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CHEESE TYPE BOARDS (for Cheese Lovers and Cheese Makers) => RENNET COAGULATED - Soft => Topic started by: jasonmolinari on September 14, 2011, 09:00:27 PM
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I'm surprised to now see a post on Stracchino.
I've been making it at home using greek yogurt as a culture, but i have some texture issues and was looking for help. If anyone here has made it successfully i can post my method to see if i'm doing something wrong.
The issue i'm having basically is that the cheese texture, instead of being nice and creamy/gummy like the inside of a brie/camembert it's more like a dense cream cheese.
Anyone make it?
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Post your method. There are members so knowledgeable about cheese, you'll be astounded. We can't help you if we don't have as much info as possible.
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1 gallon whole store bought milk.
70g Chobani plain yogurt
1/2 tsp calcium chloride
1/2 tablet rennet dissolved in 1/4 cup distilled water
1) Mix yogurt in a ladle of milk and set aside
2)Add calcium chloride to milk. Bring milk to 92 deg. F
3) Add yogurt slurry, stir well
4) add dissolved rennet tablet, stir 1 minute
5) Move pot to keep at ~ 90 degrees.
6) clean break came after about 80-90 minutes
7) Cut into large cubes (about 3"x3"x4").
8) Let sit in whey for 10 minutes
9) Gently scoop into perforated tupperware
10) Let drain at room temp (77 deg.) for 3 hours. Flip. Salt. Let drain 3 more hours.
11) put into curing chamber at 55F/80% RH for 12 hours
12) Put into 20% brine for 40 minutes, flipping 1/2 way through
13) Put in curing chamber at 55F/80% in a closed tuppeware with the cheeses raised on a sushi mat to allow draining for 24 hours
14) Put in regular fridge. Eat.
As i said, the flavor is good, a little salty (will adjust brine time next time), but the texture is wrong. Traditionally stracchino is very soft and moist, like a really soft brie, so it has that melty texture even at fridge temps, but it tastes like a tangy fresh milk b/c it's a fresh cheese. My cheese is not gooey at all. Its like a dry cream cheese..
Help!
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My first impression is that it over acidified due to the length of time you had to wait for a clean break. Rennet tablets, according to many folks here, are unreliable if one doesn't know how old they might be, or how well kept. I have only ever used double strength liquid rennet, and have not had issues with it. I'll see about researching stracchino a bit more, as I have not made it. Have you used those rennet tabs in other cheeses with success? The other thing is, if those tabs are fine, the milk could be the issue. Many folks avoid HTST pasteurized milk, as well as homogenized. Those 2 processes really can degrade the quality of milk for cheese making, and often result in weak curd formation.
Edit: My phone changed HTST to GRAY, I have made the correction above.
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As an addendum, our whole milk may still not have enough fat, as it may often come from dairies that aren't pasturing their animals. As most of our dairy land is also pretty flat, it might be difficult to find the quality of milk that stracchino calls for. Your best bet for milk would likely be raw whole milk, but you may find adding a little cream to the milk may help.
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I think only culprit here is the store bought milk.
You are getting a good curd with the tablet so that can not be it.
Try this (http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,8088.msg56346.html#msg56346) and let me know if it is going to change the texture. I didn't have time to try the method yet but some industry expert says it is a good one.
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thanks guys. Unfortunately i don't have access to raw milk. I do have access to a non-homogenized grassfed milk, but at $4/quart i'd rather not experiment with it.
I will try adding some cream to it, i have seen that as a suggestion. I've also been told to raise the temp to about 100-104 before adding the rennet...i'll try that as well.
I don't make any other cheese (yet:) ) this is the one i want to make for now. I just got the tabs, so on my side, they're fresh.
Gurkan, that link doesn't go anywhere, it goes to the main forum. Can you try again?
thanks, any further ideas welcome.
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Seems like a half tablet of rennet is overkill for one gallon of milk.
6) clean break came after about 80-90 minutes
You might check into using the flocculation method to determine when to cut. Search on it.
So I guess the difference between Stracchino and Taleggio is that Taleggio is a washed-rind and Stracchino is not?
-Boofer-
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Seems like a half tablet of rennet is overkill for one gallon of milk.
6) clean break came after about 80-90 minutes
You might check into using the flocculation method to determine when to cut. Search on it.
