Author Topic: Lipase - General Questions  (Read 8318 times)

Offline John (CH)

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Katy, Houston, Texas, USA
  • Posts: 4,069
  • Cheeses: 60
Lipase - General Questions
« on: July 24, 2008, 07:11:06 AM »
Some cheese making recipes call for Lipase and I've seen it listed as ingredients on several manufactured cheese products as Lipase or I think as just "enzymes". Thus 2 weeks ago I bought a 16 ounce/0.45 kg bag of Calf Lipase from DairyConnection.com, stuck it in the freezer, but have yet to use it.

I've just done some research on what Lipase is, why use it and where it comes from and built a webpage on it here. Very interesting stuff :o.

Many cheese making recipes do not include lipase but also do not say pasteurized (low natural lipase) or non-pasteurizd (high natural lipase) milk.

Few questions for those who are using it:
  • What type?
  • Where did you get it from?
  • Are you using it with pasteurized or non-pasteurized (raw) milk and what type of milk, (cow, goat etc)?
  • How much lipase are you using per volume of milk?
  • Do you use it in all your cheese making or just certain types of cheese?
  • How do you find the results compared to not using it?

Thanks in advance . . .


Guests, join the CheeseForum.org community to remove this ad.


Offline Tea

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,914
  • Cheeses: 27
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #1 on: July 24, 2008, 04:30:35 PM »
1.  Kid or lamb lipase  (Not sure will need to ckeck into)
2.  Cheeselinks
3.  I have used it in both pasturised and non pasturised milk. but only if the recipe calls for it's use and the footnote states that it only needs to be added if using cow or sheep, not with goat.
4.  1/4 tsp per 10ltr milk
5.  I have only used it in making fetta and pepato cheese
6.  I have only made them with, and they add an extra dimention to the flavour and smell of the cheese.  The smell of the lipase increases as it is left at room temp, and I think is wonderful.  I couldn't imagine making fetta without it as it wouldn't have that uniqueness of fetta, I think it would be bland.

Boy Cheese Head, 1lb of lipase???  I bought 40gr which isn't quite 1 1/2oz over a year ago, and I still am working my way through it.  You're in for some serious cheese making if your going to make an indent into that.
So what did you purchase it for to make?

« Last Edit: July 28, 2008, 08:07:49 PM by Tea »

Offline John (CH)

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Katy, Houston, Texas, USA
  • Posts: 4,069
  • Cheeses: 60
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2008, 05:08:45 PM »
Tea, thanks for the detailed reply. Good question, I think I got my amount incorrect :P!

It was USD16.50 and bought it here.

Offline reg

  • Mature Cheese
  • ****
  • Location: Niagara Falls Ontario Canada
  • Posts: 271
  • Cheeses: 4
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #3 on: July 27, 2008, 08:14:42 AM »
Hi Ch. the lipase i have ordered is Kid Goat, it came in a 25gr pack. the only cheese that i have used it in so far was the Manchego and i used 1/2t in a 4 gal batch. it came from Glengary Cheesemaking Supply. it smells wonderful no question about it. apparently used only on the stronger flavoured cheeses.

i did taste the cheese already but in my opinion it needed more time to ripen. will give more feedback after more aging

reg
reg

Offline Tea

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,914
  • Cheeses: 27
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2008, 04:47:46 PM »
Cheese Head, you might what to offer a co-op here and see if anyone is interested in buying a few 1 or 2oz containers off you.
Otherwise, you have a life time supply of the stuff.  Unless of course you are planning to go commercial with your cheese making.   :D


Guests, join the CheeseForum.org community to remove this ad.


Offline John (CH)

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Katy, Houston, Texas, USA
  • Posts: 4,069
  • Cheeses: 60
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2008, 05:26:41 PM »
Oh well, my misjudging the amount I needed cost me an extra USD11, wish my other mistakes were that cheap >:(;).

Offline Likesspace

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Southern Illinois
  • Posts: 773
  • Cheeses: 20
    • Middleton Street Weather
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #6 on: December 31, 2008, 10:04:48 PM »
I use both kid and calf lipase.
The kid lipase I use in my provolones and the calf in my mozzarella. The calf is somewhat milder than the kid but still has a very powerful flavor if over used.
For a two gallon batch of Provolone I will use about a half tsp. This adds a very distinct and fairly strong flavor to the cheese. With Mozza I use about the same amount but the flavor is not as strong as with the kid lipase.
Again, this is powerful stuff that you either like or don't like. I would start out trying a 1/4 - 1/2 tsp. to see if the taste is agreeable to your liking. I've found that it's barely detectable by using a 1/4 tsp. in two gallons but very flavorful when using a1/2 tsp. I know that doesn't make a lot of sense, but it's what I've found to be the case.
I've yet to make a fetta (not one of my favorite cheeses) but I've read that you simply can't do this recipe correctly without the addition of lipase.
I know this is an old thread but thought I'd go ahead and put in my two cents anyway.
Hope this information helps someone out.

