Author Topic: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?  (Read 1529 times)

Offline steffb503

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Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« on: March 24, 2012, 05:48:35 AM »
Do any of you who sell cheese legally sell "Cheddar"?
I ask because I have been working on a cheddar and spoke to my inspector about it. He told me in order to use the name "Cheddar" either on the label or on my website I must follow the standards for cheddar.

So that prompted me to check out the standards. Very detailed.
I am wondering if any one does this, is it even possible on a small scale.

I would love to hear from you commercial cheesemakers about this.


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Offline zenith1

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2012, 09:25:18 AM »
That is interesting Steff. What does the specific standard say about that and does it apply if you label your cheese for instance "M&S Farms Cheddar" or something specific that includes your name and the type of cheese.
Keith

Offline Sailor Con Queso

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2012, 10:10:15 AM »
The FDA has a"Code Of Federal Regulations". Title 21 is their standards for cheese.

FDA Title 21

The FDA standards are very loose, and they generally do not cover specific requirements for ingredients, cultures or make procedures. They loosely define that certain basic ingredients are allowed - milk, calcium chloride, coloring, cultures, enzymes, and coagulant. In some cases they state maximum allowed concentrations for things like calcium chloride. But as a cheesemaker, all of the "ingredients" are at your discretion and you can call your cheese anything you want as long as your not infringing on someones protected status. Even then that's not a regulatory issue that should involve your inspector. Huge numbers of cheesemakers make cheddars, so it sounds to me like your inspector is misinformed or at least a little overzealous. You can always print the standard out and hand it to him/her. Ongoing education of your inspector is really important.
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Offline DeejayDebi

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2012, 10:24:58 AM »
I was looking over the section on cheddar ... hydrogen peroxide? What is that for? Isn't that the stuff you put on cuts and bruises?  Other optional ingredients ... Hydrogen peroxide, followed by a sufficient quantity of catalase preparation to eliminate the hydrogen peroxide. Sounds nasty!

Offline Edgwick Farm

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2012, 03:23:51 PM »
We make and sell a goat milk cheddar with cheddar as well as a "fanciful name" on the label.  We had to run our recipe process and our label by the NYS labeling expert:

Kathy J. Laviolette

Dairy Products Specialist I

NYS Dept. of Agriculture and Markets

Milk Control & Dairy Services

10 B Airline Drive

Albany, NY 12235

tel: 518-457-8872

fax: 518-485-8730

kathy.laviolette@agriculture.ny.gov

After reviewing the recipe process (via e-mail), she agreed it was a cheddar and said we could either call it cheddar or hard cheese.

Our NYS inspector sent us to her for approval of all our cheese labels.  BTW she has a long waiting line of approvals.  We submitted in August and heard back in November.  We were 25th or 26th when we submitted.

 


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Offline steffb503

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2012, 04:24:07 AM »
Thanks
I have been dealing with her for a while. Have been selling in Ny for a while just was wondering about the standards. They seem specific in regards to the moisture content and fat content. How do you assure those things are at the right level?

Offline george13

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2012, 10:57:49 AM »
Since certain cheeses must adhere to the standard of identity, the inspectors will hold you to it.  If you however come up with a clever name for your cheese and somehow associate it with a standard cheese through your advertisment pamphlet or another method, you could circumvent the requirment, that's how I do it.  As far as the standards themselves are concerned, for Cheddar I am sure the focus will be moisture content and aging, some of the other more intricate details would aply more to Kraft than you.

Offline iratherfly

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #7 on: March 31, 2012, 01:28:39 AM »
George, Steff, this is a strange one and I think that the Dept. of Ag. and Markets are smoking something.  I didn't see any of that in "part 2" of the circular.

Cheddar is not a DOP cheese and has no standards. No one owns the name or has interest in protecting it and there is nothing about it that puts it in its own rules and regulation. In fact, I am quite sure that they are out of judrestiction to make assertions related to your marketing and branding when it's not related to disclosure of ingredients, expiration date, weight, identification of the dairy plant, truthful nutrition facts etc. Cheddar is neither a brand name, trademark, patent, protected origin, nor is it any health claim or disclosure of facts. Is there some massive scale cheddar fraud where people make tommes and goudas and label them Cheddars at the public's dismay? How id this even within their jurisdiction?

