost consider eatting from any surface in her milking barn. I never saw such a pretty, bright,cheery, spotless barn! Actually it's nicer than my house. Very homey. The weird part is there is no manure smell anywhere around the farm. I drove by it twice thinking it was just some rich folks place but it was a just a beautiful farm well manicured spotless, odorless farm with a wooden covered bridge at the head of the driveway. They are quite proud of their farm and rightfully so.

[FRANCOIS]

Deb,

Are the initials of the farm B.B.?  I would wager most anything they are.  The owners are very, umm, unique people.  They approached me about buying milk from them for our plant, but I had a more affordable source I trusted.

In CT your dairy has to be clean enough to eat off any surface to pass inspection for grade A raw.  Couple that with the fact that the privately owned ones are usually owned by people who are very passionate about milk and you get a very high quality milk out of the operation.