Newbie wants gouda ...but needs to fix milk issues

[tananaBrian]

Hi,

  I finally succeeded at making 30-minute mozzarella (milk was the issue), and have now made several fresh cheeses successfully as well.  I want to move up to making a pressed cheese now.  The store-bought milk that I found that seems to work best around here is Lucerne.  The skim milk that I tried made the most beautiful curd that I've seen yet ...clean white curd, clear and slightly yellowish whey, clean break perfect.  But the Lucerne whole milk that I used for this weekend's french cream cheese didn't work as well.  The cream cheese turned out great, but the curd didn't.  The curd was firm and white at the top of the pot, nice clean break, but got softer towards the bottom of the pot and the bottom 1/3rd of the pot was plain mush.  Note that this recipe came from the 200 easy cheeses book and has 3 quarts of whole milk (the Lucerne one) to 1 quart of whipping cream (unfortunately ultra-pasteurized ...the only kind we can get here in Alaska).  I had some whole milk curd this same way before as well, and it did NOT have the cream added to it.  Here are my questions:

1. When the milk curds like this, would it have worked better if more rennet were used?  Note that I used 1/8th teaspoon CaCl in 1/4 c water per gallon of milk ...added to the milk when cold).  Seems like the curd firmed up at the top first and was working its way down?  The culture that I used was the mesophilic culture from New England Cheesemaking Supply ...not sure what the mix was (MMxxx)  The milk was in a covered pot, blanket on top, for 24 hours.

2. Would more CaCl have helped?

3. Would more time have helped?  Say 36 hours rather than 24?

Or ...is this milk not usable?

Thanks,
Brian

[Cheese Head]

Brian, cream cheese is a mostly lactic acid coagulated cheese, mostly as some people add a little rennet. You should get a very different soft curd that you normally do not cut compared to a stronger gel type curd with a rennet coagulated cheese that you cut. There's some info in the Wiki: Coagulation article.

I think your milk is fine.

[tananaBrian]

Yeah ...thanks.  I was just looking at the coagulation pictures in the link above, and the lactic acid coagulation is much more like what I typically see, but I think I was expecting the curd to look more like the rennet coagulation picture with a nice clean break.  The Fromage Blanc culture from New England Cheesemaking Supply has a little rennet in it, and the french cream cheese recipe that I followed this weekend asked for a little too, and both tend to have a clean break/firmer curd towards the top of the mass, and then like a gradient in density, become softer as you get closer to the bottom of the pot.  Sounds like this is what I should expect given that these cheeses are primarily lactic-acid cheeses (right???) with a little rennet added... or maybe I'm wrong on that.  Learning is good... hopefully I'm growing in the right directions...

Brian

[Cheese Head]

No problem, I initially set up my light cream cheese (American Neufchatel) batches with lots of rennet until I learnt more. The quality of the primarily lactic acid curd is really a function of pH and thus a function of amount of starter culture, temp, and time.

Those two lactic acid pictures are both my batches, one stuck to walls of stockpot and tore interior as shrunk, other pulled away from walls leaving a cylinder of whey around the outside (and a little underneath and on top). I've also had another batch which was pourable. Even the two with goods sets basically fell apart as I ladled into cloth bag. see better pictures here of light chocolate cream cheese batch.

Have fun, we are all still learning!

[tananaBrian]

No problem, I initially set up my light cream cheese (American Neufchatel) batches with lots of rennet until I learnt more. The quality of the primarily lactic acid curd is really a function of pH and thus a function of amount of starter culture, temp, and time.

Those two lactic acid pictures are both my batches, one stuck to walls of stockpot and tore interior as shrunk, other pulled away from walls leaving a cylinder of whey around the outside (and a little underneath and on top). I've also had another batch which was pourable. Even the two with goods sets basically fell apart as I ladled into cloth bag. see better pictures here of light chocolate cream cheese batch.

Have fun, we are all still learning!

John... Your feedback and links have been very helpful, and encouraging since my results have been much like yours.  I expected a curd that was white, solid to the bottom, etcetera like you see in pictures that illustrate a clean break.  The fresh cheeses that I've made from the softer more-lactic/less-rennet curds have produced cheese much smooooother ...like thickened sour cream.  We like it better that way.

Brian

[tananaBrian]

Brian, cream cheese is a mostly lactic acid coagulated cheese, mostly as some people add a little rennet. You should get a very different soft curd that you normally do not cut compared to a stronger gel type curd with a rennet coagulated cheese that you cut. There's some info in the Wiki: Coagulation article.

I think your milk is fine.

"Rennet coagulation is a two stage process involving an initial enzymatic phase during the first ~10 minutes where a chemical change is occurs as preparation for second non-enzymatic phase where the casein micelles start forming linked chains and eventually a full solid curd is formed, if enough calcium is present."

The above is from the wiki... and brings up a CaCl question.  I've had sets where the milk is nicely coagulated at the top of the curd (clean break), but is non-coagulated in the bottom third of the mass.  When you cut the curds, the bottom 3" of the curd knife comes out with milky stuff on it.  Does this imply that if I had used more CaCl, then the whole mass would have curded properly???

Brian