Don't get me wrong, they have lots of reasonable rules and food should be regulated but this is overzealous. Thankfully there are the Weston A. Price foundation and the Farm-to-Consumer Legal Defense Fund to keep them in check. Why are they wasting your time?  ...and more importantly since when do you make cheddar? I am still planning to come up and see you again Steff. Been super busy but didn't forget you. Got those pyramid moulds you asked for now. About 40 of them left in stock

Offline steffb503

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #8 on: March 31, 2012, 05:38:27 AM »
There is a standard for cheddar and many others.
FDA title 1
is where you find them.
I spoke to the inspector about it. He said they test for the different standards when they take samples. If it does not meet those standards you must correct or change the label.
It is not the Dept of Agri it is the FDA
Also did you know that your website must also use the correct name. IF there is a way to purchase the cheese off your site via, email or phone number. If you call it cheddar on your site it must meet the standard. It is governed by the FCC.

My question was really about meeting those standards. I was wondering how difficult it is and does following the recipe usually give you the correct moisture and fat?

Offline george13

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #9 on: April 01, 2012, 02:20:28 AM »
Here is the standard, http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cdrh/cfdocs/cfCFR/CFRSearch.cfm?fr=133.113  Now, you could follow this to some extent, or make some modification to the name.  For me, changing the name works better than dealing with regulators.  Granted, here in NY they are too busy to go after you for attempting to immitate a cheddar. In your adverising call it "the next best thing to Cheddar" or "a very close cousin to cheddar",  you get the idea.  I do this with all my French and Italian cheeses, be creative.


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Offline steffb503

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #10 on: April 01, 2012, 05:10:39 AM »
Actually I was told no mention of the name cheddar was allowed. I asked about saying" similar to or Cheddar type".
Inspector said when they take samples they test for the moisture and fat as per the standard.
It is amazing how many cheeses have actual standards.
I will stick to "Emily"

Offline iratherfly

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #11 on: April 03, 2012, 12:00:36 AM »
Actually Cheddar has no production standard, it's not a brand but just a method and there is nothing about calling cheddar that risks the safety of your consumers or decives them. They don't care if you milled and salted your curd and when or how much and at what press.  This is not an AOC or DOP cheese and you are not a member of any production co-op.  This is a classic case of overzealous authorities over-stepping their jurisdiction. All they need to care for is whether or not your product is sanitary (as oppose to healthy, I mean they don't ban junk food, right?) and whether or not it is true to its claim of nutritional facts. Cheddar is not a nutritional fact.

In Europe they have this ongoing practice of meddling with the naming in order to circumvent naming conventions of trademark cheeses. It's kind of funny. Cantal by non Cantal AOC members is sold under the name 'Cantalet'. Bûcheron sold sometimes under the name Bûcherondin, etc. You should call your cheese 'Cheddarette', 'Cheddarin', 'Cheddariette' or something like that!

Seriously now, I get that you are just trying to frame the mind of the consumer around what it is they can expect to purchase. Would they allow to call it Emily but then write under the name a marketing tagline such as  'a cheddar style goat cheese', or 'Inspired by British Cheddar, Crafted in Sulivan County' etc.?

Offline Sailor Con Queso

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #12 on: April 03, 2012, 12:15:01 AM »
I agree with IRF. WAY overzealous inspectors. Show them the FDA standards.
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Offline iratherfly

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #13 on: April 03, 2012, 01:02:39 AM »
And we *never* agree  :P  (no, I kid, I kid)

Offline steffb503

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Re: Cheddar - Selling in New York State, Using Cheddar Name!?
« Reply #14 on: April 03, 2012, 05:25:59 AM »
I totally agree but it is the law.

My real question is ...Is it difficult to meet the moisture and fat requirements?
And how would you know before the state sampled?