Beaufort Trials - Experimental Design. Input, Please

[arkc]

The classic breeds for Beaufort are the Tarentaise and Montbéliard.  As I'm sure you know, everything depends on individual cows, lactation period, feed methods, etc., but I've seen an average for Tarentaise of 3.6 fat and 3.35% protein, and for Montbéliard of 3.66 fat/3.23% protein.  Obviously, Jerseys are much higher, edging to 5% fat and 3.75% protein.


Since my Jersey milk is higher fat than the milk from the Beaufort area,
I need help.  If I use approx. 3/4 whole and 1/4 skim, I  can get close
to the fat content.  But I believe that this would also reduce the protein...

Should I use dry milk to fortify or just not worry about it?

annie

[ArnaudForestier]

Annie, personally, I wouldn't worry about it.  If you poke around, if you haven't already, you'll find how much I crave re-creating this, and other French alpine makes, in an authentic, traditional way.  I really have no other desire, in cheesemaking, than "capturing the ancients," and no pretense to improving on much.

I've had to learn a hard lesson, and that is, to either move to Jura, or shut up, and do my best with what I have.  I can't make Beaufort, reblochon, tomme, Mont D'Or; at least not where I am, with the materials - land, milk, indigenous and added flora - I have.  But I can learn tons by trying, and what I'm coming up with is pretty darn pleasurable.

So, I'd say, with your jersey, you've got a wonderful resource.  You can skim it back, and I'd warrant you'll come up with an extraordinary cheese.

[arkc]

Paul,

Thanks for your time.

Since I cook, A LOT, I use lots of Parmesan.  I have made it but didn't like the result.  I was told
that this was another case of protein/fat imbalance for the cheese.  I tried using skim milk, but from
what I read that was only part of the problem....As in Beaufort, just the fat and not the
protein needed to be reduced.  So once again, for another cheese, I would like to know
how to reduce fat and not protein.  Do you know how to do this.  If you do, I would certainly
be grateful if you could tell me how.

annie

[ArnaudForestier]

Annie, perhaps I need to say it another way.  Not only can we not make "Beaufort", living in the States, but even within Beaufort, there is variation.  The above stats for the Beaufort cattle breeds that I gave you are only averages; as I said, there is considerable variation, even for a single Tarentaise cow, depending on a whole host of conditions.  (For instance, I have a spreadsheet that I made, to estimate yearly need, based on estimations among 4 breeds' yield, protein and fat levels - the protein level I used on that spreadsheet is higher, for the two Beaufort animals).

In other words, I suggested, just go for it.  Skim some, and make the cheese.  Provided all other things are done reasonably well, I can't see why you won't end up with a product giving pleasure.

[arkc]

Paul,

Thanks for all your time.

annie

[ArnaudForestier]

Oh, not at all, annie.  I am only a beginner hoping to walk a long and rigorous path, and I've been helped immeasurably by many people here.  I hope the above gives you some help; anytime, ask away, and I'll do my best. 

Paul

[Sailor Con Queso]

Annie - one way to increase protein levels and not increase fat is to add some nonfat dry milk. I do this all the time with cheeses like Parmesans that need a lower fat content. In fact, I never use skim milk, even in Mozzarella and yogurt. I feel that by taking away the milk fat, you are also removing a lot of the flavor and "mouth feel". So, instead of using skim I use whole milk and add some NFD. That reduces the overall fat ratio, increases the proteins and decreases the calories per serving portion. I typically use 4 cups in 35 gallons of whole milk and have not had any off flavors.

You can also use NFD to help "repair" over processed store bought milk. This will usually give a better curd set.

[arkc]

Thanks Sailor.  Paul said I could just use the raw Jersey for the Beaufort. 

But I am sure that all my recipes for Parm call for lower fat/higher protein milk. 
I use a VERY high fat Jersey raw.  Do you think I should skim it a little and then
boost protein with the nonfat dry milk?

annie

[ArnaudForestier]

Thanks Sailor.  Paul said I could just use the raw Jersey for the Beaufort. 

annie, to be clear, what I was saying was that if you're trying to lock in a single "milk" that is the "Beaufort milk," it can't be done; even if using the two breeds used in making Beaufort, Tarentaise and Montbéliard, you'll find the milk is always going to be a moving target - and this ignores the fact the forage, climate, indigenous flora, etc., are entirely different, so unless living in Le Beaufortain, we'll never make true Beaufort.  But we will make extraordinary cheese, nonetheless.  So, I just suggested skimming some of the excess fat from the Jersey and going ahead.  Many do.

