Author Topic: 4th Caerphilly  (Read 3093 times)

Offline JeffHamm

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #15 on: September 30, 2011, 06:58:27 PM »
Passed some of this one around at work.  Lots of people said they really liked it!  I'm pleased with it too.  I quite like caerphilly, well, the ones I've been making.  I've yet to actually try the real thing so I don't know if I'm close or not to the actual texture and taste.  Regardless, I'm pleased! :)

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Offline Boofer

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #16 on: October 01, 2011, 01:30:57 AM »
Good work, Jeff. Looks like you're next in line to be the Caerphilly King [cue the trumpet section].  :)

It's okay at that young age, huh? Seems like it would mellow out a little more with a little bit more affinage.

I thought it curious to place an onion in the photo with your wheel. Was that for a size comparison or do you actually dive in to onions with your Caerphilly?

You're making me wonder if Caerphilly is in my future.

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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #17 on: October 01, 2011, 02:08:16 AM »
Hi Boofer,

Yah, caerphilly is quite good young.  It does mellow if you age it out 3 months, but it's very flavourful at 3 - 4 weeks.  It's supposed to be crumbly, and this time I've got that nicely.  And it's salty too (not overly, but saltier than the average).  It also has an acidic tang to it, but again, not in an unpleasant way.  I find it goes well with strong flavours, like the olives and raw onion.  Usually, though, to be kind to my wife, I just have the cheese! :)

Personally, I tihnk this is a great cheese for anyone starting on hard cheeses.  It's a fairly straight forward make, quite forgiving, and you can taste it quick to find out how you're doing.  This time I followed a different make from what I've done before.  This one doesn't stack and mill the curds, but does up the temperature of the make by a few degrees C.  I'm going to look at combining the two makes to see how it goes.

Anyway, I really like it.  I'm quite pleased with a number of cheeses I've been doing.  This is one of them, as is the Butterkase and Dunlop. 

- Jeff
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Offline anutcanfly

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #18 on: October 01, 2011, 11:50:52 AM »
Oops!! I didn't notice she used and 18% saturated brine!  After reading your posts I got a little worried as I brined mine for 20 hours, per 200 easy recipes ( used MA11).  Mine is 5 weeks old...I'm chewing on my second slice now...  That's really tasty!  It is very slightly salty, but not at all unpleasant as it goes well with the sharpness that has developed so far.  The paste is creamy, sharp, with a slight amount of crumble.  Maybe a third slice...  There went my diet...:P
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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #19 on: October 01, 2011, 12:23:36 PM »
Hi anutcanfly,

Sounds like we have pretty similar outcomes!  It is a nice, flavoursome cheese.  And, with the quick turn around, a good one to get into as an aid to aging some others that require more patience!

- Jeff
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Offline anutcanfly

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #20 on: October 01, 2011, 02:44:25 PM »
Hi Jeff,

Yep me too.  I made it to my fingers out of the rest of my cheddar.  Wasn't sure about making a cheese that aged that quickly, but I'm very glad I did.  I'm very curious about how the different techniques and cultures you used affected the cheese. It's too bad we can't sample each others cheeses on this site! I guess it really doesn't matter if the cheese is true to style or not, if no one else knows how it should taste either!  I brought some of my first efforts to a BBQ and they were hit!  They didn't come out the way I had envisioned, so I was disappointed in them.  Having no idea what they were supposed to have been, everyone else loved them.

Happy thoughts,
Ann
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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #21 on: October 01, 2011, 04:15:51 PM »
Hi anutcanfly,

I know what you mean.  I've had some cheeses turn out quite different from what I expected, but some of my "tasters" chose it as their favorite.  In fact, when I made it again and it turned out the way I was trying to, they didn't like it as much, so there you go.  It's not that the second make was a poor cheese, but rather the first had a strong sharp flavour, but I was going for smooth and mild - my taster prefers stronger sharper cheeses, so when it worked the way I was trying to do it it was not a cheese for them, so no surprise in their choice.  Still, having it turn out the way you intend is very satisfying.  Being able to reproduce it is even better.  That's what I'm working on now, trying to develope consistancy.  I suppose it would help if I stopped tweaking things each make though. :)

- Jeff
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Offline Boofer

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #22 on: October 01, 2011, 05:52:52 PM »
I guess it really doesn't matter if the cheese is true to style or not, if no one else knows how it should taste either!
Well, there is a way...     Caerphilly

I was curious whether what I was struggling to make had any similarity to what the commercial product might be. Answer?: buy some and taste it for myself. Most of what I try to make is not available in my local supermarket, or a lot of times if it is, I have to take out a bank loan to buy it.

It can be amazing, surprising, eye-opening...or a rude awakening. All in all, still very useful to see whether you are on the right track.

-Boofer-
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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #23 on: October 01, 2011, 07:26:59 PM »
Hi Boofer.

