Gouda #4 & Gouda #1

[Monty]

This weekend it was way too hot where I live (Birmingham, AL) to do anything outside so...why not make cheese!?!  Still working on my Gouda making skills before moving on to other cheeses.  So this Sunday was Gouda #4.

First, I have to admit that I got lazy on this batch and used store bought milk (Barber's).  I know...I'll just have to live with the shame. 

Anyway, make went according to plan and Gouda #4 joined his siblings in the cheese cave.


As a novice, one thing I did find interesting was the significant differences in floc times between the Gouda #3 batch (made with local, low temp past, unhomogenized milk) and the supermarket milk I used this time.  Floc time (using spinning bowl method) for Gouda #3 was around 11 minutes while for Gouda #4 was at 17.

Is this common?  If so, I'm starting to understand why so many of you are quick to abandon the 'one size fits all' recipe approach of the books out there.


Lastly, Gouda #1 (left on photo) is now 4 months old.  Temptation is getting the best of me and my will power to stay out of it is all but gone.  So...eat now or wait???

[JeffHamm]

Hi Monty,

Yes, different sources of milk will respond differently to the cultures and rennet.  A good example of why using measurements that indicate how this particular make is going are better than using average values obtained by someone else using their milk and rennet, etc. 

Your cheeses look nicely formed.  Four months should be a good time to taste, though I know some people will say that if you can hold out to 6 months then it's worth it.  Still, with 3 more gouda's in reserve, you're probably ok to get rid of temptation by giving into it! 

If you do cut it into it ... hey wait!  Come back, I'm not finished and put that knife down this instant!

Now, as I was saying, if you do cut into it, after cutting your wedge let it come to room temperature before slicing further and tasting.  I often find that the cheese really needs to breath for a while after taking it out of the wax, so you may want to cut it, remove the wax from your wedge, re-wax what you're not goign to use, then go out for awhile to let the cheese breath for couple hours (keep it in the cave, where the humidity will keep it from drying out), then when you get home, take it out to warm up a bit, then give it a try.

At least try this after you've had that initial taste that you're going to have to try immediately upon removing it from the wax. 

Well done.  A cheese to you.

- Jeff

[Monty]

Thanks for the advice Jeff!  I would have never thought to give my cheese time to 'breath'...but it makes sense.  As for the knife wielding...soon, very soon.

[H-K-J]

Be gentle  my son

[hoeklijn]

Good looking cheeses you have there! I only use raw milk and assuming the temp is right and the volumes are the same, I have about the same floc-time every time.
About when to cut: I make mostly Gouda's about 1kg/2lbs and when I've enough curd left one or two of about half a kilo. I coat them with a plastic coating. How they mature is depending on size, cave conditions and if they are coated,waxed or vacuum sealed. And how mature you like them is of course a matter of taste. Some Gouda's with herbs I enjoy more if they are a bit younger, the "plain" Gouda's I prefer older, so my advice is: Get that knife and try 

[smilingcalico]

Funny post, Jeff!  For the most part, I agree with Jeff, but I'll share a little of my feelings.  It is funny, but when I made gouda and would sell it at the farmers market, it would immediately start selling better at 4 months.  The 6 month however, was by far more flavorful and outsold the 4 month.  If you can hold out, do so!  On the tasting, yes, typically serving at room temp is best.  What I recommend however, is bringing the cheese to room temp, and tasting immediately after cutting.  I say this because cheese is a fascinating thing and its flavors change as it opens up, just like wine.  This way you'll get a good idea of how the cheese progresses.  I've even been known to cut into cheese at ageing temp and doing the same thing, rather than waiting for it to warm up.  Why? Because I'm just as impatient as the next guy.  Plus, you may decide you like your cheese cooler.  There's nothing wrong with experimenting a little for the sake of cheese education.  Nice work by the way!   

[H-K-J]

I agree Smiley, If in a hurry I eat it cold or if I bring it out early and forget it for a while it gets ate warm
you definitely can taste a difference in texture, flavor and mouth appeal 

[Boofer]

Yeah, might as well chime in here too.

LOL, Jeff. 

Monty, I have found some consistency with my floc times using the same milk, culture, temperature, and amount of rennet. That can change for whatever reason as it did for me with my Reblochons last week. I would typically get a 11-18 minute floc, but this one went out to 25 minutes. Not a big deal. It just meant I had to wait a little longer for the floc and then the cut. That's the beauty of the floc method over what most of the books tell you to do. Ripen for X minutes, rennet and wait Y minutes, then cut and go for it. The point is, the milk may not be conforming to those times specified in the book.

Yes, you need to sample your freshly-cut cheese right out of the cave. You are its maker and you deserve it! It does give you a perspective for later, after it has had a chance to breathe at room temp, when it has warmed and the flavors and esters of the different cheese components are released. At that point the smells and tastes are quite different than right out of the cave.

