Author Topic: Sal's Gouda No 2  (Read 3747 times)

Offline SalMac

  • Mature Cheese
  • ****
  • Posts: 129
  • Cheeses: 3
Re: Sal's Gouda No 2
« Reply #15 on: August 22, 2008, 05:04:01 PM »
521g, first gouda was 450g so in following the recipe better we got a better yield.


Guests, join the CheeseForum.org community to remove this ad.


Offline Wayne Harris

  • Wine and Cheesemaker
  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Cleveland, Ohio
  • Posts: 1,937
  • Cheeses: 53
  • Wayne Harris
Re: Sal's Gouda No 2
« Reply #16 on: November 12, 2008, 10:04:51 AM »
Salmac,
I am interested in understanding how to properly press cheese.  I am reading your post, and you indicate you are applying 40lbs of pressure. 

I see two water bottles on top of your cheese.
Assuming these are at most 2 gallon jugs, this will yield 4X8lbs=32lbs of wieght.

Now, if you divide that by the surface area of your cheese, you will get your pressure that is actually being applied to your cheese. 

So, assuming a 4 inch wheel, and 32lbs of weight, this gives you about 2.5PSI


If you were going to make a 6 inch wheel, or a 10 inch wheel, would you increase your wieght to maintain the 2.5PSI?

Do other folks care about PSI?
Wayne A. Harris - in vino veritas

Offline SalMac

  • Mature Cheese
  • ****
  • Posts: 129
  • Cheeses: 3
Re: Sal's Gouda No 2
« Reply #17 on: November 12, 2008, 01:57:50 PM »
That Wayne is a class question.

Actually its 4 X 5 litre bottles. So 20L which is 20kg or near 40-45 lbs which is what it says in the book, however common sense would suggest it is indeed pressure that counts not weight per se.

Yes I would say you do need to monitor the psi but dont have any idea of the metric, I'll let you know if I find anything.

At the metrics I use for the small gouda the cheeses work well.

Best of luck

Sal
« Last Edit: November 12, 2008, 02:05:40 PM by SalMac »

Offline SalMac

  • Mature Cheese
  • ****
  • Posts: 129
  • Cheeses: 3
Re: Sal's Gouda No 2
« Reply #18 on: November 12, 2008, 02:09:41 PM »
Wayne

To make a 5lb cheese approximately 5X the small gouda, one of the experts on another site says use 75lb of weight, so there probably is a relationship, it didnt unfortunately mention the size of the mold but my guess is it would be 10-12 inchs.

Sal

Offline Tea

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,914
  • Cheeses: 27
Re: Sal's Gouda No 2
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2008, 02:56:18 PM »
Hi Wayne, I have to admit that I don't worry about PSI when pressing, I usualy just use what ever weight is recommended for the cheese.
This has been interesting though, and I would think would be important if we were wanting to create the same cheese we had mastered, but is a much bigger wheel.  I am going to keep looking into this, and see what I find.


Guests, join the CheeseForum.org community to remove this ad.


Offline SalMac

  • Mature Cheese
  • ****
  • Posts: 129
  • Cheeses: 3
Re: Sal's Gouda No 2
« Reply #20 on: November 15, 2008, 08:15:26 AM »
I knew I'd seen something somewhere.

Please see the following from a cheese book I've got

"The pressure of a large commercial cheese press is normally expressed in kN/m squared Kilo Newtons /square metre where 6.89kN/m square=1lb force per square inch.

The area referred to is the surface area of the top of the cheese.

The amount of force applied varies directly with the overall weight of the cheese. A cheese with the same surface area but twice the weight of another would require twice the force applied.

A small cheese with 50lb exerted on the top surface area of 21.7sq in (Wheeler) would experience a force of 2.3 lb/sq.in or 16 kN/M sq"


Using an online tool it tells me the gouda I make which is an approximately 5 inch diameter cheese has a 20 square inchs surface area of the top of the cylinder. For this a 500g cheese it is approx about 4 inchs tall.

Hope this helps. I'm not quite sure I completely understand this explanation.....<scratches head> or more importantly how to work out what weight would be required on say a 10 inch diameter cheese which is 80 sq inches surface area and a weight of 2.5 kg and again 4 inchs in height.

Answers on a postcard please....

Sal

« Last Edit: November 15, 2008, 08:40:51 AM by SalMac »

Offline Wayne Harris

  • Wine and Cheesemaker
  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Cleveland, Ohio
  • Posts: 1,937
  • Cheeses: 53
  • Wayne Harris
Re: Sal's Gouda No 2
« Reply #21 on: November 15, 2008, 07:27:02 PM »
Thank you for the response.  I am getting wildly differing points of view on this topic.

But there seems to be a consenses around the 2-5 PSI range of pressure.  Not the 25-40PSI ranges that I have also seen.

I am also seeing some evidence in my own cheesemaking that backs up your statement about cheese of the same diameter that weighs more, needing more weight. 

I am beginning to thinking that my 10 gallon batches need more PSI than than my 2 gallon batches. Even using the same diameter mould.

The other sense that i am getting is this.  Noting all the other extremely technical details that are well documents such as acid, pH, cultures, temperatures, it is odd that there are some, really simple details like psi are that are vague.

I am beginning to think that certain details around cheese making are kept vague for a reason. 

Trade secrets.

Am I alone in this suspicion?

Wayne A. Harris - in vino veritas

Offline John (CH)

  • Old Cheese
  • *****
  • Location: Katy, Houston, Texas, USA
  • Posts: 4,070
  • Cheeses: 60
Re: Sal's Gouda No 2
« Reply #22 on: November 16, 2008, 06:11:17 AM »
Yep all manufacturers want to protect their methosdology and ingerdients, guess that goes back through the artisan craft guilds a couple thousand years. Someone on this forum posted that they were looking for a Jarlsberg recipe, I hunted all over the web, nothing, a secret I guess.

Basically I think other than the mass manufactures where it is a science, for most, cheese making is an art, that frankly is tougher to repeatedly do on small home cheese making scale, due to all the variables, thus the interest in this forum.

The good news is that some of us are inventing some new cheeses ;D.