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GENERAL CHEESE MAKING BOARDS (Specific Cheese Making in Boards above) => Problems - Questions - Problems - Questions? => Topic started by: GlabrousD on March 08, 2014, 11:29:14 AM

Title: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on March 08, 2014, 11:29:14 AM
Hiya All,

I suspect this may be a candidate for Boofer's "Failures I Have Known" thread.

I tried making a Fourme d'Ambert as per the recipe here: http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,12164.msg94917.html#msg94917 (http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,12164.msg94917.html#msg94917)

As I ladled the curds into the mould I did feel that there was a lot of whey present but I persevered. The mould filled up so I put the excess into a gouda mould I had on standby. After brining and 12 hours drying the Tomme mould cheese is looking rather sorry as you can see in the first photo.
(http://Slumped_Cheese.jpg)

The second photo shows it after flipping with its smaller brother alongside. Then smaller one was pierced before brining as an experiment.
(http://Slumped_and_Flipped_Cheese.jpg)

As Fourme is a fairly rapid cheese to ripenting/eating can I get away with this or should I take further steps to save its sad little life?

Thanks in advance for all advice. Cheers, GD.
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: Tiarella on March 08, 2014, 12:31:21 PM
I feel for you.  I'v made some rubenesque cheeses myself although not quite this rubenesque.  If it was here I'd put a birch bark girdle on it, accept that I was venturing into unknown territory and wait to see what type of cheese it turns into.  If you want more air exposure than that would supply you could use flexible matting to create a girdle.  Did you maybe cut the curds a bit late and the bonds to H2O were too strong to drain thoroughly?    ;)
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on March 08, 2014, 12:50:05 PM
Thanks very much for the sympathy Tiarella. The curds set beautifully as per the recipe... it could well be that I didn't stir them enough. The recipe calls for one hour of stirring... I took regular breaks rather than keeping at it for the full hour. I also feel that draining the curds in a cheese-cloth lined colander before scooping into the moulds might have helped.

I'm still very much a noob so I expect mistakes... hopefully they'll still be edible though :)

Cheers, GD
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on March 08, 2014, 01:03:04 PM
Just to clarify; I scopped the curds from the pot (using a skimmer with holes in) without draining the whey. As the curds were layered into the tomme mould there were small pools of whey between the layers... I feel this may have become trapped and not drained properly.

Cheers, GD

(http://Curds_in_Moulds.jpg)
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on March 18, 2014, 12:39:39 PM
Well we're a few days in and "Slumpy" and his smaller brother are now starting to speckle with blue... more to follow :)

Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: Tiarella on March 18, 2014, 03:20:03 PM
Well we're a few days in and "Slumpy" and his smaller brother are now starting to speckle with blue... more to follow :)

What is Slumpy's younger brother's name?   ;D
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on March 19, 2014, 04:18:18 AM
I'm ashamed to say that the smaller sibling has yet to be named - I'm a terrible parent, I know :(

All suggestions gratefully received.

Cheers, GD.

PS. PLease don't anyone report me to the RSPCC (Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Cheeses)  :)
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: Andrew Marshallsay on March 19, 2014, 08:32:59 AM
Dumpy?
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: graysalchemy on March 19, 2014, 08:45:41 AM
PS. PLease don't anyone report me to the RSPCC (Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Cheeses)  :)

No they are too busy investigating Tiarella  :D :D
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: Tiarella on March 19, 2014, 11:33:37 AM
PS. PLease don't anyone report me to the RSPCC (Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Cheeses)  :)

No they are too busy investigating Tiarella  :D :D

Oh, gosh!  Now I'm really nervous.  I thought I was only being investigated by SPANC! (Society for the Prevention of Abuse and Neglect of Cheese)  I better get a clown wig and go undercover.

On a MUCH more serious note, I like the name Dumpy.  It'd be Slumpy and his sidekick little brother Dumpy.  Slumpy and Dumpy sat on a wall, Slumpy and Dumpy had a great fall, and all the King's horses and all the King's men couldn't put Slumpy and Dumpy together again.  (what were they thinking including the horses in an effort to re-assemble a broken egg?  I've known a lot of horses and not one of them would have been any good at this!)
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on March 19, 2014, 12:09:30 PM
Looks like little brother is "Dumpy" then... by popular demand  :)

Certainly agree on the egg-reconstruction front... horses don't have opposable thumbs and are liable to get in a terrible pickle using superglue. Using any other glue would be inhumane... bearing in mind what they used to make glue out of!

To quote Eddie Izzard: "Ici un cheval... Un cheval...pas de glue.  Un cheval...pas de glue.  Pas de cheval...beaucoup de glue! Oh, c'est merdeux pour le cheval!" :-(

Cheers, GD

Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: graysalchemy on March 19, 2014, 01:37:36 PM

Oh, gosh!  Now I'm really nervous.  I thought I was only being investigated by SPANC! (Society for the Prevention of Abuse and Neglect of Cheese)  I better get a clown wig and go undercover.

