Flocc time influence on flavor development

[arkc]

Everything I have read says that a flocc time should be approx 15 minutes in order
to develop flavor. Is this written in stone?  Is it different for different cheeses?

And what is changing during that time to enhance flavor?

annie

[linuxboy]

Please see my partial answer here

http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,2724.msg51166.html#msg51166

approx 15 minutes

for traditional cheeses, it's about that, yes.

Is this written in stone?

For traditional hard cheese, yes, from 10-15 mins.

And what is changing during that time to enhance flavor?

Rate of proteolysis is influenced by amount of remaining rennet. So using more tends to lead to higher rennet retention, sometimes leading to off flavors, such as bitterness.

[arkc]

What about Bloomy Rind types or Soft Washed Rind types.  Should the flocc time for a lactic or rennet curd that will be a Camb or Chaource be the same as a hard cheese?

annie

[linuxboy]

Whenever you are dealing with a technology of cheesemaking where bacteria or fungi will break down the paste of the cheese, the rennet amount and floc time is less important. Because you're not relying on primarily rennet for proteolysis in the cheese, you can get away with using a bit more and also with having a shorter floc time. But as I said, it's often easiest practically to use more traditional times because then it is often easier to control acidity and you have more flexibility during the make.

For example, the moisture content is really important for bloomy rinds. A longer floc gives you lower margin of error attributed to misinterpreting the floc time. You draw out the dynamics, making the process more forgiving.

[arkc]

you can get away with using a bit more and also with having a shorter floc time.

Shorter or 'a lot shorter'?

I did both a Camembert and a lactic type yesterday. The flocc time for the Cam was 6.5 minutes.
I am so disgusted with the spinning bowl method and floc times, that I just  let it coag until
I got a clean break.. And with the lactic, (I tried to use the PH meter, but it had decided to register
everything at 4.0..) I just let it sit overnight at 69 degrees until it was visually ready to ladle.

as I said, it's often easiest practically to use more traditional times

I will go back to that at least until I get a 'proper' meter.  I think that you (or someone) said that the
cost of a reliable one would probably $350+.  So be it.

Thanks again,

annie

[linuxboy]

Shorter or 'a lot shorter'?

A lot... 5-6 mins. But then you typically also need CaCl2 because brownian motion decreases with formation of the gel, which leads to a different rate of bonding in the non-enzymatic phase. So you accelerate it with cacl2.

I think that you (or someone) said that the
cost of a reliable one would probably $350

I've paid less than $50 for every pH probe I own by buying used /surplus ones and reconditioning them. I've posted my reconditioning process here before. And they work great. You just have to know what to buy. I've also posted those guidelines before to answer george.

[george]

Hee - different George.     Here's the thread LB is referring to ...

http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,7125.0.html

[arkc]

Thanks for the thread...Have  great weekend.

annie