Author Topic: Sour tasting Havarti  (Read 11892 times)

margaretsmall

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #30 on: December 08, 2011, 10:03:50 PM »
Great looking cheese.
Oidium seems the likely culprit on my cheese - my tomatoes do have something attacking the leaves, and we've had very wet and cool weather lately, just the ticket for nasties to flourish. I'll make sure to disinfect my cave.
Margaret

Offline MacGruff

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #31 on: December 10, 2011, 11:05:13 PM »
Wish me luck folks. I just came back from the store with two gallons of milk. Tomorrow morning I will start making Havarti again....


Holding my fingers crossed....      ;)


iratherfly

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #32 on: December 11, 2011, 01:21:24 AM »
Woo hoo! Take it slow. make this one really nice!

Offline MacGruff

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #33 on: December 11, 2011, 09:43:20 PM »
Status update:

I spent the day working through the same recipe as before, only this time using two gallons of milk and the right quantities of the cultures, etc. Thanks to the suggestions here, I used some water with the MM100 culture and mixed it well into the milk. Anyway, below is the picture of what it looks like right after it finished draining and I then transferred it to the fridge. It is now colling down and tomorrow will get the brine bath. By the way, weight after draining if 1.242 Kg - and remember I started with two gallons of milk...

(I still need to learn to fold the muslin better!!!! )  :-[

iratherfly

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #34 on: December 11, 2011, 10:48:43 PM »
That's good yield. After losing all the moisture during aging you will end up with about 900g-1000g which is 2 Lbs. or more, that's exactly what you want from 2 gallons.

The MM100 is DVI (Direct Vat Inoculated) or DS (Direct Set) culture which means it is designed to be tossed freely in its granulate form right onto the milk.  Water may render it less effective.  For large quantities of cheese, cheesemakers usually mix it in sterile milk to make a mother culture.  For a 2 gallon batch you can just toss it onto the surface, wait 3-5 minutes for it to reconstitute and then mix thoroughly throughout the milk.  It will build colonies and will eventually take spread through the entire milk volume.

The rennet and calcium however do need this dilution even in small batches of cheese because they don't spread themselves through the milk without intervention.

Cheese looking good!

Offline MacGruff

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #35 on: December 12, 2011, 11:54:21 PM »
iratherfly - The package of MM100 I have says DVI on it, so I probably should NOT have mixed it with water first. Oh well.

Anyway, the brining stage is over and I took the cheese out of the brine and patted it dry. The cheese weight is 2 lb. 6 Oz. now (which is 1.1 Kg). Below are pictures taken today. (BTW - the weight of the drying rack I am using is 4 ounces so I subtracted that from the weight you see in the second picture)

The next stage is to let it dry overnight, and then it goes into the "cave".

iratherfly

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #36 on: December 14, 2011, 05:50:55 AM »
That's a really goood yield. In the future I suggest you don't pat dry the cheese. It needs to dry slowly and naturally. The brine that is on the surface is taking part in the osmosis process and it keeps circulating into and out of your cheese paste to flavor it and sanitize it, and to create the protective rind. Drying naturally should be in high humidity (but not as high as the cave). a good trick is to put it on a drying rack and put a bowl on top of it. Air is flowing freely from underneath but the bowl doesn't let it dry too quickly.  If the humidity is low and it dries too fast it may crack, so just let it be.   This long drying session also wakes up the yeasts and geo which begin to de-acidify and neutralize your cheese. (yeasts and geo are naturally occurring even if you didn't put them in)

Offline MacGruff

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #37 on: December 18, 2011, 11:32:11 PM »
It's been one week now since I put the cheese in the "cave" to rest. I have been flipping it daily. As of today's flip, it weight 2 Lb. 3 Oz or 994 grams. It is feeling dry and nice and I will now stop flipping daily in favor of a weekly flip.

I think it looks good, but what do I now?