You can grab a small piece for yourself now and reseal the rest for continued aging if that suits you.

Enjoy!

-Boofer-

[hoeklijn]

With coated Gouda cheeses (Oh no, there I go again  ) they use cheese testers. They only taste a small piece of the inside and plug the remainder back in the cheese. Bit of coating and after a couple of days you won't trace the spot again... Got one when I bought my cheeseknife but I think that one is too big for my baby gouda's.

[JeffHamm]

Looks like we're all in agreement.  Taste now, save some to age more, and though it's good to let it warm up we all know you'll taste some right away as well.  Just take note of the flavours at each tasting point, and compare your impressions.  The flavours really do change quite a bit as it warms up and breaths.

Also, cut a wedge, or 1/2 the wheel, and rewax it and let it age to at least 6 months.  I aged my first gouda to a year, and it was wonderful.  I still have about 1/3 of it which will be 2 years in Dec.

- Jeff

[Sailor Con Queso]

That's the beauty of the floc method over what most of the books tell you to do. Ripen for X minutes, rennet and wait Y minutes, then cut and go for it. The point is, the milk may not be conforming to those times specified in the book.

And here's a conundrum for you to ponder. Morning milkings typically have higher protein than afternoon/evening milkings.

[Monty]

Would you believe I managed to make it a whole additional week before cutting into this!!!  Well, I finally got into this last night. 

Overall, I’m calling this a success…mainly because it’s my first cheese and eating it did not kill me! 

Tasting Notes – Monty’s Gouda #1

The first cut was smooth and clean but I noticed immediately that this cheese was very dense and on the dry side.  The texture is very un-Gouda like, probably best described as a cross between cheddar and feta and prone to crumbling. 

Like many of you recommended, I first sampled the cheese straight out of the cheese cave (like I could have waited) before putting it back in to breathe for a few hours.  First impressions were that it had a very mild flavor and certainly could have aged longer to develop more; also, after chewing, the cheese finished with a mildly bitter flavor…not unpleasant, but distracting.  It’s hard for me to accurately describe the flavor other than the aforementioned ‘un-Gouda like’

After two hours left on the counter to warm, I revisited that first slice.  Both the texture and flavor had improved, and the bitter finished noted initially had faded considerably.  This is definitely a cheese best served at room temp.  Due to its texture, I don’t think that age will improved this cheese much so I’m not planning on re-waxing and aging Gouda #1 any longer.

As I said before, I’m claiming this a success… with ample room for improvement. 

Gouda #1 was made following Ricki Carroll’s recipe to the letter (using calf rennet) and I have for subsequent cheeses gradually improved my technique.  I was using a multiplier of 3.5 for Gouda (which typically puts me around 60 mins) and may drop that down to see if that improves the texture.

I know I don’t have my make notes posted…but any advice on improving future cheeses is greatly appreciated.

Your determined Young Cheese,
Monty

[smilingcalico]

Monty, what you describe definitely sounds like over acidification.  This would have occured during the time you took to ripen the milk all the way up to the water wash.  Sure, there's still an increase in acidity after that point, but the wash REALLY knocks that back.  I used a 3.5 floc with no problems, but my floc time was between 12 and 15 minutes typically.  As a further example, let's say my floc was 15 minutes.  3.5x15=52.5minutes.  Now, subtract the original 15 minutes from the 52.5.  52.5-15=37.5.  After I reach floc I now have another 37.5 minutes until I cut the curds.  Is that how you calculated?  If that is, then possibly you added too much culture to begin.  I haven't read your make notes, so I'm not sure.  I hope I didn't add any confusion.

[iratherfly]

Good notes from Brian.

While it is most likely during the fabrication as Brian says, it sometimes could be attributed to overly warm conditions during pressing, draining, brining and cave aging.

I would try a different recipe; I find that some of Ricki Carrol's recipes can be inaccurate, simplified or just lack important details. I haven't seen this specific recipe so I can't comment on it, but there are reliable sources out there for traditional and rewarding formulas that you can achieve with the same amount of work.

[Monty]

Based on what I’ve read elsewhere in this forum, quite a few others that have used this same recipe (in particular those who used the full amount of C101 meso starter recommended) have experienced over acidification.  Tough lesson to learned - but one learned well.

As for the floc times, yes – I did subtract the initial floc time from the final calculated time.  Good question!

For iratherfly – the temp in my cheese cave is good.  I have a temperature regulated fridge kept at about 55 degrees.  But I would like more info on proper conditions to press, drain and brine.  I typically press/drain at room temperature which, at this time of year here in Birmingham, AL, is 76-78 degrees.  Brining is similar except that the brine first comes out of the refrigerator.  So what would be the ideal temperature to keep the kitchen when making cheese?