Author Topic: Substituting Salt! Now there's a serious challenge for ya'!  (Read 2098 times)

Offline FRANCOIS

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Re: Substituting Salt! Now there's a serious challenge for ya'!
« Reply #15 on: November 08, 2010, 06:53:39 PM »
I conquer, microbrews are a yeast bomb.  I have tried all sorts of prcoessing methods to get around it.  You get the same issue with any sort of wet, raw organics...for example packing wheels in grape pressings.  With nothing to control yeasts it gets bad fast.


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Offline MrsMarbles

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Re: Substituting Salt! Now there's a serious challenge for ya'!
« Reply #16 on: November 09, 2010, 11:36:51 AM »
I apologize if this is a silly question, but would the addition of higher alcohol % control the yeasts?  Would bourbon & beer work, or brandy & mead/wine?  I'm thinking like a marc & brine wash, but without the brine, and diluted with something alive but flavorful.  Sorry, if this is way off the, er, mark.

Offline linuxboy

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Re: Substituting Salt! Now there's a serious challenge for ya'!
« Reply #17 on: November 09, 2010, 02:41:35 PM »
Kind of. Alcohol will evaporate quickly, but the sugars will remain. And it takes 18% alcohol to kill off yeast, even then some usually survives... depends on the strains. So with the residual yeast and the surface sugar, it's easy for them to take off quickly. It will help, though. You have to try and see; it depends on the beer and how you do it.
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Offline MrsMarbles

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Re: Substituting Salt! Now there's a serious challenge for ya'!
« Reply #18 on: November 09, 2010, 03:47:17 PM »
I was thinking about trying it with mead first, since my fridge is full of (crash cooled & decanted) samples that I save from re-racking.  But I guess I would have to be sure to use a non-stabilized mead, since the potassium sorbate would probably be unhealthy for the cheese molds and bacteria.  I don't usually use campden.  Maybe a dry traditional mead would work.  I think D47 yeast is only tolerant to ~14% alcohol.  Worth a try anyway -- next week's cheese.

Another idea -- I covered two out of four of Saturday's Camemberts with ash, after reading the wacheese Annette recipe.  Would unsweetened cocoa powder have a similar effect, and would the mold grow through it?  I think cocoa powders come in a range of pH.  (Sorry if I'm now REALLY way out there)

Offline linuxboy

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Re: Substituting Salt! Now there's a serious challenge for ya'!
« Reply #19 on: November 09, 2010, 04:26:53 PM »
Sorbate inhibits growth/reproduction, not the best thing to use for a cheese. A dry mead should work.

Cocoa has some antibacterial properties, so I'm not sure. I've never tried it, don't know first hand. If you try it, let us know :).
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Offline iratherfly

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Re: Substituting Salt! Now there's a serious challenge for ya'!
« Reply #20 on: November 11, 2010, 03:41:58 AM »
Sorry for not responding to everyone for a few days, was out working. Whoa.

Okay, how did this become a conversation about beer?
Sure, I can wash with beer, marc, grappa, calvados - without the brine part, but it puts me back where I've started; still needing a salt alternative! The Brandy or Rum direction would work well with this type of cacao.

MrsMarbles, I am using cacao powder in this recipe like ash! (at least in 2 of my test subjects to see how it works). There will also be a line going through the center.

Linuxboy, thanks so much, I am going to try your formula. Magnesium however... oh boy.  I thought if we are only trying to grow yeast than we can just use a KL71, can't we? then I can brandy wash and the sugar would probably enough to feed it. I am not worried about growing and controlling yeast. I am more worried about growing basic PC and Geo.

Offline linuxboy

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Re: Substituting Salt! Now there's a serious challenge for ya'!
« Reply #21 on: November 11, 2010, 09:51:05 AM »
The MgSO4 7H20 is not for the yeast. I mean it is, but not exclusively. It's a not only but also situation. You're giving molds the right ratio of C, N, and P with that blend, along with some other nutritional factors.

If you look at the food mix I wrote for you, it's intended primarily for molds because it is a classic potato-dextrose mix, but will also support some yeast propagation. For yeast, you typically need a faster nitrogen source, like DAP or MAP. PC will grow fine on potato-dextrose in small-scale lab conditions.

The beer discussion to me was just in the context of knocking down mold as a flavoring before serving.

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