On a MUCH more serious note, I like the name Dumpy.  It'd be Slumpy and his sidekick little brother Dumpy.  Slumpy and Dumpy sat on a wall, Slumpy and Dumpy had a great fall, and all the King's horses and all the King's men couldn't put Slumpy and Dumpy together again.  (what were they thinking including the horses in an effort to re-assemble a broken egg?  I've known a lot of horses and not one of them would have been any good at this!)


SPANC couldn't afford the airfare, however RSPCC ............................. (http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/images/smilies/rolleye0012.gif) (http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/images/smilies/rolleye0012.gif)
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: Tiarella on March 19, 2014, 02:05:45 PM

Oh, gosh!  Now I'm really nervous.  I thought I was only being investigated by SPANC! (Society for the Prevention of Abuse and Neglect of Cheese)  I better get a clown wig and go undercover.

On a MUCH more serious note, I like the name Dumpy.  It'd be Slumpy and his sidekick little brother Dumpy.  Slumpy and Dumpy sat on a wall, Slumpy and Dumpy had a great fall, and all the King's horses and all the King's men couldn't put Slumpy and Dumpy together again.  (what were they thinking including the horses in an effort to re-assemble a broken egg?  I've known a lot of horses and not one of them would have been any good at this!)




But isn't RSPCC the British firm while I, in  the US, am mostly terrorized by the US version SPANC?

SPANC couldn't afford the airfare, however RSPCC ............................. ([url]http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/images/smilies/rolleye0012.gif[/url]) ([url]http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/images/smilies/rolleye0012.gif[/url])



Oh, I really AM in trouble!  The US, not at my bidding you understand, DOES seem to be quite disrespectful in a lot of ways and it pains me greatly when I think of it.  I try to avoid thinking of it by making cheese as often as possible.  Hey, it works for me. 
P.S. I love your whistling faces........
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: graysalchemy on March 19, 2014, 02:33:47 PM
Royal Charter I am afraid. Jurisdiction in all former colonies as well as the present commonwealth, we know no boundries.

Anyhow sovereignty doesn't seem to stop certain US agencies (http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/images/smilies/rolleye0012.gif)
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on March 19, 2014, 03:30:42 PM
This must be the friendliest "Flame War" I've ever seen  :)

Cheers, GD.

PS. I see that Edward Snowden had been on stage at TED... next thing he'll be telling us that the NSA have been spying on us using the "eyes" in Swiss Cheese!
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: graysalchemy on March 19, 2014, 03:45:54 PM
Its not a flame war at all, just a continuation of a discussion on a separate thread re Tiarella's neglected cheese.  ;)

This must be the friendliest "Flame War" I've ever seen  :)

Cheers, GD.

PS. I see that Edward Snowden had been on stage at TED... next thing he'll be telling us that the NSA have been spying on us using the "eyes" in Swiss Cheese!

Lol

'Spy on the roof of the world' is a great read, true story set in the 1950's when a Welshman was captured by the chinese on the Indo Tibetan border accused of spying. He convinced his captors that MI6 with the help of Tensing Norgay and Edmund Hillary had placed spying equipment on top of Everest. Probably the reason why the Chinese were hell bent on scaling everest in 1960. So Snowdens swiss cheese eyes theory could well be pluasable.  ;) ;)
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: Tallpoppy on March 20, 2014, 11:37:23 PM
Scared about the possibility of being spied on via my jarlsberg i've taken the drastic step of cutting all the eyes out of my cheese. (http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s9/majkow/iiiiik.gif)
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: Tiarella on March 21, 2014, 01:38:55 AM
Scared about the possibility of being spied on via my jarlsberg i've taken the drastic step of cutting all the eyes out of my cheese. ([url]http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s9/majkow/iiiiik.gif[/url])


Good thing!  Can't be too careful!!!   8)
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on March 24, 2014, 05:20:42 AM
I've seriously considered cutting the eyes out of my potatoes for the same reason.

Slumpy and Dumpy have still not learned to sit up correctly but are at least turning blue... not really smelly yet (unlike my younger Stilton) but still putting in a good effort.

Cheers, GD

Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: Tiarella on March 24, 2014, 05:26:11 AM
Love seeing the photos and look forward to the taste test write up!   ;D
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on March 24, 2014, 08:49:42 AM
Thanks very much Tiarella,

Hopefully ready to taste in another three weeks :)

Cheers, GD.
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: george on March 24, 2014, 10:35:02 AM
Just a suggestion, mostly 'cause it's fun to do -

You should very gently pet the big guy and then pet the little guy to transfer some more blue - let the runt catch up.  ;D

It's also fun to say, especially when stuck in a never-ending phone converation - "sorry, gotta go pet my cheeses!"  :P
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: Tiarella on March 24, 2014, 12:00:25 PM
Just a suggestion, mostly 'cause it's fun to do -

You should very gently pet the big guy and then pet the little guy to transfer some more blue - let the runt catch up.  ;D

It's also fun to say, especially when stuck in a never-ending phone converation - "sorry, gotta go pet my cheeses!"  :P

I think extravagant praise while patting is always a good idea.  Healthy self esteem can go a long way towards improving posture.   ^-^
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on March 24, 2014, 01:42:00 PM
Thanks very much for the advice MaryJ & Tiarella.

