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CHEESE TYPE BOARDS (for Cheese Lovers and Cheese Makers) => ADJUNCT - Blue Mold (Penicillium roqueforti) Ripened => Topic started by: Likesspace on January 03, 2009, 01:38:12 AM

Title: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 03, 2009, 01:38:12 AM
After my first Stilton problems I’ve become obsessed with making this cheese turn out correctly. I have done a ton of reading on the subject of making Stilton cheese and so far my second attempt is going according to plan.
Since this one was looking so well, I decided to make another one about a week ago so hopefully they will both turn out as they should.
The first pic is of my newest. This one was just removed from the mold tonight and got it’s smoothing with a hot knife.
The second shot is of the one that is three weeks old tomorrow. As you can see, it is getting the classic wrinkled rind and beginning to brown. I’ll pierce this one within another week and then allow it to age for about a month.
As I’ve reported before, the taste and texture of my first Stilton was fantastic, but it was one ugly, pitiful looking cheese.
I’m hoping these turn out much better so I can get a good feel for what this cheese can be with the proper care.
If these do turn out, my next Stilton will be made in an 8” mold with a height of 8 inches, which will be at least somewhat closer to the traditional size. These cheeses are both 4” diameter x 8” tall.
Hope these pics help someone out who is comtemplating a Stilton style cheese.

Dave

Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cheese Head on January 03, 2009, 01:43:02 AM
Likesspace, beautiful looking and very colourful, very similar to my first try (http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,97.0.html).

Are you sure they are supposed to be that colorful?
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 03, 2009, 02:11:12 AM
John,
From what I've researched, the oldest one looks exactly as it should at the three week mark. Within two more weeks the brown colors should have taken over the outer blues and I should have a nice hardish rind formed.
At that point ( or a little before) I will give it the piercings which should then form the veining.
On my first attempt I did not smooth the surface and therefore it never formed a rind. I also pierced the cheese straight out of the mold which caused some cracking.
My first was a beautiful cheese for the first two weeks of it's life. All of the surface cracks filled with blue mold while outside the cracks it was this bright white color. The problem came from the cracks that happend after piercing and the cheese began to collapse onto itself from too many holes.
I decided to cut my losses and try this cheese at the one month old stage. Even at this young age it was one of the best blues I've ever tasted. My older brother had some on Christmas eve and proclaimed it "the best cheese he has ever tasted". This really did some great things for my cheese making ego. :-)
Since the first one was so good while young and made improperly, I have some high hopes for these two.
Wish me luck.
Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 03, 2009, 02:14:27 AM
Dave, I have a few questions.

1. How long do you leave it in your mold for, because I didn't know it was going to grow that much mold while sitting in a mold, I leave it in the mold for 4 days then move on to the next stage.

2. Do you press your stiltons at all? I press mine with 8 pounds of pressure (of course modified for the size mold I have) just to give it a solid shape.

3. What kind of milk are you using is it raw or store bought. If store bought what are the times for ripening and allowing rennet to set in your recipe? Also how do you curds look when you cut them?
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 03, 2009, 02:17:02 AM
Oh, one more thing......
The second cheese (the one just out of the mold) did have a LOT more blue on the surface than the first one.
When I took the first one out of the mold, and gave it the smoothing, it had just a couple of places where the blue had formed.
This second one had a little bit of bluing on one end of the cheese yesterday, but today nearly every crack and crevice was blue by the time I unmolded it.
It's amazing how quickly this mold grows once it gets started.

Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 03, 2009, 02:18:45 AM
Dave I just gave you a cheese on your rating..congrats..don't let it get to your head, mine did and I'm still coming down from that high.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 03, 2009, 02:29:11 AM
Cartier...
As for how long I leave the Stilton in the mold it is on average 6 days. I've left it as long as 7 days but there is no point it that as much as I can tell. The bluing usually starts at 5 days and as posted above the mold can really take over after that point. I also leave the cheese at room temperature (usually about 68 degrees) during the molding stage.
I do not press the cheese at all. I simply flip it over several times a day for the first day or two and then twice a day thereafter. This produces a very loosly knitted surface that is then smoothed out with a knife dipped in hot water.
I use store bought whole milk for this cheese (and for most of my other cheeses as well). I've had good luck with store bought as long as I purchase the right brand. I've contacted several dairies that supply milk in my area and inquired about their pasteurization process. It has definately helped me in choosing milk that will produce a good curd.
The ripening time for my recipe is 90 minutes. I add the cultures and the rennet at the same time.
The curd is usually really soft and has to be handled gently. With the slightest rough handling it will nearly fall apart.
By the time I finish draining and pressing the curd bag (with 10 lbs. of weight) the curd has formed into a solid mass. At this point it breaks into walnut size pieces, nicely, and then gets the salt and is loaded into the mold.
If the cheese cloth bag is what you were talking about (pressing) then I do press. After it goes into the mold, I let it compress by it's own weight.
Hope this information helps (Lord knows you've given me enough helpful information).

Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 03, 2009, 02:35:55 AM
Thanks for the cheese!
I'm somebody now!
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 03, 2009, 02:39:04 AM
Ok, glad to hear your curds are loose, not that I want that for you but it's good to hear it's not just me.

Serious Question: Do you get that nice tofu like mass and the clean break like you see in pictures on the web or do you get a break like mine seen here:
http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,611.0.html

Right now I've email every single person on the web who claims to be an expert on cheese making to see if everything I'm doing is correct or if there something I should be doing to get that clean break where it's a solid Jello mass where no residue comes up on your finger.

As far as what the dairies have told you what were you told about the brand you do use, for me and the rest of us who want to call a dairy.

Do you find the shape that comes out, pressed by it's own weight, come out nice?

How does the hot knife and water work, is it easy to smooth out the sides?

Why are you adding the rennet at the same time as the culture. From what I know the purpose of the culture is to produce acid which helps coagulate the milk. If you add it at the same time wouldn't that be a little too late? Not criticising, just curious. Also where did you get your recipe from? Thanks.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 03, 2009, 02:45:09 AM
I assume you gave me a cheese right back, thanks.

I have a 4" x 8" stilton in the mold right now, it looks massive and way cool. I will post pics when it comes out of my mold with my new follower with my name in it.

I also just picked up an upright freezer to convert into a blue mold cave for all my blue, stilton, gorgonzola and the other blue that I can't think of the name right now. I'll post somehting on that when I get it together.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 03, 2009, 04:12:00 AM
Ok, glad to hear your curds are loose, not that I want that for you but it's good to hear it's not just me.

Serious Question: Do you get that nice tofu like mass and the clean break like you see in pictures on the web or do you get a break like mine seen here:
[url]http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,611.0.html[/url]

Right now I've email every single person on the web who claims to be an expert on cheese making to see if everything I'm doing is correct or if there something I should be doing to get that clean break where it's a solid Jello mass where no residue comes up on your finger.

As far as what the dairies have told you what were you told about the brand you do use, for me and the rest of us who want to call a dairy.

Do you find the shape that comes out, pressed by it's own weight, come out nice?

How does the hot knife and water work, is it easy to smooth out the sides?

Why are you adding the rennet at the same time as the culture. From what I know the purpose of the culture is to produce acid which helps coagulate the milk. If you add it at the same time wouldn't that be a little too late? Not criticising, just curious. Also where did you get your recipe from? Thanks.


Okay, I had to do the quote thing or I wouldn't have remembered the questions.....

1. I took a look at your curds and I have to say that mine are usually a bit more firm. I have seen sets such as yours but that was on a prarie farms brand of milk that I've never had much luck with.
Once I switched to a different brand (made in Chester, Illinois) I've gotten a good curd that will "break" around my finger.
I will say that it's seldom that I've gotten a curd like I saw on one of Tea's posts. I think it was on her Colby attempt. That was one of the best looking curds I've ever seen.
Usually I will see a good break around my finger and then the gap will fill with whey. It's certainly not a perfect set but it's acceptable for store bought milk.

