Author Topic: Ph in all it's glory  (Read 13096 times)

wharris

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Re: Ph in all it's glory
« Reply #30 on: February 10, 2009, 02:25:17 PM »
Good Article.  I agree with Carter however in that you exceeded the words/pictures ratio...
;)

I thought the "pH Versus Titratable Acidity" section was an exceptionally good read and it clarified my own thoughts on the topic.  I might even recommend that this article make it to the library.  Its a good reference.  Perhaps Dave has a link?

The table at the bottom of your post was very interesting and I wonder where you got it.

A couple of points:
  • I noticed your chart indicates a pH for cheddar at pH 5.3-5.4
  • Carters weeping wheel of cheddar that was also crumbly has a pH of pH4.8
  • Peter Dixon's cheddar site recommends cheddar that has a final pH of 5.1
  • I read that dry, crumbly, hard cheddar is due, in part, to excess acid.

My conclusion:
I will try harder to ensure that my Cheddar's pH never fall below 5.1.

A while back there was a thread about needing a pH meter.
An analogy for its use might be this:  If asked to drive a car at 30mph and stop at a stop sign exactly 1 mile ahead, one could use a speedometer and stopwatch.  Theoretically, if you were very careful with the gas pedal and stopwatch, you could stop at the stop sign, or be pretty close. 
I would prefer to see the stopsign.

Likesspace

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Re: Ph in all it's glory
« Reply #31 on: February 11, 2009, 02:37:24 AM »
Wayne...
Good post.
I'm looking forward to getting my PH meter and starting to play around with it.
As I've posted previously I've been fairly happy with my results but I really want to make great cheese, not just cheese that is acceptable.
I don't know that I will ever understand the information that I posted but at least I have some numbers to focus on (the numbers in the chart at the end of the post).
If nothing else, it will be fun playing with the meter.

Dave

Offline Cartierusm

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Re: Ph in all it's glory
« Reply #32 on: February 11, 2009, 06:25:02 AM »
It's not all the that hard to understand it just needs to be explained in plain terms, check out this website, just skip over the chemisty section. Dave first thing get a small clear plastic cup, the ones you buy for refill for bathroom cups, the little one the dentist give you. Then see where the fill line on the PH meter is then mark that on the cup. The point is you want to get the smallest sample so as to not waste milk. This means do not put the PH meter directly in your milk, always take a sample and then throw the sample away. I've been using the same cup for years, just rinse it everytime, as you'll be taking about 5-8 samples per batch. Just make sure to rinse the PH meter in distilled water after taking a milk reading. Just have a glass of distilled water by and just dunk and swirl, then take your milk reading, then rinse in TAP water before putting the cap on. You don't want to store it with distilled water. Inside the cap will be about 1/8 - 1/4 tsp. of liquid to keep the probe moist. If you didn't buy storage solution just use tap water and recalibrate every few months.

makkonen

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Re: Ph in all it's glory
« Reply #33 on: March 10, 2009, 11:37:11 PM »
OK, this thread has got some great info on pH and TA (though I still have trouble seeing what better information titratable acidity is giving, and where it can actually be substituted for/supplemented with pH for better results).

For my contribution, I haven't seen this site posted here, but if you have the time, it's worth reading through his five page manifesto on acidity control. If you don't understand why it's important, it'll explain it. I know it started to rearrange my perspective on how the whole cheesemaking process progresses. Most all of the information there can probably also be found here, but it's nice reading one person's full description of why it all matters, start to finish:

http://www.isleofmullcheese.co.uk/jalldridge/jaindex.htm

wharris

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Re: Ph in all it's glory
« Reply #34 on: March 11, 2009, 12:43:32 AM »
I am half-way done reading this.  This is a great post and a great contribution to the discusion.
Fantasic post.  Cheese for you.

Thank you.

Cheese Head

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Re: Ph in all it's glory
« Reply #35 on: March 11, 2009, 12:59:14 AM »
Echo Wayne, thanks makkonen, FWIW I've linked that website and emailed the owner James(?) and told him loinked and invited him to join our forum, hope he shows up ;D.

homeacremom

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Re: Ph in all it's glory
« Reply #36 on: March 11, 2009, 02:02:40 AM »
This is exactly the type of info I have been looking for. Thank-you!

Likesspace

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Re: Ph in all it's glory
« Reply #37 on: March 11, 2009, 02:38:58 AM »
Makkonan.....
I'm only on page 2 of the acidity information but this is also just what I have been looking for.
Great find and like Wayne said....deserving of another cheese.
Thanks so much for this information.
Now you have a REALLY tough row to hoe, in finding something else that amazes us.  ;D
Thanks again....I really do appreciate this info.

Dave

Cheese Head

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Re: Ph in all it's glory
« Reply #38 on: March 11, 2009, 07:58:41 AM »
Thanks again to makkonen finding this obscure information, when I first clicked I was visitor #129!

As this is great info and several of the links fail and some of the webpages are missing and thus I'm worried about it's loss, and as the author says free to copy, I have just downloaded the pages and posted them in our Library.

Also, the email link to James failed, I have retried through the webstore's email.

makkonen

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Re: Ph in all it's glory
« Reply #39 on: March 11, 2009, 08:59:26 AM »
Thanks for all the accolades. I'm glad everyone is getting as much out of it as I did. I may not be that skilled at turning out cheese, but I'm pretty confident in my skills for rooting out good stuff on the internet.

Credit where it's due -- I saw a link to the old version of the site on the Yahoo! Groups Artisan Cheesemaker list (not a lot of traffic, but good info in the old posts, if you can get past the annoying yahoo groups formatting). http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Artisan_Cheesemakers/

The old site linked there had gone down, but some good luck with archive.org and google unearthed some buried treasure.

Dave, a tough row to hoe indeed. Oh well, I'll just have to accept it, it's all downhill from here. From helping to educate everyone, to asking 100 times "Why is my mozzarella a sloppy, grainy mess again?!" ;D

Likesspace

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Re: Ph in all it's glory
« Reply #40 on: March 12, 2009, 12:53:23 AM »
LOL@Makkonen....
All I can say is not to worry about questions concerning your Mozzarella.
They will fit right in with my questions about Gouda, and Cheddar and Stilton and Swiss and Camembert and............
I honestly believe that if I continue to make cheese for the next 40 years, (hopefully I'll live that long and still be lucid), I will still have questions concerning the process.
Honestly this is one of the many things that attracts me to this hobby.

Dave