Goats Milk Cheese Failures - What am I doing wrong?

[Gouldie]

Hi Everyone

I am very new to this whole cheesemaking game - made my first camembert a bit over a week ago which is progressing well - I would call it a smash hit!   Also made some blue and another camembert which have gone according to plan so far - in particular with respect to the curds forming, being cut and stirred and hooped etc.

However, I've had 3 attempts at making goats milk cheese and all 3 have failed - the curds did not form - even after following the instructions as to temperature and additives and sitting/waiting time (around 24 hours) for the curds to set.

I'm trying to work out what I'm doing wrong.  Could it be that I'm not adding enough calcium chloride?  The milk I am using is bought from the supermarket (Coles) and is pasteurised.

The 3 recipes I've tried - 2 are from the 200 Easy Homemade Cheese Recipes book - Goats Brie and Pouligny-St-Pierre, and the 3rd is from Ricki Carroll's book - Saint Maure.

Interestingly - I visited a friend today and she had a recipe for Goat Brie, and the recipe does not call for cutting of the curd -- wait for it to set then ladle straight to the container - could this be an option, or is it a requirement??

Hoping to hear some sage advice who has had great success with their goat cheeses.

Gouldie

[smilingcalico]

That's standard for Brie. It's one of the few differences between Brie and Camembert.  When you do a lactic set curd, it's very delicate. You really don't want to cut it because it comes apart quite easily and you'll lose more of it.  I didn't have issues with my chevre, but we vat pasteurized it, so it's a bit more gentle on the milk than some other pasteurizing techniques.  See if you can find out what method they use, then search that method in the search box.

[Gouldie]

Hello Smilingcalico

Thanks for the prompt response.  I've just had another look at the recipes - for the brie it says to both cut and gently stir the curds - but for the other 2 there is no requirement the curds to be cut OR stirred - I think I did with those and that might be what wrecked them.

In a couple of weeks I'll be at my sister's far where she has a couple of nubian nannies in milk at the moment - perhaps it'll make a difference if I use fresh goats milk?

Gouldie

[tananaBrian]

It doesn't say "Ultrapasteurized" on the label does it?  I had similar problems with cow milk until I found the brand(s) that worked more consistently ...one of which is now no longer available.  I'm betting your fresh milk will work much better...

Brian

[Gouldie]

Brian

Thanks for the tip.  To be honest I didn't check the label to see if it was ultra-pasteurised - I'm not sure if they do ultra-pasteurise milk here in Australia.  I'll have another squizz next time I'm at Coles.

My goat milk cheesemaking is becoming expensive after 16 litres of milk at $4.50 a litre have been tossed - however I'm determined to solve the puzzle.

I've just found Francois's recipe for Crotin, so perhaps tomorrow I'll give that one a crack.

I'll be most pleased when it does work, that's for sure.  In the meantime I will keep reading the threads on here - there's such a wealth of information and experience - a fantastic resource!

[Tomer1]

At that cost of milk I think buying an artisan made brie will be cheaper

[Tea]

UHT milk is ultra heat treated, which is why it last so long, as everything has been nuked and killed off, so the end product is not good for cheese making.  There are a few that say that UHT milk can be used for cheesemaking, but for the most part, it is not good. 
I answered you PM, but to state again, the store bought goats milk that you are using, is not good for cheese making. 

[linuxboy]

UHT...is not good for cheese making. 

For rennet-coagulated curd. It should work OK for full lactic curd or mostly lactic curd.

[tananaBrian]

UHT...is not good for cheese making. 

For rennet-coagulated curd. It should work OK for full lactic curd or mostly lactic curd.

This has been my experience although even with lactic curd, the result is softer ...but I preferred the creamier, smoother, result in my fromage blanc and cream cheeses ...especially when making fat-free fromage blanc for us fatties that are on a diet.

Brian

[Randommate]

Hi Gouldie,

good to see a fellow Aust on here and I’ve done a few goatyberts recently based on a bert recipe taken from the Neil and Carole Willman cheese making book. Not sure if it’s the best book or not but it’s what I have.

Following this, I definitely found the curd set took longer than for cow milk but they definitely formed. I also cut and stirred the curd in my make and didn’t seem to find too many problems with it. And I didn’t use calcium chloride.

I have no access to raw milks so use the pasteurised, non-homogenised (better for curds) organic milk by Parmalat or Paul’s Goats milk also from Coles or Woolies but at $3-$4 / L you’re right it’s not cheap to stuff up.

I know from reading here (Sailor, linux and and Brie thanks!) and from experience that goat cheese definitely age more rapidly than cow milk cheeses but I have to say the biggest issue I had was the right affinage as I found at 5-6 weeks im still getting a chevre like centre to them, I’ve got another holding out for a few more weeks to test it at a longer ripening age of 8-9 weeks.

Heres a pic of the 6 week one that’s been left at room temperature before cutting tasted amazing and the chevre centre was nice but not consistent pate throughout. I’m thinking it’s to do with the PH as I hear acidity will cause these type of cheeses to be solid in the centre.

Who you get your supplies from?  I use cheeselinks.com.au who are happy to post things as I’m yet to find a local Sydney supplier.
Good luck with your next few.

[iratherfly]

Nice Randommate.  So many Australians here!

You don't need to age them *that* long, you can have it perfect all the way through by day 21-30 if you get the affinage perfected and at the right temperature.  The problem with aging at high temp is that it ammoniates the outside to a liquid before it has a chance to age the inside and the rind grows fast and thick which doesn't let moisture escape.  But you can work through it: If you have no choice but aging them in higher temperature, simply make up for it by cutting the curd smaller, let it drain a bit longer in the whey and ladle the curd slower so that it releases more whey before the next layer of curd is ladled. Then, let the cheese thoroughly dry in the room for 2-3 days before moving to an aging container.

The result would be a less moist cheese that ages in a far more controlled manner.  It will still be nice and gooey, but it won't spill out when you crack the cheese open. You can also reduce the geo slightly to get a thinner rind that lets more moisture escape before blocking it all with PC. (there are also strains of PC that grow slower and may give you even better results) Try it!