So I guess the difference between Stracchino and Taleggio is that Taleggio is a washed-rind and Stracchino is not?
-Boofer-
I'm no cheesemaking export, or even novice, but that's what it seems like to me, yes. Stracchino seems like an un-aged un-washed taleggio. They taste nothing alike of course.
I'll look into the floculation method. Hope it doesnt' require equipment.
thank you.
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If you're only heating to 90F you need to use a meso. culture. Yoghurt is a thermo. culture and only really works best at temperatures above 92F. The recipe I have heats the milk to 96.8F/36C before adding the culture.
Also, your rennet is very high for 1 gallon of milk: 1 tab. will coagulate c. 50Ltrs milk, so even a quarter will be more than you need - more like 1/8 - 1/6th is needed. I don't use tab. rennet, but fresh liquid, and for this amount of milk would probably use less than half a tsp.
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If you're only heating to 90F you need to use a meso. culture. Yoghurt is a thermo. culture and only really works at temperatures above 92F. The recipe I have heats the milk to 96.8F/36C before adding the culture. Also, your rennet is high for 1 gallon of milk.
Understood. The cheese i'm told uses a thermo culture, so maybe i didn't activate the culture by keeping the temp so low. Thanks.
I should have used about 1/2 that amount of rennet, but i wanted to make sure i got a set given past issues with Junket rennet. I can deal with some bitterness from excess rennet if that is the only issue. I want to get the texture right.
thanks
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I'll look into the floculation method. Hope it doesnt' require equipment.
Matter of fact it does...a lightweight bowl or empty yogurt container. ;)
-Boofer-
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There is a false notion going on all over the forum that I'd like to clear up. People seem to think that thermophilic cultures are totally inactive at lower than the recommended temperatures. That is wholly untrue. They are active at mesophilic temperatures. Quite so. Do they thrive? Again, quite so. But, they do have an optimal temperature range in which they perform their best, above that of mesophilic cultures.
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By the way, there is a good little discussion here http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,6505.msg46408.html#msg46408 (http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,6505.msg46408.html#msg46408) about using thermos in a meso make. I'm sure there are more, but this one is fresh in my mind.
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Jason the link is http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,8088.msg56346.html (http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,8088.msg56346.html)
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thanks everyone. keep the advice coming if there are any more ideas.
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I was wondering if you had any luck with further stracchino tests. I am getting ready to try this week.
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i have not tried again, but i would love to hear your results and experiments!
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I'll keep you posted and provide some pictures if I can.
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We have this cheese spread sort of thing used a lot like cream cheese my mother used to make with the kids. It was a part of a winter nights ritual after skating or sledding and before and after the bath. I remember the magic of seeing the chunk of white cheese in the morning and anciously waiting for Sunday to eat it on fresh bread with basil and olive oil. I think it might be what you are looking for except we called it Stracchini. Could just be a dialect thing. I have noticed that depending on what part of Italy you are from things are pronounced a bit different. I never really though of it as cheese but I guess it is. Hope this helps. I haven't made this since Mama passed. I may have to try it with my niece. Thanks for the stirring of memories!
Stracchini
1 gallon whole milk.
1 pint half and Half
3 to 4 tablespoons active plain yogurt
4 drops rennet dissolved in 1/4 cup distilled water
2 cups of cold pure water
4 tablespoons salt
Warm milk and yogurt to room temperature.to about 104°F
mix in yogurt straight from the container mix well
Heat milk slowly to about 104°F to prevent scalding
Remove from heat
Put the pot in a warm oven about 90°F for about 2 to 3 hours. If you hae a light in your oven this is perfect!
Cut the curds into pieces about the size of plums and again let them sit in a warm oven for about 2 hours
Very gently scoop curds into a cheese cloth lined collander and drain for about 2 hours, carefully tunring after about an hour.
Mix the salt and salt until salt is disolved. Add cheese in cheese cloth and soak for about 1 hour turning after 30 minutes.
place the cheese in a cheesecloth lines collender and sprinkle a pinch of salt on top. Let this drain covered at room temperature over night or at least 8 to 10 hours.
The cheese sold be light and springy. If still soft and sticky drain for another few hours.
Carefully unwrap the cheese from it's cloth and place in an air tight container to age for 24 hours.
When ready it should be similar in texture to a soft brie without the rind.