As to the pancake cheese that started this thread. It is also in the "cave" I will taste it this coming Thursday and let you all know what it's like.

margaretsmall

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #38 on: December 19, 2011, 01:03:52 AM »
Well done McGruff, great looking havarti. I think you wait now ;D unless you want to wax or vacuum pack it. If you decide to let a natural rind develop I'll be most interested to see how it develops. My third Havarti was cracked yesterday (can't remember when I made it, we're away from home and my notes and I forgot to write the date on this one) and it's going down very well.
Best wishes for the season
Margaret

iratherfly

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #39 on: December 19, 2011, 03:07:23 AM »
MacGruff - what do you mean it's dry? Is it wrapped? Vacuumed? in an aging container? What's the humidity like in your cave?  This is a rather rindless cheese. I would suggest to vacuum age it. I hope it won't turn too dry and your cave is at least 90% humid because you don't want to dry it out. It's a moist cheese. On the other hand, if you would have 90% humidity and age it for a week you would have seen some rind flora by now. Best advice: vacuum it. Keep aging it at around 55°F/13°C and turn it over every few days from now on until done.

Offline MacGruff

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #40 on: December 20, 2011, 12:38:45 AM »
iratherfly - I hear you about the rindless and humidity. That's my current dilemma. I am using a college-dorm type of fridge where I fiddled with the controller so that it keeps the innards at 50 degrees F. For humidity, I am filling the bottle container in the bottom with water and have a small towel providing wicking. I have not hygrometer, so cannot measure the humidity level inside there - yet.  (I have a hygormeter on order - should arrive in a couple of days.)

As to my comment about "dry" cheese, well, that's because after I removed it from the brine and patted it down, it retained some moisture and I was worried it was too wet. By now, there is a bit of a rind on the outside (i will not know how thick until I cut into it...) I do note that this cheese is developing differently than my previous attempt. The rind is NOT becoming yellow, which my first attempt did. Now, it could be that this was because my first attempt was from one gallon of milk so the pancaking effect lead to a color shift, or maybe since it was in a very dry environment (leading to the cracking I described above), or maybe because I spread a thin coat of Canola Oil on it after it was dry initially. Not sure.

As to the rind flora, it may be developing, I am not sure. The middle of the wheel has some whitish powderish looking stuff on it. I've been afraid to wipe it off, because it might eventually develop into what is desired. Again, I am too new at this to know what I am looking at....

I really like the idea of vacuuming, but have not stepped up to purchasing one of those devices yet. So, cannot vacuum seal.  :-(


MargaretSmall - I am happy with the way it looks right now and hope that I am not destroying it by being in too dry of an environment. I thought I'd give it a month and then taste it, but it sure is hard to wait...

Offline MacGruff

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #41 on: December 22, 2011, 12:38:34 AM »
Hygrometer arrived today and was placed in the fridge with the Havarti. After a few hours (and right now) the temperature in there is 52.9 degrees F and the humidity is at 82%. Maybe I was worrying for no reason...

iratherfly

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #42 on: December 26, 2011, 05:23:03 AM »
Is it vacuum sealed or waxed? 82% RH is extremely dry if not.

Offline MacGruff

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #43 on: December 26, 2011, 02:51:25 PM »
Neither waxed nor vacuum sealed. I thought I was doing good at 80%+ RH    :-[

Anyway, i went to flip the cheese last night and saw these really "gorgeous" colors of mold on it. So, this morning I took the following pictures:

The first one shows the red, white, and blue molds all over the cheese top. This was actually the bottom of the cheese, the one that the cheese was resting on for the past week.

The second picture is a close up of the red mold that I have not see mentioned on this board yet. Anyone care to tell me what that is?

The third picture is of the other side of the cheese and you can see that the red mold is just starting to appear there.

I know I have to take the blue mold off and will do so. What do I do with the red stuff? Throw this cheese out and start again? What could be the cause and how do I prevent it? Or, is it a normal/safe thing?


Thanks!

Offline Boofer

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Re: Sour tasting Havarti
« Reply #44 on: January 05, 2012, 02:55:04 PM »
Hard to believe no one responded to your question. Holidaze?  ???

You have probably started to gently rub the affected areas with vinegar and salt to remove the red molds as well as blacks and blues that may have appeared. Don't let the cheese just sit there for a week. This is a moist cheese that cries out for attention on a regular basis.

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