Author Topic: Aging Raw Milk Cheeses & Discussion On US Law's On Selling & Stabilized/Frozen Manufactured Cheese  (Read 9973 times)

FRANCOIS

  • Guest
I don't know that cheese but I have a personal interest in long life cams and shipment arangements.  I wonder if it's UF'd and shipped frozen.  90 days is incredible for a stabilized cam.

Sailor Con Queso

  • Guest
What is a "stabilized" cam? What is it that is stable?

linuxboy

  • Guest
I don't know that cheese but I have a personal interest in long life cams and shipment arangements.  I wonder if it's UF'd and shipped frozen.  90 days is incredible for a stabilized cam.

Francois, it didn't have that disgusting-ness of a stabilized cheese. It actually wasn't bad. Not fantastic, but not like the crap they call cam or brie here in the US. The mold didn't seem like p candidum only. And from what I understand they spray, wait just long enough to get a full bloom, then wrap and cold crash it and get it to a port for shipping. No clue if it's UF or what, or my source may be completely wrong because it was a marketing type person, so I couldn't get straight answers about their technical approach. I was also fascinated because I'm fascinated with the technical challenge. I tried asking the Whole Foods fromagers today when I went in, but of course they couldn't give me straight answers either.

iratherfly

  • Guest
I actually find their fromagiers here to be extremely knowledgeable and with wide palates. Most of them go to some university and are in the process of learning to make cheese or some other artisanal food. Too bad for tour whole foods. Write them. I have seen a similar rindless Camembert this evening at Fairway, another NYC famous store with large cheese department.

As I understand from Francois's past explanations, a stabilized camembert or brie goes through a chemical and/or radiation treatment where its bacterial development is largely halted so that its shelf life extends. This is a good trick to get a raw milk cheese that should be ready in 20-30 days to the US after day 60 where it is still in good condition. Unfortunately these stabilized cheeses are somewhat lackluster and are missing character and aroma. They are not great.

FRANCOIS

  • Guest
Another option that some manufacturers use is shipping cheese naked and frozen.  It is then thawed and allowed to ripen in cool stores before shipment.

To be clear retorted cheeses are technically not "stabilized".  "Stabilized" refers to the recipe which uses thermophilic in part or whole as a starter and a cooking step.  This yields a cheese after make with a final pH and requires no ripening.  They are good to go at 11 day maturity.  If properly done by a caring cheesemaker than can be pretty good.  If spat out by a large factory they can be incredibly bad.  These cheeses are typically wrapped at 11-13 days and put right into chilled storage.

In any case, stabilized or not, 90 days is maximum for cam under perfect shipment and storage conditions in my experience.  Reality is more like 65-70  days.

linuxboy

  • Guest
What is a "stabilized" cam? What is it that is stable?

You use more mold culture to inoculate the milk (like 8 U per 1000 liters), and substitute a S thermophilus for the traditional L Lactis. End result is faster initial pH drop, but then it stops and never gets to that 4.6-4.8 level. Also the substitution results in a lot less proteolysis because the S thermophilus doesn't have the same level of cell proteases as a traditional meso cocci. This is for a theoretical stabilized cheese using original ideas that were developed in the industry before newer UF processes came about. The lower end cheeses are most often UFed now, and then use a similar stabilized approach.

So you get less food for the mold, use a high enough mold population that it starts growing and gives enough enzymes to break down the cheese and produce a rind, but that's it.

Also, Francois, I found out more about what Herve does. He uses prime quality Normandy milk and a traditional approach modified to have higher final calcium and lower final moisture. So higher cut pH, and to get the moisture down, the curd is pre-cut to drain some of it, then scooped instead of ladled like it would be traditionally. Rest is the same. Makes the paste more stable, and it matures in the containers while it ships over the ocean.