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Hello I registered at this forum in November 2010, when I was beginning to learn about cheese making but then I stopped doing it during last year. As it's clear my English writing is poor but I'll do my best.
Now I decided to begin with an easy cheese and keep doing it till I get good results in several tests. I want an easy cheese to begin so I chose stracchino, a cheese I've first met in Italy where I've lived for two years 13 years ago.
Stracchino also known as crescenza is a type of Italian cow’s-milk cheese it is eaten very young, has no rind and a very soft, creamy texture and normally a mild and delicate flavor. It is normally square in form.
I use this recipe from an Italian forum http://www.forumdiagraria.org/ (http://www.forumdiagraria.org/) which I am very grateful.
Ingredients
4 liters whole milk.
Rennet
Starter cultures
Salt
PROCEDURE
*Warm milk to 65 |C pasteurization
*Cold to 37| C- 42 °
*Add salt 1 % ( 40 gr) This is recommended but it can salted in brine bath or dry salt
*Add starter cultures (Streptococcus termophilus and Lactobacillus bulgaricus (or 1, 5 % yogurt or 1 % termophile milk culture).
Add rennet to coagulate in 30 minutes.
Cut the curds into pieces 8- 10 cm wait 25 minutes
Cut nut size and stir gently, wait 5 to 10 minutes.
Very gently scoop curds into the molds I used two plastic pudding bowls with holes.
“Stufatura “(drain and mature) for 3 – 4 hours in a warm oven, (I put a light on the oven to create 30° C and some warm water for a high humidity. The cheese mustn't touch the whey. You have to turn them over 3 or 4 times during this period.
Mature in the fridge for 2 days being carefully that it doesn't touch the whey and cover.
After two days it's ready. It's a soft cheese milky taste.
This is my first proof; the result was good but a little salty. Moreover I had problems with the rennet because its expiration date was November 2011 and it didn't coagulated after 30 minute and I put another dose and it took 2 hours to coagulate.
I've just bought a new one and I will repeat it, my idea is to keep doing this cheese till I'll get the same result for tree times.
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Welcome back! I never had any problem with your English.
Your cheese looks great. Nice picture. How long will it stay fresh?
-Boofer-
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Thank you!! I posted the photo |at the Italian forum; I want their opinion and advice too.
I haven't got much experience about how long it will stay fresh but I read on the web that in the fridge at 0- 3 ° C it would last 6 days more or less.
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Hello I made my second stracchino, so there are some corrections to the recipe I posted. At the Italian forum I've got two critics: the form was too low and perhaps a little dry.
I think the reason of the first problem (stracchino or crescenza are usually 4- 5 cm high) is the mold which is too low to be filed with all the curd ,but with 4 l I've got two filled pudding stamps so it is possible to put one over the other after the last turnover of the stuffatura”. The side that is touching is the dryer one (the top) to prevent some whey from been inside the cheese. I use pudding stamps but it would be better one with straight sides
I put my double stracchino” in the fridge but it crumbled . So I reviewed the recipe and came on with I've made a mistake!!!
After the stuffatura it's necessary to put the cheese in the fridge inside the stamp for 24 – 36 hours. Then you take it out and put in the fridge again on a mat that allows the whey to drain with a film only on it
In the future l go ahead with this cheese and I promise to post a revise recipe when I get an almost perfect stracchino o crescenza
Next I add some general information about these cheeses and two photos.
Traditionally the term stracchino is use to name all soft cheeses made with milk from cows “stracche”," that is tired, with reference to the cows which after a long journey back from the pastures, arrived tired in the evening when they were milked. The soft cheese is a full-fat soft raw, cheese delicate and flavorful and is made only with whole cow's milk originating in Lombardy.
The crescenza is an Italian soft cheese, raw and fresh, made from whole cow's milk, pasteurized or skimmed. It belongs to the family of stracchini, which includes also the Carthusian, and Robiola cheese and is said to derive its name from the Latin word "Crescentia," because if keep warm swells like bread during leavening. It is a cheese without rind, the cheese is creamy, smooth, and white in color and the flavor is sweet and delicate flavor. The crescenza provides protein of high biological quality, calcium and vitamins A, B1, B2, PP, also contains high amounts of minerals such as sodium, potassium and phosphorus.
Many times crescenza and stracchino are used as synonyms, but the crescenza is softer and the stracchino dryer with a ripening time of about 20 days to 3 month for the Strachitund.