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GENERAL BOARDS => Other Artisan Crafts => Topic started by: Crystal on July 09, 2012, 11:41:19 PM

Title: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Crystal on July 09, 2012, 11:41:19 PM
Hi guys, im back again!

My adventure into sausages has been FUN! we have universally decided asa family that we like our sausages skinless, so i save a bunch that way. Sometimes we put the meat through the machine and make thing sausages, sometimes i shape them by hand and we have fat (or lumpy) sausages! Cheese has been slow, i ran out of cultures so just ordered some now so i can get making for Christmas. The other thing ive always wanted to try was ham and bacon, and most accounts have stated its 'easy'. The problem i have is that all the recipes are contradictory! Most say a dry cure, using Sodium Nitrate (prague powder #1?) yet the powder states it is NOT to be used for dry curing! I dont have a smoker, and was hoping someone here has a very simple and basic process for ham and bacon that i can cook in a very slow oven? or even the BBQ?

Please, also try to use terms i will understand as a complete NOVICE... I dont want to mess it up!

By ham i am referring to the lunch meat style that is rolled and sliced.

And well, bacon is bacon!

Any help is really appreciated as ham is quite expensive here, ranging from $11/kg to $29/kg and upwards. When the cut of pork is roughly $6/kg...

Also, no one really clarifies WHERE to store the meat while its curing... is there a recommended temperature as with cheese?
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Tomer1 on July 10, 2012, 09:40:54 AM
As fermentation is not involved, Id cure it in the fridge (4c).
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: iratherfly on July 11, 2012, 03:00:24 AM
Bacon, Pancetta, Speck, Lardon... same basic idea:

1. Cure in a closed bag in the fridge for 7-14 days (depends on thickness). The cure is better with nitrates/nitrites but it's not neccesary (better pathogen prevention, preserve red color of meat beautifully). If you don't have nitrites/nitrate (pague powder #1 or #2, or TenderQuick Salt) than you can use celery salt or something else with naturally occurring nitrates. The cure should contain sugar (Brown sugar is nice. Maple syrup makes incredible flavor). Also in the cure, include your spices: peppercorns, bay leafs, powdered onion and powdered or crushed garlic, juniper berries, thyme, spanish sweet paprika (or smoked paprika if you like) etc.

2. The next stage is to take it out of the bag and wash it thoroughly with clean cool water. No salt, spices or leafs should stay on it. Wipe it dry!

3. Put it on a tray on a rack, cover it lightly with cheesecloth to protect it from over-drying and getting refrigerator smells. Throw it in the fridge for 24 hours and turn it once in a while to it dries evenly. This is important - you are building a pellicle layer. A sort of skin membrane that develops on the exterior of the meat which will protect it from over-drying, give it texture and stand up for any smoking. Think of it as developing rind on cheese.

4. Finish:
Note about dry-aging:
You want to hang it in a cool room (50°F-60°F/10°C-17°C) and unlike cheese, this needs to be ventilated. If you have a ceiling fan you can turn it on to its lowest setting. You can also place a fan somewhere in the room for circulation. Just don't aim it directly at the meat: It will fly dust all over it which will stick to its moist and oily skin. Moreover, you may dry the outside too quickly (rendering it thick, hard, dense and dry like a jerky). When you do that, it will lock lots of moisture inside and the interior will end up too moist, soft, and under-cured.  It's the meat-curing version of slip skin in cheese making!
Prevent that by checking your meat periodically. If it is getting dry and tough but has a lot of give from the inside when you press it - reduce air circulation + place it in a more humid place + give it a few more days to dry-cure.  If you catch this issue early enough, moisture will shift and reconstitute the dry areas; it will recover (at least partially). Humidity in the room is okay, but not cheese humidity; normal humid day is fine.

Salinity and drying speed are the two places where you have the most chances of failure. Focus on that when you learn to make it. Follow formulas on the packaging of your curing salt.

For the Ham/Jamon/Jambon like product, use a wet cure and cook it the same way you would a British style bacon (longer time because these are thick pieces of meat!) it will be great.  Your initial cure time (before washing it off) may be a lot shorter than what you need tor Pancetta/Saucisson-sec/Lomo style meats.

