Author Topic: Discussion of Refrigerators  (Read 14125 times)

Offline humble_servant7

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Discussion of Refrigerators
« on: December 06, 2009, 06:16:56 PM »
Okay, so basically the gae plan has been boiled down to one type of refrigerator.

Based on past experiences, it has been noted that it is EXPRESSLY easier to RAISE humidity more so than it is to lower it.

Therefore we must have a fridge in our containment that harbors EXACTLY these traits.

The general assumption has been that an upright, forced-air, FROST-FREE refrigerator is the BEST type of refrigerant device to use.

My only question?

What does one look like? When shopping for fridges what are the common features one looks for?
anyone got any pictures?

So far the only distnguishing features of such a fridge is that

A) It must have a cooling fan somewhere (i believe)

and

B) The coils of the fridge must be on the outside, NOT the inside or running along the racks, correct?( can we get any pictures on that)

Anything else?
thank you for your time


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Offline Wayne Harris

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2009, 07:40:25 PM »
I think that is the standard now for most refrigerators.
I think it would actually be tougher now to find a new fridge with the condenser coils on this inside.
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Offline driekus

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2009, 08:10:14 PM »
Can I have some clarification of why having condensor coils on the inside is a bad idea.
I only ask because I purchased a wine cooler and it has a flat plate at the rear of the fridge which collects condensation (so I assume it is the coil). It holds temperature nicely 4-18C and holds humidity well. I was planning to use it as a cheese cave to age my cheeses.
 Sorry I do not mean to hijack your thread.

Offline John (CH)

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2009, 08:15:35 PM »
I agree with Wayne that most large full size fridges are now forced air, at least in North America.

I've just ordered a new small 4.5 ft3 GE Fridge (for USD130 with tax and shipping before 20% Bing cash back) which has freezer coils on inside and thus is not forced air.

My understanding is that forced air means very low humidity and tough to raise and that the old style I ordered should be easier to raise the humidity? Or am I wrong?

Offline driekus

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2009, 08:22:05 PM »
This is what I thought too John. Forced air fridges I thought were always very dry by there nature and difficult to raise the humidity of.


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Offline FarmerJD

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2009, 08:38:59 PM »
The challenge I have found is keeping the humidity down in my unit. When the coils are on the inside, every time the door opens more humidity is collected on the cold coils and this is eventually added to the air until it reaches 95-100 percent humidity. If the air in your house is reasonably dry I guess it might work but in my case it has been impossible to regulate. Always tacks out at 99. I am about to purchase a compact dehumidifier to see if I can take some of the water out with that but I won't be able to keep it at 85 without constant manipulation

Offline DeejayDebi

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2009, 08:47:31 PM »
My little ones are forced air and I use the fans to blow mositure around. I hang a cheese cloth in front of the fans and sprizt them with a spray bottle every few days. Works like a charm. I finally got rid of the bowl of water and salt.

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2009, 09:17:41 PM »
I have a 10 year old 18 cubic foot. I just keep a large turkey basting pan on the bottom shelf full of water. Have to refill it after about 3 days, but it keeps the humidity right around 80-85%. Drops like a rock when it runs out of water though.
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Offline John (CH)

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2009, 09:50:43 PM »
At least the one I've ordered has a catch tray for moisture below the small radiant freezer coils. I'll be using a Johnson Control external thermostat with it. Will let you know how it works out.

Farmer, not many fridges have radiant coils on the inside these days, what size/type of fridge do you have that you have such problems? I remember Carter and a couple others trying to use vertical freezers where cooling coils were shelves and yes they attracted condensation that dripped on cheeses below. I think everyone has given up on that style.

Debi, from the pictures I've seen of yours they have a small fan to circulate radiant cool air I think they do not have coils on the outside or underneath and a evaporation tray to externally collect condensation water like a full size fridge right? In which case natively they probably don't have super dehumidified dry air like a full size forced air fridge.

Offline FarmerJD

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #9 on: December 07, 2009, 08:26:21 AM »
You are right John. I did not realize there was a difference in how a fridge and a freezer unit worked when you put a thermostat on it and the coils are inside. I thought that the coils would do the same thing regardless. Mine is a freezer unit so just disregard my comments. By the way, do they make any larger fridge units that allow you to set humidity and temp (cost not being a factor)?


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Offline Wayne Harris

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #10 on: December 07, 2009, 10:50:54 AM »
The only humidity controls I have seen on a home 'fridge are the crisper drawers.  Those drawers essentially block the flow of dehumidifying air to those foodstuffs contained in them.

Or in my case, those drawers are a place to forget about food till they spoil.

:)
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Offline humble_servant7

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #11 on: December 07, 2009, 12:57:34 PM »
I agree with Wayne that most large full size fridges are now forced air, at least in North America.

I've just ordered a new small 4.5 ft3 GE Fridge (for USD130 with tax and shipping before 20% Bing cash back) which has freezer coils on inside and thus is not forced air.

My understanding is that forced air means very low humidity and tough to raise and that the old style I ordered should be easier to raise the humidity? Or am I wrong?


Yes, you are correct.

I thought the general consensus was a5round here that it was EASIER to RAISE humidity more than it is to lower it, therefore hence the buying of the fridge that starts with very dry air, and installing a humidifier in there to bring it up to the correct level, only when it reaches it peak to have the refrigerator come back on again and dry it to its proper level, and everything just keeps going in rotation.

I thought this is what everyone agreed upon as far as maintaining proper humidity..
If not and in case I missed it-- do you mind telling me what is the general consensus as of late?

Offline Wayne Harris

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #12 on: December 07, 2009, 02:59:51 PM »
I see your point.  I think we are getting a bit wrapped around our collective axles here.

I know of two basic types of fridges.  Those with cooling coils inside, and those with cooling coils outside the "box"
I have used both.  Basically, if the coils are inside the box, the coils act like cold pipes in the basement that drip with humidify. The coils are always adding humidity to the fridge, resulting in RH levels inside box to hover around 100%. It is tough to bring this down.  I have found this to be the case with a freezer.

If the coils are not visible, and a fan is used to move air around across the coils in the back, the coils typically allowed to shed the condensed water in a tray somewhere outside the "box".  This allows for a much dryer environment.


It the case of the latter, its easier to simply hang a damp towel, or a cookie sheet of water in the fridge to add back some humidity.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2009, 04:31:20 PM by Wayne Harris »
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Offline humble_servant7

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #13 on: December 07, 2009, 04:06:51 PM »
I see your point.  I think we are getting a bit wrapped around our collective axels here.

I know of two basic types of fridges.  Those with cooling coils inside, and those with cooling coils outside the "box"
I have used both.  Basically, if the coils are inside the box, the coils act like cold pipes in the basement that drip with humidiy. The coils are always adding humidity to the fridge, resulting in RH levels inside box to hover around 100%. It is tough to bring this down.  I have found this to be the case with a freezer.

If the coils are not visible, and a fan is used to move air around across the coils in the back, the coils typically allowed to shed the condensed water in a tray somewhere outside the "box".  This allows for a much dryer environment.


It the case of the latter, its easier to simply hang a damp towel, or a cookie sheet of water in the fridge to add back some humidity.

Cool. What is your current method, btw. If you dont mind me asking?

Offline Wayne Harris

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Re: Discussion of Refrigerators
« Reply #14 on: December 07, 2009, 04:32:43 PM »
I have a forced air fridge and i add to the RH with cookie sheets or wet towels.
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