Chaource . . . Boofer sinks into semi-lactic

[ellenspn]

Looks good! This weekend I'm going to a workshop where I'll make my first camembert so I'm putting my toe in the water for this!

[iratherfly]

Sorry Boofer... this was a distracting make for you with all the stuff with your dad happening (is he better? I hope so!)

This looks like it was prematurely rinded and the inside didn't age.

You should do this again with low temperature and very long ripening time. When you age it it should take 4-5 days for the rind to be created. If you see the geo on day 2 or 3 you are going too fast. Halt it y rubbing salt into it or putting it int he fridge for a couple of days and let the other stuff catch up. (Use a slower PC like VS not Neige which is very aggressive). When aging it, rub it daily for the first week or so to tighten that skin and spread it nice and even. This will prevent the skin slip.  The lack of contact between the skin and the paste is the cause for the immature and dry interior.

Last but not least.... salt. Not enough salt will make the geo run wild (grows too fast and ...voila! slip skin!). You can salt only the top of the cheese, wait 6 hours, turn the cheese and salt the bottom (which is now the new top).  Another ridiculously easy way to salt lactic cheeses is to do the following:
Pre drain the curd in a cheesecloth bag for 2-6 hours (the more, the drier).  Unload the curd from the bag to a bowl and weigh it. Add 1.5%-2% salt by weight. Mix/fold gently with a spatula. Taste it to see if it's good! (This is one of those few cheese types where you can actually salt and taste it right away. It's a delicious spread actually and without rind flora you can use it as an easy spreadable cheese, somewhere between cream cheese and fromage blanc).  Anyway, then fill your moulds with the pre-salted curd and continue to drain them regularly. Easy and accurate.  Note: when tasting it, the flavor should be slightly saltier than what you would want for a spreadable cheese. Lots of salt will continue to drain with whey in the coming days.

You will have better control if you make the cheese without ripening bacteria and only spray it on it once it's moulded. This has the potential to be a regular staple at your house and make a delicious supple triple creme like cheese with gorgeous rind. Don't give up. Try it again.

[Tomer1]

Today is showcase day, opening the blue lactic and two (or perhaps just one if it hasnt ripened enough) PC riped lactic.

I have the feeling the blue is gone be tangy PR cream cheese texture which might be tasty and might be horrible. 
I'l take some pictures.

[Boofer]

Sorry Boofer... this was a distracting make for you with all the stuff with your dad happening (is he better? I hope so!)

Yes, it has been a distracting week for me. Thank you for your kind words for my father. He is on the mend but it was a tough week for him too. His bride of 67 years (my mother) passed on Tuesday. Her 87th birthday would have been December 11th. We're doing okay, but this will be a holiday season I will long remember. I've been camping in Dad's house tending to his burns and other needs and long to return to my wife and little Yorkie. Three weeks being separated from them is wearing.

Thank you for providing clarity to my errors in this make. After trying to combine pieces of three recipes, I am much more inclined to lean more heavily towards your guidance. Not so much with the Margaret Morris or 200 Easy Cheeses recipes. Lower temp initially plus a lot less rennet.

Good advice and another solid entry for my process folder. Thanks. I'm actually anxious now to try it and get it right!

-Boofer-

[ellenspn]

Oh Boofer I'm sorry for your loss    Hope your father continues to heal both physically and emotionally (And you too!)

[iratherfly]

Oh my. I am so sorry for your loss and as Ellenspn said, I too hope that your Dad health physically and emotionally. It must be especially difficult when your family is not there with you as much as you want them at these times.

Let me know when you are doing the next batch. Let's make this work.

[JeffHamm]

Boofer, so sorry to read of your Mum's passing.  My thoughts are with your Dad and you and all your family.  Take care.

- Jeff

[Tomer1]

My condolences...

[anutcanfly]

I am so sorry to hear of your loss.  I wish I could ease your pain.

[Cloversmilker]

Sorry to hear of the loss of your mother.  I hope your dad is doing okay physically and emotionally. 
Mina

[Boofer]

Thank you all for your warm thoughts. Dad is doing well...almost healed in all ways, believe it or not.

Yet another reason to love this forum...compassionate people.

-Boofer-

[nmordo]

Hi All --

I was inspired to try this make, having struggled a bit with camemberts.  The issue with my cams has been that they end up WAY too dense, with little moisture inside. I'm pretty sure it has to do with the RH inside the aging cave, which I'm working on addressing with my latest batch.

Anyway, regarding iratherfly's Chaource recipe that I'm following, I added the GC pre-rennet, as specified, but no PC since it was an "either/or" choice in the recipe.  Now I'm wondering how the mold will form without the PC present.  Should I just go ahead and spray it with a PC solution once the surfaces are dry and the cheeses de-molded?  Any thoughts on this?

Thanks.

[iratherfly]

Sorry nmordo I haven't been on the site in a couple of weeks and didn't see this message ...oh no!!! Too late now. nmordo, you may have made yourself an accidental large Saint Maercellin by now.  The recipe was kind of an aggregation from a conversation that Boofer and I had. Where is says "Geo or PLA and PC" should really read "Geo or PLA, and PC". That one little comma makes the difference... the choice is between Geo or PLA (because PLA is a mixture that already contains geo so no need to double up on yuor geo if you are using PLA, but not everyone have access to PLA and it is quite expensive). PC is a must have in Chaource.

What were your results like?
Let's try to fix your Chaource and Camemberts.  Have you been working with aging containers? They will solve your dry Camembert problem!  What temperature are you aging your Camemberts in?

[nmordo]

The Chaource came out amazingly.  For a first try at least.  I ended up spraying PC on the surface once it looked dry enough, and it promptly started showing up on the surface about a week later.  The end result had some slipskin (pictured below), but was absolutely delicious at three weeks, and at four weeks.  It was very wet though, so I'm focusing on draining/moisture control with my next batch.  But basically, I'm loving this cheese -- very low maintenance to make, and people have been loving it.  A co-worker donated a half gallon of fresh, raw milk, and I'm using it to make Chaource.  My first raw milk cheese. 

The camembert issue seems to have been addressed (finally!) by using a proper aging container within my cheese cave (a wine fridge).  It seems to have been a humidity issue.  Below is a picture of the camembert after about 4 weeks. It had a pretty strong ammonia smell, but it was still young.  I opened another one a week later and it was pretty runny all the way through.  Unfortunately no pics of that one.

In other I have some 3 week old reblochons I'm wondering if I should open.  It's my first attempt at that cheese as well.  I already have another thread open on those, so will post the pics there.

Thanks for the response, and the recipe.

[iratherfly]

Glad you are making progress!
Both cheeses look quite ammoniated. The PC is receding and even if this isn't a total slip skin, you still have lots of premature softness and ammonia just under the rind before the center of the cheese has reached maturity.  Your rind looks like it is suffocating.  This is usually the result of too much moisture and/or too high temperature.  I see wrapping paper in your photos, so I suspect that's where this is all from. Do not wrap these cheeses. -Especially if you are aging them in a box. Let them age cold, slowly and in a partially-open box that keeps just the right moisture in it (adjust the lid over time to close it further and further as additional moisture evaporates from the cheese and box so it remains at 90%-95%. If your moisture falls too low, add wet paper towel to the bottom for a day or two). Colder temperature will let the PC grow stronger, so your geo doesn't take over.