Here are some things I made earlier this spring using these methods:
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Crystal on July 11, 2012, 07:53:26 AM
I read through debi's site and it said cream of tartar could be used instead of the cure? Didnt say how much to use though? Since im doing all this to attempt to avoid the migranes (one recent one put me in hospital) avoiding nitrates sounds good. Plus, anything i make wont me stored long, we'll eat it in a week! So, im thinking english bacon, it seems closest to what we get here, and the ham i was thinking of getting a rolled roast and using that since its the right shape for sandwhiches! I will keep you updated but as im about to go camping i wont start till next week!

Thanks so much for replying, i was really confused by all the different methods around! And yours look soooooo good!
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: iratherfly on July 11, 2012, 04:20:46 PM
Yes, really simple: Wet cure wash off cure refrigerate for a day smoke, cook, or dry
That's all there's to it! That's quite a lot of cured meat variety before you go into any culturing / fermentation / salami / sausage stuffing / natural rinds and other advanced chacruterie madness.

A word about Nitrates/Nitrites:
They are used for three reasons: 1). Pathogen control (mainly botulism) 2). Keeping your meat pink and pretty  3). Preventing rancidity of fat.
Cream of tartar wouldn't replace the pathogen and rancidity control or properties of nitrites/nitrates; It will only take care of the pretty color.
While Nitrites/Nitrates boast a scary scientific-sounding name, make no mistake about it; they are all over your diet already as they are naturally occuring in fruits and vegetables (especially in greens such as celery, spinach, lettuce, cabbage, broccoli, asparagus, cauliflower etc), as well as the meat of animals who consume greens.  They are safe to consume and have been used for meat curing probably since the time of the Roman Empire!

Nitrates/Nitrites' nasty reputation comes from their toxicity if consumed at ENORMOUS quantities.
To put it in proportion: nitrites are no more than 0.6% of your curing salt. If your product's final salinity is 3% and oh, say you have a serious craving for it and binge on 100g at once: You are consuming 0.6% of 3% of 100g = 18mg of the stuff. It takes 4.5g of nitrite to poison an adult human. 18mg is 1/250th of that! (or in other words, you will need to eat 25kg of cured meat all at once to get poisoned. If you can consume that much, I think other things will kill you first).
You also might have heard that it is carcinogenic which is a gross inaccurate exaggeration: Under some pH/heat conditions it may indirectly contribute to a process (that depends on presence of other substances), which may potentially produce Nitrosamine; a toxin linked to some types of gastric cancer. This is true also about cheese, beer, pickles and even fish.
In the grand scheme of things, it is far better to have this insignificant amount in your food than botulism, e.coli, salmonella etc.

Prague powder, pink salt, #1, #2, TenderQuick... whatever curing product you find out there - ALL have nitrates.  Sometimes you will see cured meat products in a health store or fancy supermarket that say "No Nitrates Added!" or "uncured bacon" - rest assure, in the ingredient list you will find some natural nitrate/nitrite-producing agent such as Celery salt/juice. True, they haven't added it to the product, but it's still there (what a marketing scam!).

HAVING SAID THAT.... you can certainly just use kosher salt + sugar + optional cream of tartar. It will do the trick, though it won't control botulism as effectively.

Debi has helped me a lot when I got started on chacruterie curing; If I remember correctly most of her stuff is wet-cured and smoked; not so much dry curing. She is extremely knowledgeable! Have you visited her website?

I say, if you are going for vacation for a week - cure the stuff in the bags in the fridge right now!  By the time you return it will already be done with step #1 and you will just have to wash the cure off, put in the fridge for a day and the next day bake it and it's done!
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Crystal on July 14, 2012, 09:46:25 PM
We have had the conversation about nitrates/nitrites before... the thought of being in an emergency waiting room in the middle of the night for 3 hrs waiting for a nurse to give me two pain tablets isnt enticing... then i ended up back there the next day but not in the waiting room... no one can tell me for certain that it is or isnt nitrates that give me a migrane, yet sausages give me a migrane, christmas ham... some bacon. I understand botulism isnt enticing either (rock and hard place huh?).

Ok, i think ill try without the prague powder, if its satisfactory then im ok with it. I will just make small amounts so that they arent being kept for long.