2. As of this date I've corresponded to two dairies. The first I called and the second I emailed.
The first dairy I simply asked to speak to someone about their pasteurization method and lucked out and got this guy that was a wealth of information.
He actually seemed happy that I called and gave me information concering the history of the diary and the steps of pasteurization.
This particular dairy heats their milk to 186 degrees F for a few seconds and then just as quickly cools it to 38 degree F. This is certainly not optimal for cheese making but this is by far the best cheese milk I have found locally. From what I've read, any milk that is heated over 171 degrees F does get damaged as far as cheese making is concerned so there's no doubt that raw milk would be better.
This gentleman did tell me that they used to make cheese at his dairy with this same milk. That made me think that it was usable and convinced me to give it a try.
As for the Prairie Farms milk (the dairy I emailed). They heat their milk to 176 degrees F for 15 minutes. Now according to what I've read, this should be the better of the two milks to use. Unfortunately I've never been able to get a good curd with this milk, regardless of this fact.
I'd simply suggest calling any local dairy or sending them a quick email. Maybe you will luck out and get someone who is interested in your efforts. The guy I talked to at Chester diary actually seemed fascinated that I was making cheese at home and we talked for probably 10 - 15 minutes.

3. When I unmold my Stiltons they look like they could collapse at any minute. The curd is very grainy looking with large cracks and fissures in the "log". What's surprising is that when I handle the log it is very firm and holds together really well. It's the fissures and crevices that will allow a good veining to take place after the piercing (at least, this is what I've read).
I will say that my first attempt was veined beautifully. Once the ugly outer surface was cut the veining inside was beautiful. Now remember this was on a cheese that was only one month old and was not handled properly from the first.

4. The hot water dipped knife works really well. You do have to put more pressure on the cheese than I would have initially thought, but it doesn't damage the surface at all. What you are basically doing is scraping cheese from the high spots and using it to fill in the low spots. I usually start on the top surface and then move to the sides. After you get the feel of it, it's pretty much like buttering a piece of bread or icing a cake. From what I've read,(and experienced) this step is necessary or the rind will not form.


5. I use the Stilton recipe on schmidling.com. There are a lot of different stilton recipes on the web but this one seemed fairly easy and according to the site, yielded good results. His recipe called for adding the rennet at the same time as the cultures and from what I tasted on my first attempt it worked out well. I'm not sure that you really want to produce a lot of acid with a Stilton. That's probably why both are added at once. If you want to check this recipe out, just google schmidling.com and then go to his recipe section.
One thing I do NOT agree with is using a whisk to cut the curd as he suggests. This will produce a jelly like mass that will not easily seperate from the whey. When I followed this instruction, I did end up with a good final product but it came at lots of extra effort from draining and draining and draining.

From what I've experienced so far, Stilton is not a hard cheese to make but it can be a hard cheese to take to the final product in good shape. Regardless the one that I cracked on Christmas Eve is the best blue cheese I've tasted.
Not too dry, yet not too creamy. Not too salty but with a definate "bite". Great blue flavor and incredible veining. I can't wait to taste one of these after they have aged for the proper two to three months.

Hopefully this answers your questions. You have no idea how big of a kick I'm getting out of being able to offer you advice on a certain type of cheese. I'm pretty sure I've read every one of your posts  on this forum and consider you to be a natural teacher and very knowledgable.
Now, if you will tell me HOW to give you a cheese, I will do so for all of the help you've given me! (believe me, I've looked and can't figure it out)

Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 03, 2009, 05:01:23 AM
Thanks, I'm like the indiana jones of information. I just keep digging and digging until I get what I think is the correct answer. I never answer posts, in this forum or any other forum, unless I'm sure of the answer. I'm not one to pass along disinformation. I'm all about eduction.

I ask so that I can build a knowledge base of what others are doing that way if something goes wrong or right I have an idea of why. Plus I enjoy being able to help people out with straight forward honest CORRECT answers. I try to be thorough as so many people on forum are so vague they might as well not have answered, and the reason most of us are here is to learn, the correct way, to do something.

Cheese making is really not that hard. There are a few things that make it difficult. Getting humidity in a cold environment. Getting a firm curd out of store bought milk. Getting a curd to knit into a nice wheel without pressing the living day light out of it.

Oh and the curds from Tea Colby are freakin' sweet, you are right those are by far the best curds I've seen on the web.

Tea on you cobly did you use raw milk? I didn't re-read the post right now but I will, I belive you do get raw milk locally. Have you ever used store bought milk and if so did you notice a significant difference in the firmness of the curds?
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Tea on January 03, 2009, 09:16:19 PM
Thankyou Cartier and Likesspace, although I don't know that my curds deserve such accolades?

Anyway to answer your questions.  If I remember correctly I did use fresh cows milk, that had come warm, straight from the cow in the colby recipe.

