Author Topic: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured  (Read 4724 times)

Offline hydromojo

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #15 on: November 15, 2009, 11:26:15 AM »
John - in pic#24, your cheese looks quite dry after the immersion in the brine. did you dry this out before taking the photograph ? I followed your instructions for the steps before this but could only use weights till about 16lbs. Did this for 6hrs, flipping the cheese initially every 30mts for the first 2 hours. How dry does it have to be before I put it in the brine ?

Regards
Raol


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Offline DeejayDebi

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #16 on: November 15, 2009, 11:55:06 AM »
Havarti is a very moist cheese but it will dry out really fast if you don't protect it. Salt washes will dry it too. I only air dry it so it's slightly dry to the touch then bag it if possible. I have aged it in the cave alone but it requires a lot of attention. Don't let the mold get to it!

Offline Tea

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #17 on: November 15, 2009, 02:03:03 PM »
Oh John what an Awesome looking cheese.  So were you please with the final cheese?  Would you do this one again?
I keep trying to convince myself that I don't need a Kadova mould, but that pic is wearing down my resolve.  :D

Offline DeejayDebi

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #18 on: November 15, 2009, 05:58:46 PM »
Tea -

One thing about those molds is the time you save. No dressing or redressing, no pre-draining, no need for a collander really the mold has one built in sort of. You can almost elminate cheese cloth except for washing. No wrinkles!

Offline hydromojo

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #19 on: November 16, 2009, 02:30:35 AM »
Thanks for the info Debi. Will definetely keep my eye out for mould.

I got into this with no mat, so using kitchen towels, changed intermittently to keep the cheese on. i dont have a cheese cave atmosphere, but use my home refrigerator for now.

Raol


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Offline Tea

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #20 on: November 16, 2009, 01:59:15 PM »
Hydro I don't have a cave either, but for the initial aging/humidity etc, I just use an esky with bottles of ice, which I change a couple of times a day.  It I need a greater humidity, I just add a container of water.
Not perfect by any stretch of the imagination, but it will suffice.
Once I have the cheese going well, I then transfer into the fridge. HTH

Offline hydromojo

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #21 on: November 16, 2009, 11:47:32 PM »
Tea - thats an interesting idea. Didnt think I could keep it out. Must try this out. not sure if i've done any permanent damage by directly keeping it in the fridge after pressing and 'brining'.

I check after 24hrs, no mould, but still a little wet. Reminds me of the goose that laid the golden eggs - I'm checking on this everyday  :D

By the way, whats the least time I should wait for a natural rind to form ? I'm wondering whether there is a range after which I assume its not going to happen and I'll have to dispose the cheese.

Thanks!

Offline Tea

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #22 on: November 17, 2009, 12:33:10 PM »
I think Sailor was saying that he waits 4-6 weeks for the rind to harden/yellow, but I would think that times would be different for different cheeses.  SOme of the harder cheeses seem to form a rind quickly, and the softer cheese, seem to take a little longer.  If I am not happy with how a rind is forming, I have scrapped back, cleaned and washed with a brine solution, and started over again.  Probably not preferable, but it will save a cheese.

Offline DeejayDebi

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #23 on: November 17, 2009, 12:56:40 PM »
The 4 to 6 weeks would be fine for cheddars and other hard cheese but havarti is supposed to be moist and rindless.

Offline Sailor Con Queso

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #24 on: November 17, 2009, 02:06:27 PM »
I agree. My 4 to 6 weeks was for most cheeses. There are several cheeses that I air dry for just a couple of days and then vacuum bag. Havarti is definitely one of them.

I believe that Francois pointed out in another thread that he (and his company) often vacuum bag soon after pressing to get a rindless cheese. For us home cheesemakers, the rind can be a huge waste on a small wheel.

I am trying several different approaches. I have cheddar with natural rinds, cheddar that was bagged after aging 4-6 weeks, and cheddar that was vac bagged young. They are all still too young to compare, but my gut feeling is that the ones bagged young will be just as good (and no rind) in the 4 to 6 month range. A 2 year old Parmesan MIGHT be a different story.
A moldy Stilton is a thing of beauty. Yes, you eat the rind. - Ed
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Offline hydromojo

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #25 on: November 19, 2009, 05:08:15 AM »
My Havarti is turning translucent on the edges. Is this the rind forming ? made this on Sunday, today is day 4. I notice that the cheese is getting a little thicker in texture, almost rubbery, but with a lovely stringy nature on the inside. Not sure whether this will eventual develop into havarti as long as its edible at the end I'm ok.
Still no mould formation so guess I could hope that something comes of this  :)

Offline DeejayDebi

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #26 on: November 20, 2009, 12:23:53 AM »
Sounds like it is drying really fast. To little humidty. Havarti shouldn't really have a rind per se. It is a soft cheese.

Offline hydromojo

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #27 on: November 20, 2009, 04:10:16 AM »
Debi - thanks for the warning. What i've been doing for the last couple of days is keeping the lid of the container resting on the top, not closed - thats probably whats drying it out. If you say its low humidity, I will move it to a different part of the fridge with an accompanying container of water.

rahul

Offline DeejayDebi

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #28 on: November 20, 2009, 01:03:17 PM »
Hydro do you have a vacum sealer? I'd seal up that beauty before it dries out to much. Although not usually done on havarti even a rub with olive oil will help seal it some.

Offline John (CH)

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Re: John's Cheese #049 - Havarti #3, Dill Flavoured
« Reply #29 on: November 21, 2009, 08:29:02 AM »
John - in pic#24, your cheese looks quite dry after the immersion in the brine. did you dry this out before taking the photograph ? I followed your instructions for the steps before this but could only use weights till about 16lbs. Did this for 6hrs, flipping the cheese initially every 30mts for the first 2 hours. How dry does it have to be before I put it in the brine ?

Rahul, sorry for being absent from this thread, sounds like you've gotten some great advice. On your questions above:
1) No, I didn't use cloth or paper towel to dry it but it may have been a couple hours after removing from brine that I took that picture.
2) My Havarti is too firm, low moisture content, I think I will use less weights like you next time.
3) How dry before brining? Good question, hard to describe, not very, you are not trying to press all the moisture out of the cheese. You can in futire dehydrate your cheese during aging as sounds like you have done.

Also, I agree that store bought Havarti's are rindless, to be authentic I think you do have to vacuum bag, I just wanted a natural rind. Next time once reasonably dry I will oil the rind to get a humidity and mold barrier as otherwise long term aging will cause a thick rind, especially if small cheese like Sailor says.

Good to hear yours is working out ;D!