Thanks for the close up.  That's encouraging as my recent make resembles that somewhat.  I find the descriptions on the net for most cheeses seem quite variable.  The one you linked to is the first time I've seen caerphilly referred to as buttery, for example.  For example, the Wikipedia entry (yes, the source of all truth and wisdom!) has the following "Caerphilly is a light-coloured (almost white), crumbly cheese made from cow's milk, and generally has a fat content of around 48%. It has a mild taste, with its most noticeable feature being a not unpleasant slightly sour tang".  This would be a fair description of what I've got now although I don't know about the fat content. 

From wiseGEEK, we get this (I'll copy more, as this has some details about 'aged' Caerphilly as well).
"Originally produced as a way for dairy farmers to efficiently expend their excess milk, Caerphilly cheese developed a following that soon made it profitable to produce on its own. The cheese became a great favorite of Welsh coal miners, who enjoyed chunks of Caerphilly for lunch. The rind of the cheese protected it from the miners’ dirty hands, and its saltiness supposedly replenished whatever was sweated out by the men laboring underground.

Caerphilly cheese is moist and pale, with a mild and salty paste. It is now produced in southwestern England as well as Wales. The English preference is for fresh Caerphilly cheese, eaten after only a few weeks (from two to eight) of aging. At this stage, the paste has a fresh, tangy flavor.

Traditionally aged, from twelve to twenty weeks, Caerphilly cheese has a milder, smoother flavor. The rind, which is natural, is thin, dry to the touch, and pale. Occasionally, the wheels, which are typically about 10 inches (25 cm) in diameter and weigh about 8 pounds (3.6 kg) are waxed. Waxed Caerphilly cheese tends to have a milder flavor than the cheese in its natural rind."

Again, the description of the young cheese, fresh, tangy, fits what I've got.  And the reference to the salt content for the minors fits with the slightly salty flavour as well. 

Anyway, as indicated, if you age it out it gets milder.  And that is probably where the buttery description may start to come into it.  It's a pretty versatile cheese though, as it's good when very young but also can be aged out to 5 months; possibly more.  I would defineately go with the stacked and milled version if I was going to age it out, as the idea seems to be to get a crumbly cheddar type cheese.


I've been looking around for caerphilly to try some.  There is a cheese company that makes it in New Zealand, but their description is of a cheese that is "made today and eaten tomorrow", that has a "milky flavour", etc.  This sounds like a very different cheese to what I generally read about.

Wow!  In my search for Cearphilly in new Zealand I just found a great article from 1907 in the national archives, which also includes a description of how to make it!  I'll type this out and post it shortly.
- Jeff
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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #24 on: October 01, 2011, 07:55:36 PM »
Hi,

Just found this article, which may be of interest.  It's from a New Zealand newspaper in 1907 and it includes the details of how to make Caerphilly.  Also, it points out that this cheese went to market in just a fortnight (2 weeks).

- Jeff


---------- start of article ------------------------------
Caerphilly Cheese:
Marlborough Express, Volume XL, Issue 15, 18 January, 1907, page 4

This is one of those makes of cheese for which there is at the present time a steadily growing demand. So large, indeed, has the consumption of this cheese become (writes C.W. Walker-Tisdale in the Farmer and Stockbreeder) that we know of one firm of cheese merchants which is having Caerphilly specially manufactured in New Zealand, Holland, and Denmark, and sent to it in order to make the supply anything like equal to the demand.  It appears to me that the prospects for this cheese are better than for almost any other variety, and considering the number of Cheddar makers who are turning their attetntion to Caerphilly makes, the production of Cheddar cheese is likely to suffer in consequence.  The advantages of producing Caerphilly cheese as compared with Cheddar are: 1 Greater weight of cheese is obtained, as it is sold fresh when in a moist condition. 2. Being sold at the end of a fortnight after making, very little storage room is required.  3. The sale being effected so soon after making, money is quickly returned for the milk, which is not the case where Cheddar cheese is made, as this does not fully ripen and become ready for market in a less period than three months.  To manufacture this cheese new milk is taken, regulated to a temperature of 86 deg. Fahr., and rennetted in the proportion of one drachm of rennet to three gallons of milk (rennet being first diluted with cold water.)  In the course of about an hour the curd will be firm enough to manipulate, which can be tested by seeing if it breaks clean over the finger.  It may then be cut by using American knves (vertical and horizontal), and reduced to small cubes of about 1in in size.  When all the curd is reduced to this size the temperature of the whole contents of the vat should be raised to 86deg. Fahr., as by this time it will probably have fallen several degrees, so should be raised to the same termperature as that at which it was rennetted.  The curd must now be stirred by hand for about an hour, or until it becomes slightly firm in nature.  Some makers stir the curd for thirty minutes, allow it to pitch or settle in the bottom of the van (sic; I assume vat) for ten minutes, when it will be time to draw off the whey.  The whey is now drawn off, and the curd is placed in coarse cloths and placed on a table to drain.  To help the expulsion of whey the cloths are tightened now and again by taking three corners and using the fourth as a binder.  This drainage is allowed to go on for about an hour, during which time the cloths will have been tightened about five times.  This tightening to expel the whey must not be excessive, or the curd will get too dry.  The curd is now broken by squeezing it in the hand and out between the fingers, almost as a potato-masher works.  It is next placed in the tin molds, which are lined with cloths to recieve, and the curd pressed in with the hands.  The curd in the moulds is left for two hours before being put to press, during which time only small weights are put on the followers to keep the curd together.  The curd in the moulds may now be turned and put to press under just a small amount of pressure – say, 5cwt or 6cwt overnight.  In twelve hours’ time (next day) the cheeses are taken out, rubbed with salt, turned, and replaced in the mould with a fresh cloth, and put under a pressure of about 10cwt.  Twelve hours later this process is repeated, the total amount of salt used being half an ounce to each pound of cheese.  On the third morning from making the cheese may be taken out of the press and removed to the curing-room, which, if the cheese is to be ready for sale in two weeks’ time, should be at a temuerature (sic) of 65deg. to 20deg. (sic : 70?) Fahr.  If not required to be ripe so soon it must be kept at a lower temperature.  In some cases makers prefer to salt their cheese by brining them instead of rubbing with dry salt.  This may be done by having the cheeses partly immersed in brine for a couple of days or so, being careful to turn them frequently.  The common size of the Caerphilly cheese is 6lb, but they are made in sizes from 5lb to 10lb each.  In the case only of the larger cheeses the pressure may be increased to 15cwt instead of 10cwt for full pressure.