Personally I bring up my cheeses with Victorian values... if they don't buck up their ideas then they're being sent to the workhouse!

We'll see what a short stint as a chimney-sweep or a sewer-rat does for their behaviour! Harsh but fair, harsh but fair - I'm only doing this because I love them!

Cheers, GD.
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on March 31, 2014, 02:26:01 PM
Well Dumpy and Slumpy have reached their 25th day old and, although Dumpy is lagging, look pretty good to me. Mind you, what do I know :)

Cheers, GD.

Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: Tiarella on March 31, 2014, 02:37:35 PM
As a proud parent you have a right to be proud of how beautiful they are!!!
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on March 31, 2014, 02:46:15 PM
Thanks Tiarella - I'm choking up with emotion I'm so proud of the little fellows :)

Cheers, GD.
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: Tiarella on March 31, 2014, 03:03:50 PM
Thanks Tiarella - I'm choking up with emotion I'm so proud of the little fellows :)

Cheers, GD.

you deserve to be proud of them!  Careful parental guidance has paid off and you've raised a couple of responsible cheese citizens.
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on April 01, 2014, 03:50:09 AM
So kind of you to say so Tiarella... now I can't wait to cut them up and eat them... Oh dear there goes my Good Parenting Award :(

Cheers, GD.
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on April 15, 2014, 05:11:01 AM
An update...

well Slumpy and Dumpy have been resting in the cave with daily, half hour forays out to room temperature. I've re-peirced them and they looked to be doing fine... until yesterday.

Dumpy is still a happy little fella but slumpy has split and - I'm not sure how to put this politely - oozed :(

The top photos were taken at 36 days and the lower at 40 days. The cheese seeping from Slumpy is actually very tasty... rather Brie-like so I'm not too upset. I'll probably take a sharp knife to this misbehaving chap in the next few days and will, naturally, post pictures.

Any advice gratefully received - mocking comments, abuse and trolls are less welcome :)

Cheers, GD.

Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: graysalchemy on April 16, 2014, 10:07:50 AM
That is what usually happens to mine. I have taken to moving them to another cave at 5c, seems to be working at the moment.  :)
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on April 17, 2014, 05:34:47 AM
That is what usually happens to mine. I have taken to moving them to another cave at 5c, seems to be working at the moment.  :)

Wow I thought I was the only one with deformed Fourme! Thanks very much for letting me know I'm not alone graysalchemy :)

Well Slumpy went under the axe last night... OK, not an axe as such, but a rather sharp knife instead.

The paste was chalky in the centre with almost no trace of blue - I suspect the air-holes blocked up too fast due to the collapsing nature of the cheese. Under the rind was some goo... how on earth I managed slip-skin on a blue cheese with no Geo is beyond me! The runny section tastes fantastic... sort of brie-like. The centre tastes of a very mild blue and is pleasant enough whilst the rind is pretty funky, to be honest!

I've vacuum-wrapped one half and a quarter and put back in the cave to see what happens. The remaining quarter is being eaten apace. I will try this again though if my ongoing Stilton is a success I may start to major on those. So many cheeses and so little time :)

I'll leave Dumpy in the cave a while longer to see how the little chap progresses. Thanks again for any comments or advice.

Cheers, GD.

Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: Tomer1 on April 26, 2014, 12:00:21 PM
As FD ripens by a complex rind (some PC going on there too) I have found that lowish temp aging is a good idea after the rind is properly formed so you get good even paste softening and reach that heavenly creamy texture.
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on May 07, 2014, 05:04:14 AM
Thanks very much for the advice Tomer. I've been away on business for nearly two weeks and am now away for a diving weekend so nothing much is going on in the cave - everything is vacuum packed :(

I'll report on progress and taste next week.

Cheers, GD.

Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on May 20, 2014, 10:45:16 AM
Well I opened a 1/4 of Slumpy (the larger cheese) which I had vacuum packed. It turns out that vacuuming squeezed the living daylights out of it. Still tastes about the same but rather squishier. :(

Cheers, GD.

Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: Tomer1 on May 26, 2014, 10:14:40 PM
Looks pretty creamy!

Despite my initiall belief, It seems vaccum baging accually "freezes" the paste development of the blue cheese. (you just continue to get stronger flavor\aroma from enzymes previously produced)  it seems that it needs to continue to be aged under aerobic conditions.     
But on a possitive not, an undersalted blue cheese which turn bitter (dou to undersalting I assume as It grew both PC and PR) spent 6 months in vaccum at 6-8c and turned devine once opened. So however hopeless it might taste, bag it!
Title: Re: Fourme d'Ambert with very poor posture
Post by: GlabrousD on May 28, 2014, 12:40:20 PM
Thanks very much Tomer. One half of it is bagged and will stay that way until I either get hungry enough or need more cave space :)

I shall report back on further developments. Cheers, GD.