When I originally started cheese making, if I couldn't get fresh milk I used to but store bought milk.  The set was definately poorer, but I could make cheese.  Then the industry under went changes and the quality of the store bought milk dropped to the point that getting a curd was almost impossible, so I started looking around for a quality store bought milk.  Finally found one that was full cream and pasturised only. So now I used only either this milk, or when my friend has excess, fresh milk straight from the cow.  The difference in curd quality and yield is unbelievable.
Hope this answers your questions.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 03, 2009, 09:28:05 PM
How is the curd from the cream top pastuerized compared to fresh milk. Because I'm going to try some Cream top Past from the store.

You know what's weird is after watching the modern marvels cheese epsiode again I noticed the big cheese makers pastuerized their milk when it comes in and they get a perfectly set curd. I know homogenization has a lot to do with it, though.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Tea on January 03, 2009, 09:52:22 PM
I find it depends on how much cream is in the milk.  The store bought full cream pasturised milk will hold the cream in suspension while setting, while the fresh cows milk sometime has too much cream, and some of this tends to want to settle to the top before the milk has set.
You could if you wanted to scrap with cream off the top and use for a cultured butter, but it doesn't worry me having little flecks of set cream throughout the cheese.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 03, 2009, 10:21:54 PM
Cartier (and Tea for when it applies).....
Today my middle daughter and I made a Colby/Jack cheese. We used a six gallon recipe with her doing a 3 gallon Jack and me doing a 3 gallon Colby.
I used the recipe for both styles of cheese from Leeners.com and one thing that was very different was the addition of whipping cream to the whole milk.
According to their site, the cream will make the milk more like raw milk and I have to say I was very impressed with the result.
The Monterey Jack got a quart of whipping cream and the Colby got a pint. What impressed me was the curd I got by using this additon.
After making my vertical cuts, I actually turned out those really long, firm looking columns of curd in both cheeses (pretty close to what Tea had in her Colby pics). There was absolutely no mushing of the curd, although they weren't as firm as I would like to have seen while in the stirring  stage of the recipe.
I don't know if this was a fluke, or if this might be the answer we have been looking for. Mind you, this was on only a 35 minute set, after adding the rennet.
Another thing that amazed me was that I used both milk from Chester Dairy and Prairie Farms brand since I couldn't get enough of the Chester Dairy brand for this batch. As I said in another post, the Prairie Farms brand is usually a very inferior curd. This time, both curds looked exactly the same so that also makes me think the whipping cream addition was the key.
Btw....the whipping cream I bought, was ultra pasteurized but it didn't seem to hurt anything. You might give it a try and see how it works out for you.

Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 04, 2009, 01:50:58 AM
Hmmm, weird I don't see any pics...

I was going to mention that a lot of the creams are UHT, but you noticed that already. Very interesting.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 04, 2009, 04:15:45 PM
I know, I screwed up, not taking pics.
In the middle of the process I told my daugter we should have documented each step so she could use the pics (with a written report) for extra credit in either her biology or chemistry class.
She basically thought that was not the greatest of ideas, but anyway at least I would have had some pics to show.
I'll be making a cheddar next weekend and I will be trying the cream addition when I do it.
I'll definately try to snap some pics and post them.

Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 04, 2009, 07:48:51 PM
I'm going to call dairies tomorrow and inquire about their past process. I'm also going to try a stilton with past only milk not homogenized.

I might try the cream thing but not sure if it will change the richness of the milk. I guess the milk won't know that there's more cream than water, it should just yield more curds, right?
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Tea on January 04, 2009, 07:59:52 PM
Just as a side note from me, when adding cream I like to use pure cream, and I don't like the thought of these extra additives going into my cheese, especially when I have sourced good milk in the first place.  Probably just me, but that my preference.

Cartier you are most likely right, the yield would be better with the cream addition.

Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 04, 2009, 08:03:14 PM
Thanks Tea, I never thought of that. Next time I'm at the store I'll check the ingredients.