I have been t debi's site many times and am the proud downloader of just about every download available! Its only that most of her recipes are for american versions which i have no clue what they should taste like! Plus, with kids, anything too spicy or unusual probably wont go down too well. I do have my eye on a few things i want to test out of hers though ;-)

Ohc and i didnt want to start while we were away cos our ppwer gets a bit sketchy, it goes off from time to time...
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: jerseyknollfarm on July 22, 2012, 01:49:15 AM
I use this recipe for the cure for my bacon:
1 cup maple syrup
1/2 cup brown sugar
1/4 cup coarsely ground black pepper
4 oz of sea salt
4 tsp prague powder (optional)

I put the side in a shallow restaurant style pan and rub the cure all over the meat.  Cover and let it sit in the refrigerator for 7 days.  I do flip it every couple of days.

Rinse all the cure and place on a sheet pan to allow the surface to air dry for 24 hours.  Flip after 12 hours.

I then smoke it will apple and hickory wood until it is 160*
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: iratherfly on August 04, 2012, 07:15:36 AM
Sounds very similar to my formula... though I wish I had a smoker!
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Kaiser Soze on August 05, 2012, 12:26:05 AM
Bacon can easily be made without nitrites, without fear of botulism. Whole muscle cuts (such as pancetta, bacon, etc) do not require nitrite/nitrate rich curing salts for microbial protection, but instead are used for the characteristic ham/bacon colour and flavour. C. Botulinum can exist on the outside of whole cuts of meat, however this is an oxygen rich environment. For CB to grow and produce the fatal toxin, they need an anaerobic environment. If you cure whole cuts, that environment isn't available and botulism is not a risk. Once you grind the meat for salami or dry cured sausage, however, those CB bacteria are then transferred to the inside of the sausage to an anaerobic environment and there can be some chance of botulism poisoning.

I use nitrites most of the time, but I can certainly understand why you would want to try avoiding them given your migraine situation.

Making bacon is a fairly simple process, which can be done without a smoker, still with good results.

The basic starting point is the dry cure - generally salt (around 2-2.5% weight of pork, depending how salty you like your bacon), pepper and sugar. You can use different types of pepper (mountain pepper berry, black pepper, green pepper, white pepper) and sugar (white, brown, honey, maple syrup) to vary the flavours. You can also add aromatics (garlic, bay, thyme, paprika, liquid smoke) to add a depth of flavour.

I cure in a ziplock bag to prevent mess. Rub the dry cure into the pork belly all over and stick this in a zip lock bag for around a week to 10 days in the fridge. Due to the fact that you're using a specific amount of salt (based on the weight of the meat), there's no issue with over-curing, so it's better to err on the side of caution and go 10 days, but it may be ready in less, dependant on the size of the belly. During the course of the curing process, liquid will be drawn from the belly and the meat will start to harden up. If you remember, try flipping the belly over each day, and you can even massage it to ensure that the cure works its way into the muscle fibres.

Once you've cured the belly, remove it from the ziplock bag and rinse the cure off. You don't need to get it totally washed off, just rinse it to get the majority off. Some of the cure can still remain to add a bit of flavour on the outside. Once this has been done, pat dry with paper towels, then put the belly on a wire rack and pop it back in the fridge to dry out a little. If you're planning on smoking it, you want the belly to form a pellicle, which is a sticky layer on the outside of the meat. This gives the smoke flavour something to adhere to, however if you're not smoking the belly, just lkeave it long enough for the belly to be pretty dry.

At this point, you have bacon that you can slice and fry, however you might want to cook your bacon. Keep your bacon on a wire rack and put it in the oven. Turn the oven to 100*C/210*F and leave it in there for around 1.5-2 hours, depending again on how thick your belly is. You want to cook it to an internal temperature of 68*C/154*F. During the process, you can glaze it with something sweet like maple syrup, but it will still be delicious without.

After you've cooked it, let it cool and then slice it. It's easier to slice once it's been cooked in the oven, and easier still if you get it really cold before slicing (i.e. almost freezing!). You can pack slices into freezer bags and freeze it.

I have a post on my blog about it which goes into a bit more detail.