I wouldn't presume to speak for you, but I think I understand where you're coming from; if I've read you right, it's my tendency too, to hope for a kind of reductionist answer that will make for the perfect solution.  It's been hard for me to learn, and to accept, that in this art and science, it's the act of making hard choices among many, often cross-purpose, optima; compromises in one way or the other, to try and make the best possible product. 

Again, I don't mean to speak out of turn, or be presumptive; just rings a bell, what I'm seeing, and hope to offer some constructive thoughts. 

[arkc]

You read me right!!!

I've been called a perennial perfectionist, or if you like, COMPULSIVE!!

But, laughing all the time.

And once again,  thanks.

annie

[iratherfly]

Sailor, that's interesting. These are cheeses that had originated traditionally from milk that has been skimmed to make butter or cream, or from morning milk that has more protein and less fat (generally speaking, I know that in the summer months morning protein can be similar or lower than evening and in spring months evening milk carries more fat or similar fat to morning milk).

But doesn't this change the balance of the cheese?  More fat means a totally different lipolytic activity (and both Mozzarella and Parmesan call for lipase in them for a reason).  Adding milk powder to supplement protein would change the proteolytic activity.  What do you do to keep the balance going?

Annie, Paul - I personally would feel very guilty if I am ever in the position to skim Jersey milk. It's like getting a Ferrari and forcing yourself through a traffic jam, or buying a nice piece of Brie de Meaux AOC and throwing away the rind...

[ArnaudForestier]

These are cheeses that had originated traditionally from milk that has been skimmed to make butter or cream, or from morning milk that has more protein and less fat (generally speaking, I know that in the summer months morning protein can be similar or lower than evening and in spring months evening milk carries more fat or similar fat to morning milk).

Yoav, I'm unclear if we're still talking about Beaufort, or the Italian hard cheeses.  If Beaufort, that's not my understanding.  It's actually a full-fat cheese.  And the wheels are made from an entire herd's milking, 2x daily. 

I personally would feel very guilty if I am ever in the position to skim Jersey milk.

Yep, but sometimes it's necessary.  I know at least one maker who must do this, if his daily herd-mix is too heavy in Jersey.  Make butter, not war.

[arkc]

OK Guys, I am very confused!   Now what?

annie

[ArnaudForestier]

Hahah - yes, the joys of forums, annie.  I know your pain.  But that's only because I've tended to  want one, unassailable answer, which is impossible in a room full of talented makers.  I can again suggest you just try skimming your milk back and going ahead - again, one noted maker of an American "Beaufort" does this regularly.  I'd also suggest you try it a billion different ways.  I've got 5 in my cooler right now - each one, done differently.  Starting next week, I'm foregoing PLA and blends altogether, and doing trials, with summer milk, using pure strains among b. casei, b. linens, R2R, DH, MVA, etc.  And on and on. 

I can say, unabashedly, that I have leaned very, very heavily on linuxboy, Francois, and Sailor, in trying like the dickens to learn all I can.  They've been of inestimable help, as have many others. 

Beyond reading what they have to say, I can only suggest - having read all you want or can, just give something a try, see how it came out, and adjust.  I know it's hard, when each of these cheeses take 6 mos. or longer, but I don't really know a better way.  Even if there is "one" answer, based on a person's optimum - well, we each have different tastes, you know?  The only thing we can do is hone our palate to razor-sharp sensitivity, and try to match up our technical chops with what our palate is telling us.

Have fun.

[iratherfly]

Yoav, I'm unclear if we're still talking about Beaufort, or the Italian hard cheeses.  If Beaufort, that's not my understanding.  It's actually a full-fat cheese.  And the wheels are made from an entire herd's milking, 2x daily.

Sorry, it was a bit off-topic, I was just asking Sailor on the Italian cheeses

Starting next week, I'm foregoing PLA and blends altogether, and doing trials, with summer milk, using pure strains among b. casei, b. linens, R2R, DH, MVA, etc.  And on and on.

I just hope you are not trying them all together   Why MVA and not PLA?  How many wheels do you have that you are going to run all those tests on? Also, expect R2R to change the appearance of the cheese completely.\.

Add to your list ARN. It's a fantastic culture that is interesting to use wherever you would have otherwise used PLA. Different appearance and aromatic properties.