Dave

Offline John (CH)

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Katy, Houston, Texas, USA
  • Posts: 4,069
  • Cheeses: 60
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #7 on: December 31, 2008, 10:09:49 PM »
Yep, helps me as I have yet to open my 16 ounce / 0.45 kg bag of the stuff, guess I have a life time supply, thanks.

Offline Tea

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,914
  • Cheeses: 27
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #8 on: January 01, 2009, 02:05:44 PM »
Well as I am about to make provolone today, so I too will be using lipase. 
Likesspace, I am interested that you add it to mozz.  My recipe doesn't have that addition, but as I am like the lipase flavour, I might just give that a try when I make my next batch.
There are a number of fetta recipes here that you can try.  If would have to be one of the most used cheeses in out house hold.  Salads mostly, but I have a couple of the recipes that I use posted on the board here if you are interested in checking them out.

Offline John (CH)

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Katy, Houston, Texas, USA
  • Posts: 4,069
  • Cheeses: 60
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #9 on: January 01, 2009, 03:02:29 PM »
Tea, I finally cut open my 16 ounce (life time supply) bag today as I'm making Feta. After meauring weight on my new mini digital scale, I just tapped it onto the milk and then whisked in. Was that good or do you normally dilute it first in 1/2 cup water?


Guests, join the CheeseForum.org community to remove this ad.


Offline Tea

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,914
  • Cheeses: 27
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #10 on: January 01, 2009, 03:16:30 PM »
I usually dilute in water first, but I did one time dump it in undiluted with out thinking, and it still turned out fine.
Fetta ... this I gotta see.  Finally  ;D
So which recipe are you using?

Offline John (CH)

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Katy, Houston, Texas, USA
  • Posts: 4,069
  • Cheeses: 60
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #11 on: July 27, 2009, 06:35:34 PM »
Very experienced fellow forum member Francoise made this post in another thread:
Quote
Lipase requires time for lipolysis so adding it to fresh cheese is pointless.

That got me to thinking exactly how does Lipase work? It definitely gives cheese flavour, but not directly, ie it's not a flavorant, rather I understand it develops cheese's flavor, but how? I looked up Lipolysis on Wikipedia, which says that it is "the breakdown of fat stored in fat cells . . . during this process, free fatty acids are released" and then it gets too biologically technical for me. I've just read some of "American Farmstead Cheese" which says that "lipase enzymes preferentially attack vulnerable triglycerides and preferentially snip off the short-chain fatty acids converting them into free fatty acids . . . which have powerful flavors and aromas", which gives me some help.

Initial questions are:
  • How does Lipase work in adding flavor?
  • Why will it not work for fresh cheeses but is required for cow or sheep's milk Feta, is it because Feta can be eaten fresh but is better after aging 2-4 weeks which presumably gives time for the Lipase to do it's work?
  • Should you add it directly to milk or to water first and let stand for 20 minutes before adding to milk (I've seen it both ways) and why?
  • When should you add it in the cheese making process, ie when add starter culture or when add rennet?
  • When to use different types of Lipase?
  • Any other advice/information/rules-of-thumb appreciated, especially if it's in more laymans terms?

Thanks in advance . . . John.

Offline PeterNZ

  • Medium Cheese
  • ***
  • Location: Kaitaia, New Zealand
  • Posts: 47
  • Cheeses: 2
  • Living the self-sufficient lifestyle
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #12 on: July 28, 2009, 06:51:33 PM »
Should/Can Lipase be stored in the freezer? The label on the pack says Keep in the fridge! Why do you store yours in the freezer?

Cheers

Peter
Beauty is in the eye of the beer holder

Offline John (CH)

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Katy, Houston, Texas, USA
  • Posts: 4,069
  • Cheeses: 60
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #13 on: July 28, 2009, 07:40:19 PM »
Peter, I store my powdered Lipase along with cultures in the freezer on the hope that I will get longer shelf life out of it and as that's what my supplier advised. But good question!

Rhodia's dry powdered rennet guide here also says will last 6 months if stored frozen.

But Kiwi Renco's powdered [url-http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,1761.msg13242.html#msg13242]rennet guide here[/url] says to store just above freezing, ie in fridge. Their liquid rennet guide here says same thing, fair enough as liquid. Note, someone else here posted on this company saying that they will ship small quantities direct, presumably within NZ.

BioRen's guide here says do not freeze, but it's a liquid.

Cargill's guide here says do not freeze but I think it's packages as liquid as containers are in gallons.

Is your a liquid or powder and which manufacturer?

Offline PeterNZ

  • Medium Cheese
  • ***
  • Location: Kaitaia, New Zealand
  • Posts: 47
  • Cheeses: 2
  • Living the self-sufficient lifestyle
Re: Lipase - General Questions
« Reply #14 on: July 29, 2009, 05:56:32 PM »
Ours is powdered and from Chr. Hansen. They say on the label "Refrigerate 3 deg C - 8 deg C". I am just curious because there could be a risk that freezing it could have an impact on it!

RENCO is not selling smaller quantities of their rennet as far as I am aware. They are happy to tell you where you can buy it. It is also available in some (most?) supermarkets here.

Cheers

Peter
Beauty is in the eye of the beer holder