Really, with a nice cure and possibly a bit of liquid smoke (if you want), you could make a great bacon that would taste wayyyy better than anything that you buy in the shop. No need for nitrites or nitrates.
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: dttorun on August 09, 2012, 03:36:42 PM
I've been enjoying my delicious smoked salmon. Thanks to you guys now I have to deal with bacon as well...
Tan
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Al Lewis on November 27, 2012, 01:27:18 AM
Just finished this dry cure side bacon.  I also cure my own hams and do a lot of smoking/indirect heat bar-b-que.  Be happy to share any of my recipes if it will help anyone.
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: bbracken677 on November 27, 2012, 01:43:44 AM
When you smoke salmon....

Which end do you light?


Just kidding...what is your favorite bbq sauce recipe? Or rub, if you use that.
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Al Lewis on November 27, 2012, 02:20:47 AM
Here's my recipe for my dry rub.

DRY RUB

1 cup tomato powder
1 cup brown sugar
¼ cup Chipotle chili powder
1 Tblspn jalapeño powder
1 Tblspn smoked paprika
1 Tblspn molasses powder
1 Tblspn  dry mustard
1 Tblspn  garlic powder
1 Tblspn onion powder
1 Tblspn cayenne pepper
1 Tblspn Italian seasoning mix
1 Tblspn file powder
1 Tblspn Kosher salt
1 Tspn white pepper
1 Tspn Worcestershire powder

Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Al Lewis on November 27, 2012, 03:26:44 AM
I use pure maple syrup and brown sugar on the salmon and Mortons Sugar Cure on my bacon and hams.  I use to mix my own cure for hams using pink salt, coarse salt, brown sugar but recently found a local source for the Mortons.
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: bbracken677 on November 27, 2012, 01:47:30 PM
Thanks...I have to confess I have never seen tomato powder or worcestershire powder available. The rest I have...I assume the file' is gumbo file'.
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Al Lewis on November 27, 2012, 03:09:56 PM
Yes it is.  If you check on Amazon for Angelina's Gourmet they sell all of the powders.  Tomato powder is awesome for any number of things and the Worchestshire powder is what they use to flavor the salt.  You can also make the sauce with it by just adding water.

http://www.amazon.com/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=n%3A724716011%2Cp_6%3AA82OCV0PPPOA6 (http://www.amazon.com/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=n%3A724716011%2Cp_6%3AA82OCV0PPPOA6)
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: DeejayDebi on April 13, 2013, 07:49:15 AM
My goodness look what you all have been up too! Now your into my favorite neck of the woods. It all looks great folks I am proud of you all.

I woud like to just add a few comments mostly directed at Crystal;

#1 as far as nitrates go, you eat them everyday and just don't know it. If you ever eat root vegetables like potatoes, carrots, turnips, even celery and green leafy vegetables you eat nitrates. They are naturally occuring and particularly heavy in the things I just mentioned. You would obsorb more nitrates eatting a carrot or potatoes than you would get from curing a ham or bacon IF used as directed.

#2 if you buy products which are NATURALLY CURED AND NITRATE FREE - it's probably a lie. Many companies these days use a biproduct found in celery to cure meats and sausages and are considered ORGANIC. Guess what that biproduct is? It is simply the nitrates found in celery! Still Nitrates! Somehow they are allowed to call it nitrate free.

#3 as far as the cream of tartar goes it is NOT used for curing the meat it is only a way to help get that nice rosey color in your meats that you get from nitrates. For example a ham will be less pink without using nitrates and some people find a pale ham unappealing - but add a teaspoon of cream of tartar and it looks better-  it will turn pink.

#4 the biggest reason I "wet cure" big meats is salt. I find salt packing way to salty for my tastes. Even soaking it in water before the smoke to remove the saltiness is a bit much for me and seems counter productive and wasteful to me. I only dry cure sausages like salumi but that is another process altogether.

#5 Tomato powder is wonderful stuff! As is the Worchestshire powder! In my humble opinion THE best tomatoe powder or any other freeze dried foods come from Honeyville grain.  http://store.honeyvillegrain.com/freeze-dried-vegetables.aspx?page=2 (http://store.honeyvillegrain.com/freeze-dried-vegetables.aspx?page=2) I highly recommend the tomato powder for soups, stews, juice or paste and it tastes like it was picked this morning. I few others I have tried did not have that fresh flavor. The fruits  - blueberries, strawberries, mangos, anything without ig seeds are great I have even made pies with them. I didn't like the raspberries as they still have seeds and seem crunchy - I don't like the big seeds.

Good luck guys and gals!

Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Schnecken Slayer on April 13, 2013, 08:43:50 AM
I think this is where the confusion starts - Originally curing was done with Nitrates, (Saltpeter) these are bad and carcinogenic. These were banned and replaced with Nitrites.



-Bill
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Slemps on July 30, 2013, 09:26:31 AM
I think this is where the confusion starts - Originally curing was done with Nitrates, (Saltpeter) these are bad and carcinogenic. These were banned and replaced with Nitrites.

Actually, Nitrates are still used. Usually you would use Nitrates in products that need to cure and age for long periods of time like air dried ham and charcuterie.

The reason is that, over time, the Nitrites are broken down, but you still need the protection as you are aging for months. Nitrates slowly convert to Nitrites over time so they keep the meat protected over longer periods.

That is why you get different curing powders for different jobs. You should never "make do" with one over the other.

S.

Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: dthelmers on July 30, 2013, 01:22:32 PM
#3 as far as the cream of tartar goes it is NOT used for curing the meat it is only a way to help get that nice rosey color in your meats that you get from nitrates. For example a ham will be less pink without using nitrates and some people find a pale ham unappealing - but add a teaspoon of cream of tartar and it looks better-  it will turn pink.

How much cream of tartar do you use? I brined a couple of Boston butts. I seasoned and smoked one like pastrami, my regular "porkstrami", and I cooked the other one in the crock pot like corned beef. It tasted wonderful, but the color was kind of sad, and even worse on re-heating. I canned up the leftovers with pickled cabbage, and although it tastes good, gray food is just unappetizing. do you add the cream of tartar to the brine?
Dave, down in Meriden
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Slemps on July 30, 2013, 01:33:23 PM
How much cream of tartar do you use? I brined a couple of Boston butts. I seasoned and smoked one like pastrami, my regular "porkstrami", and I cooked the other one in the crock pot like corned beef. It tasted wonderful, but the color was kind of sad, and even worse on re-heating. I canned up the leftovers with pickled cabbage, and although it tastes good, gray food is just unappetizing. do you add the cream of tartar to the brine?
Dave, down in Meriden

I'd love to know this too. Never heard of that before.

S.
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Al Lewis on November 03, 2013, 04:08:18 PM
#3 as far as the cream of tartar goes it is NOT used for curing the meat it is only a way to help get that nice rosey color in your meats that you get from nitrates. For example a ham will be less pink without using nitrates and some people find a pale ham unappealing - but add a teaspoon of cream of tartar and it looks better-  it will turn pink.

How much cream of tartar do you use? I brined a couple of Boston butts. I seasoned and smoked one like pastrami, my regular "porkstrami", and I cooked the other one in the crock pot like corned beef. It tasted wonderful, but the color was kind of sad, and even worse on re-heating. I canned up the leftovers with pickled cabbage, and although it tastes good, gray food is just unappetizing. do you add the cream of tartar to the brine?
Dave, down in Meriden

If you include insta-cure #1 in your cure, pink salt, there isn'a a need for the cream of tartar as it will keep the meat pink as well.  Cream of tartar is for those that do not want to use nitrites.
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: DeejayDebi on February 23, 2014, 09:17:41 PM
Sorry I haven't been around lately. You would use about .4 ozs of cream of tartar instead of the nitrates for changing color per 1 gallon of brine. Not as pretty as nitrates but not so grey.
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: murmur on April 27, 2014, 04:32:29 PM
My 21 yr old bottomless pit of a son moved back home last fall and asked me to school him on Sausage , Bacon and Ham.
We make one of the above about every 2nd week.
The smoker also gets a bi-weekly workout :)
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Al Lewis on June 06, 2015, 10:44:18 PM
Had to revive this thread today.  My buddy called to tell me there was a sale on pork bellies.  Got a 10 pounder to do some dry cure bacon. Man do I love this stuff!!!:P
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: H-K-J on June 06, 2015, 11:05:09 PM
Hey Buddy how bout when yer done yuh jest shipper on down to me n the little woman :P ;D
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: Al Lewis on June 06, 2015, 11:12:24 PM
How about I just invite you to breakfast?  LOL
Title: Re: Ham and bacon?
Post by: H-K-J on June 07, 2015, 12:13:27 AM
Thanks, I will be there if we leave now, ummmm wait, can't do it I gahduh re-primer the jeep 8)