Dave, what kind of cream are you using, Heavy Whipping Cream?
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 04, 2009, 11:20:06 PM
Dave, when are you piercing the cheese? All the new recipes I found from Professional sources say to pierce after 4-6 weeks.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 05, 2009, 12:27:26 AM
I do use heavy whipping cream on my Stiltons and also did yesterday on the Colby Jack.
According to all of the Stilton recipes I've seen they do recommend using homogonized milk. For some reason it does seem to help this sytle of cheese.
As for piercing the cheese...
On my first Stilton I did pierce right out of the mold which seemed to be a big mistake. The curd mass was not nearly solid enough for this and it caused a couple of cracks to appear down the side.
On the oldest one I have curing, I will pierce it next Saturday. That will be the 4 week mark.
From everything I've read you should wait until a good rind forms before doing the piercing. Each day my rind gets a little more solid feeling and I'm sure that by next weekend it will be ready.
After the piercing I will let it age for a couple of weeks and then re-pierce through the same holes. This will ensure that they are still open and still allowing air to get inside.
After that, I will give it another two to three weeks and then crack it open to see if the magic happened.
By that time I will be ready to pierce the younger of the two and repeat the process. If these two both work out well, my next one will be 6" to 8" diameter x 8" tall (if I can find a suitable mold in this size range).
Hope this helps.

Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 05, 2009, 02:22:38 AM
Cartier....
One more thing: When you pierce our stilton don't make the same mistake I did on my first one. I pierced this cheese all the way through, both from side to side and top to bottom. My thinking was that it would allow more air into the cheese but it completely jeopardized the integrity of the wheel.
I've since read that Stiltons are supposed to be pierced ONLY to the center of the cheese.
I use bamboo skewers to do this and plan on making a mark on the skewer so I know where halfway is (both from the top and from the side). Hopefully this will keep my cheese log from sagging like it did the first time.
As I've said before, the first one was a learning experience and many lessons were gained from that attempt. Now I'm  trying to perfect this cheese (although improving on the taste and texture will be hard to do).
I just finished having a little of my first Stilton on some cracked peppercorn and olive oil triscuits and I still can't get over how good this cheese turned out. It was an ugly little thing but man......
I just wanted to mention the piercing thing while it was fresh on my mind and before you got to that point with your Stilton.

Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 05, 2009, 07:29:48 PM
Thanks, I appreciate it. Blues are hard cheese to make. Answers will be short today as I have a head cold, can't me from calling places for PVC though...LOL
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Tea on January 05, 2009, 07:55:33 PM
Just another note from me.  A teflon coated knitting needle is ideal for making the holes as it reduces the chance of pulling and ripping the cheese.

Cartier look after yourself and get better.  Head colds are horrible.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 05, 2009, 09:57:41 PM
Dave, when your stiltons came out of the molds were still wetish and very crumbly, very fragile?

I took mine out just now and when I flipped it a little chunk of the corner came off, no biggie, I put it back, just wanted to know what your's were like.

P.S. Pic to come later today of the Follower Emboss and my new molds.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 05, 2009, 10:51:14 PM
Thanks, Tea. Everyone I know has it right now.

Are teflon coating knitting needles easy to come by?
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 06, 2009, 01:35:17 AM
Dave I re-read this post and you did talk about how your's came out of the mold, so forget that question.

New question. After you take it out of the mold, how long do you leave it out at room temp before aging at 55 degrees F?
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 06, 2009, 01:58:51 AM
Carter....
As soon as I take it out of the mold, I smooth the log and put it in the cave.
My wife found me these 4" square tupperware containers that are about 8 to 10 inches tall.
I use a typical saucer...place a sushi mat on top of it and then cover the cheese with one of these containers (upside down without the lid). I also wet a paper towel and form it into a pyramid shape and lay it under the container as well.
I usually have a good layer of condensation on the container although the cave humidity stays at about 47%. This tells me that the humidity under the container is much higher and the cheese seems to appreciate it.
I then turn the cheese daily (always wearing sterile, powder free gloves) and keep the temp at 50 to 51 degrees F.
At about the two week point you will begin to get a slight ammonia smell from the cheese, but it should be SLIGHT. If you get a smell that is over powering or a smell that sends bystanders running from the room holding their noses then you are ripening way too quickly. I heard one person say that they used their curing Stilton to keep their children from acting up.
According to this lady all she had to do was say "If you don't straighten up, I"ll open my cave!" I guess this was enough to settle them right down. :-)
Honestly, this cheese is not that hard to make and it really does seem to be lenient to a lot of mistakes. The main things are to ripen slowly.....keep the humidity high and allow the cheese to breathe. I honestly believe that anyone can turn out a very good product by following these simple rules.
As for perfecting it.....well, that might be another story all together.

Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 06, 2009, 03:56:24 AM
Dave, where did you get your blue mold from, is it powder? How much power do you use per batch, what are your batch sizes? Thanks.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cheese Head on January 06, 2009, 11:27:48 AM
Carter

If you don't want to take the time to mail order some blue mold (http://cheeseforum.org/Glossary.htm#Penicillium_Roqueforti), you could just use some store bought blue cheese as an innoculant like I did in my Blue Cheese #1 (http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,97.0.html) & Blue Cheese #2 (http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,235.0.html).

Both of these had similar surface colors to Likesspace/Dave's, although I didn't get much inturnal blueing as my curds weren't cooked/stiff enough to give gaps in the cheese for the mold to grow in. But they still tasted good ;D.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 06, 2009, 05:44:57 PM
I've been buying my blue mold from Leeners.com. The next batch will probably come from the Dairy Connection since I've pretty much switched to them for all of my supplies.
I've been using 1/8 tsp. per two gallon batch although I really think that is more than it needed. On my next one I might try cutting this in half and see how it works out.

Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 06, 2009, 07:15:06 PM
I've been using the powder from thecheesemaker.com. Mine is 2.5 doses which is a different kind of dose than the cultures DCU. On Danlac's website he says 1-2 doses per 1000L/267 Gal. I took out my new scale and weight the contents plus what I had used before and divided it up. I went on the high side as I'd rather have too much then too little. Then I went to measure out a portion last night to rehydrate for today's batch and the scale would only read .07 grams. My scale goes to .01 grams, but it woudn't register until I hit .07-.09, so I took what I calculated out to be which was .02 for a 5 gallon batch and guessed at the amount on the scale. I then measured it and it came out to 1/16 tsp. So I will weigh cultures as they are heavier but the powder is just too light so I'll use tsp for that.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 06, 2009, 11:28:05 PM
I just talked to someone is the lab at Clover Dairy and they Pasteurize their milk at 177-178 degrees for 15 seconds. She also said that by Law (don't know if she just meant Calfornia or USA) that the container MUST say if it's ultra pasteurized. Good to know.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 07, 2009, 03:30:37 AM
Carter....
From what I've read, you should be good to go. I honestly don't know why you have been having problems getting a good curd set with this milk.
Do you use animal or vegetable rennet?
I've used the vegetable from the first and have had really good luck with it (well, except for one bottle that went bad very quickly).
In the past I have bought rennet from Leeners but did just purchase some from New England Cheese Making. I haven't tried this type as yet so I can't comment on the quality.
I'm sure you will figure out your curd set problem eventually. Regardless it looks to me like you are putting out some good quality final product. Maybe the addition of cream will help you find the curd you are looking for or maybe you will find something else. I get the feeling you won't give up until you do find the answer.

Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 07, 2009, 03:54:21 AM
No I won't Dave, but the milk in the post above is not the milk I used. I used Safeway Cheap Out of State Lucerne. So it's probably pasteurized from hell and old. I will be trying out Clover Milk as they are from Sonoma Area and I used to live up there. Read my new post on Stilton #2 and read about the new curd.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 08, 2009, 02:38:57 AM
The milk I've started with but stopped using becasue of the price is now repackaged at trader joes for a lot cheaper. Straus Creamery. They said they pasteurize at 170 F for 19 seconds, not bad.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 08, 2009, 03:24:29 AM
Wow, I wish I had that milk available in Illinois. From what I've read, anything that is pasteurized under 171 degrees should not be harmed at all. I would definately give this milk another try!
According to the Schmidling website, the real problem with milk is the fact that it is homogonized. He claims that it is the reason for an unsavory texture. Honestly I've not noticed what he describes on his site (mainly the cheese sticking to your teeth).
On the other hand, our beloved Stiltons seem to love homogonized milk so at least that's good news.
I'll be looking forward to hearing how this particular brand of milk works out for you.

Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 08, 2009, 05:00:19 AM
I haven't tried that milk in 8 years, but for a 15 gallon batch it's still going to cost me $100. Maybe I'll try local clover past/homo but fresh.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 12, 2009, 09:00:37 AM
Dave, how do you get that brown rind on your stiltons? Is it natural? I know what my recipes says, it says every 30 days scrap off the mold, so what's your procedure?
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 12, 2009, 11:32:22 AM
Yes, the brown rind is completely natural. It comes as a result of smoothing the cheese as it comes out of the mold.
I don't think I've ever seen a Stilton recipe that calls for scraping the mold. I have seen this on traditional blues and on Rouqfort but not on a Stilton.
The brown rind starts out as wrinkled and then dries back to more of a smooth surface. At least that is what I'm seeing on the first one I've tried this on.
Right now I'm having trouble regulating temperature on the one I just pierced.
Now matter what I try I can't get the temp below 50 degrees in my wine fridge. I'm afraid that this is a little bit too high since I did noticed some inner softness when I pierced and I'm also getting a really strong smell from this cheese.
The Stiltons always stink a little while maturing, but this one is nearly overpowering when I open the fridge door. I'm afraid that this is a sign of ripening too quickly and I really need to find a way to get the temp cooler.
So far I've only been making minor adjustments to the thermostadt but this morning I'm going to go ahead and set it on the max setting. Hopefully this will drop me into the mid to high 40's which might slow things down a bit.

Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 12, 2009, 06:51:15 PM
Dave, where did you get your recipe and can you post it? All the recipes I have say age at 50-55F, that's even a recipe from Danlac. What type of wine frig is it old style compressor based or Thermoelectric Cooler [TEC]? If it's the TEC then you should see if you can find a used wine frig with a compressor on craigslist. The TECs just suck, in more way than one, first off they are not efficient at all and they can't handle being on constantly. I've build custom unit before with them in it and they always fail. With a compressor based on you can have the compressor on a lot longer creating better cooling, but depending on how low the thermostat goes you might have to replace it. I always replace frig thermostats with a cheap Air Conditioning Thermostat form Honeywell. That way you don't need a temp gauge it there and it's digital so you know exactly what temp you have.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 13, 2009, 01:42:56 AM
Carter, first off, thanks for the advice on the fridge. I do have a compressor style but the thermostat is really low grade. From the minimum to the maxium setting the temp change is only 3 degrees (from 48 to 51). Maybe that's simply how a wine fridge should operate but I would think that whites should be cooler than 48 degrees.
I'm going to give your idea some thought on putting a digital thermostat on one of these and see how it goes. Surely it can't be too hard to wire it in (yeah right....I'm totally incompetent when it comes to anything electrical).
As for my Stilton recipe, I got it off of http://www.schmidling.com.
Even though I use this recipe for making the Stilton I've done a lot of extra reading on the subject and have found that many people have had problems from aging their cheese at too high of a temp. On the Schmidling website he says to keep the cheese at 60 degrees F for the first month but when I tried that I got a completely overpowering ammonia smell which I've since found out comes from ripening way too quickly.
I've had my best luck at about 48 degrees which is what I finally got my fridge at as of today. This used to be the minimum setting on this fridge, but now all of a sudden it's turned into the maxium setting. I'm not sure what's going on with it.
Anyway, the schmidling recipe has been a good starting point for me but I keep playing with the aging to see if I can turn out a better quality. I think any of the recipes will make a good cheese, it's just refining the process to your own situation that will make a great cheese.
Btw....thanks for taking the time to talk to me tonight. You cleared up a lot of questions that I had on the press. I really appreciate it.

Dave
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Cartierusm on January 13, 2009, 02:20:27 AM
No Problem, Dave, I hope it wasn't too confusing, I tend to ramble. I couldn't find a cylinder on eaby so I'm going to make a universal mounting plate so you can use any cylinder. Then I'll send the one I have and if that is too short, you can work with it in the mean time, then I can find one on ebay as I continually search for them. I'll work on it tomorrow. I don't think it will be a problem. You'd have to block it up an inch or so and press, then for the next press add another 1 inch block and you'd be good to go. The only reason I'm guessing is the amount of unpressed curds for everyone and every batch is different.
Title: Re: Pics of my Stiltons.....My eldest and it's baby brother
Post by: Likesspace on January 13, 2009, 05:41:37 PM
That sounds great, Carter. I'm looking forward to giving this a try.
Thanks,
Dave