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GENERAL CHEESE MAKING BOARDS (Specific Cheese Making in Boards above) => STANDARD METHODS - Making Cheese, Coagulation => Topic started by: darius on March 22, 2011, 11:36:51 PM

Title: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: darius on March 22, 2011, 11:36:51 PM

I keep cutting down the amount of rennet, and still get floc at less than 10 minutes, even with ~1/8 tab. in 1 gallon.

I'm using Marschall M-50 from Leeners, although will have some liquid calf rennet next month.

TIA

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: FRANCOIS on March 23, 2011, 02:06:59 AM

Can you tell us what temp and pH you are setting at?

Also, is it your own raw milk or store bought?

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: darius on March 23, 2011, 11:39:42 AM

88ºF for one make, 93ºF for another. I don't have a pH meter yet but some pH strips on order.

Thanks

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: Marta on March 23, 2011, 12:26:18 PM

I have the same problem; M-50 floccing at 6 or 7 minutes.  Store bought milk; no pH meter yet.  88 degrees for most recent one (I forget the other). 

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: Sailor Con Queso on March 23, 2011, 01:52:08 PM

Just keep reducing your rennet until your floc point is 12-15 minutes. Short floc times can contribute to bitter peptides.

IMHO the pH strips are difficult to read and not accurate enough to use for making cheese.

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: Helen on March 23, 2011, 02:40:27 PM

Darius,

I believe that one tab of Marshall M-50 is supposed to be enough to set 50 liters of milk, which is approximately 12 gallons.

Since I am out of liquid rennet, I have been using those tabs. I use a 1/6th - 1/8th of tab to set 2 gallons and get consistent floc time of 12mn. I believe that 1/8th for 1gallon is too much. For 1gallon, I would put half of what you currently use.

Helen 

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: darius on March 23, 2011, 03:04:11 PM

Sailor, I know the limitations of pH papers, but that's all I can afford for now, and they are far better than just guessing! Thanks for the info of what short floc times do...

Helen, Thanks. I did not know that about the Marshall M-50 tabs. I'll try cutting it down even more, until I can replace them with liquid calf rennet.

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: zenith1 on March 23, 2011, 03:30:25 PM

Darius-in my experience the liquid rennet is a better solution-it's easier to be precise with your quantities, and a lot of people feel it contributes to a better cheese. Of course a persons personal life choices(vegan for instance) could dictate the type of rennet that you use. Keep working on your make by cutting back on the tab until you get the flocc time that you are looking for. Cheers!

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: Helen on March 23, 2011, 04:04:53 PM

Darius,

On the packaging, it is written: Marschall m-50 Cuaja 50 litros. You may want to double check if it is also written on yours.

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: Marta on March 23, 2011, 05:05:23 PM

Heh; my recipe called for 1 & 1/2 tablets for 4 gallons.  I wonder what kind of tablets they meant.   ???

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: Helen on March 23, 2011, 05:20:07 PM

Marta,

In my (very) limited experience, no matter what a recipe tells you, you have to adjust the quantities to reflect the ingredients you are using. Of course, in terms of cultures, it also depends on the type of cheese you are making.
 

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: Marta on March 24, 2011, 11:50:49 AM

Sailor -- is "bitter peptides" a flavor problem or a food safety problem? 

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: Sailor Con Queso on March 24, 2011, 01:25:44 PM

Bitter peptides can be produced during proteolysis (the breakdown of proteins). It is not a food safety issue, but can result in bitter or "off" flavors.

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: Marta on March 24, 2011, 02:32:17 PM

Thanks; I guess I'll plod forward with the aging, anyway... if it's bitter I'm sure I'll find that out in three months  :(

Title: Re: Coagulation, Rennet - Flocculation Time Method, Reducing Rennet Amount & Consequences Of Excess Renn
Post by: Sailor Con Queso on March 24, 2011, 04:23:56 PM

If it's bitter, just put it back and age another month or two.