----------- end of article -----------------------------

For noting: cwt is a hundredweight, or “centum weight”.  In the UK (and here in New Zealand), 1 cwt = 112 pounds, while in the US it equals 100 lbs.

And a drachm is 1/8th of a fluid ounce according to "thefreedictionary.com"

I've also found reference to the traditional sizes being 10 inches in diameter and 8lbs. Assuming 10 inch diameters then 5cwt would produce roughly 7.13 psi, 6 cwt would give 8.56 psi, 10cwt = 14.27 psi, and 15cwt = 21.40 psi
« Last Edit: October 02, 2011, 12:13:16 AM by JeffHamm »
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Offline darius

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #25 on: October 02, 2011, 08:46:52 AM »
Interesting article, Jeff. Thanks for posting it.  :)

Now that I've figured out my problems are probably milk-quality related, I'm trying some other brands and using just the Caerphilly recipe for them all since it's a soon=ready make.

Offline fied

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #26 on: October 02, 2011, 09:05:26 AM »
The taste and texture of Caerphilly? It's a white cheese, slightly crumbly paste with small curds. Tastes are salty, sharp, fresh, buttery and can be flowery depending on the quality/locality of the milk, with no complexity of flavour. It's a bit dull and bland in taste after about 10 weeks, so most people here in the UK go for the younger cheese.

For myself, I prefer Lancashire or Wensleydale mainly because they have bigger curds and aren't quite so salty, but Caerphilly is relatively easy to make and makes a good lunch cheese with some spring onions and salad, some crusty bread and fresh, unsalted butter.

Offline anutcanfly

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #27 on: October 02, 2011, 12:13:53 PM »
Thanks everyone for the nice picture and info!  Glad for the heads up on aging.  I just assumed it would get sharper, not bland!  I'll still leave some in my cheese cave, to see what it does and when.  I try to make a point of tasting all the cheeses once a month so I can determine when they are peaking for my tastes.  Sometimes the cheese doesn't make back into the cave though.  :P  Like you Jeff, I have the habit tweaking recipes...  Being able to go online and read about everyone else's impressions and ideas, makes it possible to tailor a recipe to taste and get it right the first time!  I so love the internet!  I'm a newbie, so I'm behaving myself with cheese recipes for now, but I'm sure that habit will reassert itself before long!  A) 
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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #28 on: October 02, 2011, 02:29:56 PM »
Thanks for that fied!  I think the outcomes I'm getting fit with that, as I did age one of them out 3 months and it was much milder in flavour.  I've got both a Lancashire and Wenslydale in my cave as we speak.  I've got the Wenslydale waxed, and will try and age that quite some time I think.

- Jeff
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Offline JeffHamm

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Re: 4th Caerphilly
« Reply #29 on: October 02, 2011, 03:44:09 PM »
Hi darius,

Finding a good source of milk can be tricky.  I'm lucky in that the brand I've settled on is fairly inexpensive.  Caerphilly is a good one to use as a test case as you could make a couple with different brands on different days and have them all ready at a time to compare in relatively short order.  Hope you find a good one soon.

- Jeff
The wise do not always start out on the right path, but they do know when to change course.