Author Topic: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?  (Read 6624 times)

dime0000

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Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« on: December 28, 2008, 09:05:40 PM »
Question - the cheap 1G jugs of milk at the grocery store say "pasteurized". Am I correct to assume that if they were "ultra-pasteurized" (as opposed to regular), they would say so?


Tea

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Re: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2008, 09:08:20 PM »
Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought that the ultra pasturised was the UHT stuff?

dime0000

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Re: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« Reply #2 on: December 28, 2008, 09:10:30 PM »
yep - you are correct. i think they're on in the same.

Tea

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Re: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2008, 09:18:58 PM »
So did that answer your question?

Likesspace

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Re: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« Reply #4 on: December 28, 2008, 09:54:03 PM »
Hi Dime...
It's been my experience that ultra pasteurized milk doesn't always say ultra pasteurized. You really won't know until you give it a try because there is no law (at least in the United States) that says the milk has to be labled as such.
Also, there is a huge difference between pasteurization methods used.
I spoke to a man that runs a commerical dairy about a week ago and here's some information he gave me.
According to this man (very nice and helpful btw) pasteurization occurs when milk is heated at a minimum of 162 degrees F for at least 30 minutes.
It can also take place at increasingly higher temperatures for accordingly shorter amounts of time.
UHT, or ultra pasterurzied milk is super heated to over 280 degrees F for about two seconds while other methods might use only 250 degrees for 3 seconds. Either way, this process completely destroys the milk as far as cheese making goes.
The milk that I have recently switched to comes from the dairy that I spoke to concerning the pasteurization process...
They heat their milk to 186 degrees F for about 10 seconds which although not perfect for cheese, the process doesn't completely destroy the milk.
According to the man I spoke with, anything over about 171 degrees does damage the milk (as far as cheese making is concerned) but he also said they used to produce cheese at this dairy using the exact same milk.
Well I tried some of this milk over the weekend and the curd did set up better than anything I've tried to date.
With all of the store bought milk I've used, I have had success but right away I could tell that this milk was different.
One thing that I think is interesting is that this milk comes from a prison owned dairy in Chester, Illinois and the reason that I decided to give it a try for cheese is because it is by far the best milk I've ever tasted.
They bottle their milk in half gallon glass bottles and the taste is out of this world. I'm really looking forward to seeing how my first Stilton tastes using this product.
I guess the only thing you can do is give different brands a try and see how they turn out. If a good pasteurization method is used, it should turn out a nice final product.
If you have trouble with your curd forming or if you get a really soft curd that falls apart upon stirring, this is a product to avoid in the future.
Our most popular brand (in my area) is prairie farms milk. Growing up, this was about the only thing you could even buy. Even though it is a tasty enough milk, it is not good for cheesemaking. You get a curd, but it is so soft that it is really tough to keep a curd throughout the stirring and cooking phases.
Hope this information helps.
Dave

Cheese Head

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Re: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« Reply #5 on: December 28, 2008, 10:13:44 PM »
dime0000, the only milk I've used to date here in Houston is standard supermarket 1 Us gallon plastic jugs of pasteurized homogenized whole cow's milk, works fine. My first few batches I had no CaCl2 so I found I needed a little more rennet, otherwise fine.

I have used same but 2% once, less yield, amount of curds of course and I think it was a little tougher to get a firm curd.

Offline Cartierusm

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Re: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« Reply #6 on: December 29, 2008, 08:18:48 AM »
I do believe that it would be labeled as ultra if it is, maybe. Most ultra you find is going to be cream. Jug milk is not usually ultra, the point of ultra is to make it have a longer shelf life, a month or more, so they don't waste the process on cheap jug milk, also check the expiration date if it's only a week or so away then it's not Ultra. Ultra can come in foil lined boxes on the regular shelf, as I said it has an extremely long shelf life. The ultra process has no value as milk whatsoever, you might as well drink water, there are no protein, vitamins, minerals or anything else left in it after the ultra process.

Cheese Head

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Re: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« Reply #7 on: December 29, 2008, 01:06:53 PM »
FYI, there was another previous discussion on Pasteurization, Ultra-Pasteurization, & UHT with a link to definitions on an International Dairy website.

As Cartier said, my understanding is that regular cheap 1 US gallon jug milk here in USA is just regular pasteurized, but I have noticed that some of the organic mik is labelled Ultra-Pasteurized, and thus deader, presumably as it takes longer to move off the shelves (kindof negates part of the point of buying organic).

dime0000

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Re: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« Reply #8 on: December 29, 2008, 02:52:55 PM »
thanks for all the great info! I guess I'll start off with the local generic brand (2 for $4), and work my way up the chain! :)


Cheese Head

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Re: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« Reply #9 on: December 29, 2008, 03:21:03 PM »
Sounds good, wow, standard 1 US gallon cow's milk here in Houston is USD3!

Offline Cartierusm

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Re: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« Reply #10 on: December 29, 2008, 04:03:33 PM »
Costco buddy, 2 gallons $4. Dime, don't be too eager to use raw fresh milk unless you can get it easily and cheap. It's best to do some test batched once you get good with both and do a taste test after 6 months of aging and see if you can tell the difference.

Tea

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Re: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« Reply #11 on: December 29, 2008, 08:01:08 PM »
You guys have to realise just how cheap things really are for you.  Here the 2ltr bottle of "good" milk that I use for cheese making is $5.40 to the general public.  As I buy in bulk I can get it for $4.80.
A standard 3ltr bottle of milk that I buy for the family can be between $4.50 and $5 depending on the brand.

Cheese Head

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Re: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« Reply #12 on: December 30, 2008, 01:47:27 AM »
Tea

Your AUD4.50-5 for 3 litres works out to say AUD1.70 per liter x 0.689 (yes AUD was almost 1 to 1 with USD last August) = USD1.17 / litre or USD4.45 / us Gallon.

Here in US we are paying USD2-3 per US gallon or USD0.53 to 0.79 per litre, so yes yours is almost twice as expensive.

Guess that's the price you pay for being in such a beautiful part of Australia!

Likesspace

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Re: Manufactured Milk - Different Pasteurization Methods?
« Reply #13 on: December 30, 2008, 02:22:43 AM »
Man guys, our milk (in Southern Illinois) got up to over $4.00 per gallon over the summer and is just now getting down into the $2.99 - $3.05 range. It would be great to be able to buy a good quality cheese making milk for $2.00.
Of course one thing that we've learned lately in the great state of Illinois: You can just GIVE away something that is VALUABLE. Our wonderful Governor gave us this lesson.
I really wish that Kentucky would annex the southern part of Illinois. (sigh)