Lysozyme - when to use?

Walrus · July 25, 2021, 09:20:44 AM

Hi folks,
does anybody have experience using lysozyme in raw cows milk? Every semi-hard cheese I made had eyes, I suspect silage fed cow's milk. I'm trying to use lysozyme this time making Raclette and I am wondering where in the process should I add it.

I already rashly add it when I was adding cultures and bravibacterium linens but I am not sure, whether I shouldn't add it just after acidification and whether the lysozyme won't kill just administred cultures.

Please help, thanks

paulabob · July 25, 2021, 04:03:08 PM

Why don't you just do a quick pasteurization?

Just curious, I don't know anything about using lysozymes.

Mornduk · July 25, 2021, 05:12:06 PM

I have used it a few times for cheeses I plan to age whole (not cut then vacuum sealed) for years. I add it before anything else, acidification etc. occur as usual.

Walrus · July 25, 2021, 06:44:04 PM

Mornduk: Thanks :) I read some articles and found out, that lactococcus and streptococcus bacteria are not affected by this little concentration of lysozyme and even build resistance to it.

Paulabob: I dont want to spoil raw milk with pasteurization and then have to add calcium chloride back to it, lysozyme should do the work just fine, but I'm testing it for the first time so we will see :)

paulabob · July 25, 2021, 10:47:12 PM

Always interested to learn more, tell us how your lysozyme cheeses work out. :)

rsterne · July 26, 2021, 02:22:14 AM

I don't really know anything about lysozyme, but from what I have read, Clostridium bacteria are killed by Pasteurization, but not the spores.... During the aging process they activate and then the Clostridium flourishes, causes Late Blowing....

Bob

Bantams · July 26, 2021, 02:15:24 PM

Are you sure the eyes are from Clostridium and not Proprionic shermanii? Or coliform? Clostridium usually creates a very signature look - a huge horizontal rupture.
If you post pics and additional info (type of cheese, when the holes appeared) we could help you ID.

Either way, I personally would try to find out if they feed silage or fermented feeds. It's not common for very small dairies, and if you have the option I would find a source that doesn't feed it. Listeria is another potential contaminant in silage-fed raw milk...

Walrus · July 31, 2021, 02:50:21 PM

Well, there are no horizontal cracks, there are just small eyes through the whole cheese, I attached photos of gouda, butterkässe and cheddar which developed eyes. I vacpacked all cheeses and I opened them after 2 months, cheddar after 3 months. Gouda seemed to swell a bit after maybe a month in the cheese cave.

Update on the raclette - it seems, that lysozyme killed or really slowed down b.linens, because there is no development or coloring of the cheese after 4 days in the ripening box.

Bantams · July 31, 2021, 03:21:47 PM

Looks like it could be Proprionic shermanii. How is the flavor? Can you detect a Swiss-y flavor from the PS?

Walrus · August 01, 2021, 07:54:16 AM

Yes, I made Jarlsberg and the flavour is quite different, not spicy at all. A dont think there is any taste alternation linked to the eyes.

Bantams · August 01, 2021, 02:36:50 PM

I'm sorry, I really don't know. I suppose you could send a sample to a lab if you were really curious.
There are cultures that produce a bit of CO2 but I don't think it's to that extent.
As for the B linens, I wouldn't give up hope yet. Usually takes 1-2 weeks in my cave for it to show up (though I don't inoculate with it).

Mornduk · August 01, 2021, 04:29:27 PM

Quote from: aragrogy on July 31, 2021, 02:50:21 PM
Update on the raclette - it seems, that lysozyme killed or really slowed down b.linens, because there is no development or coloring of the cheese after 4 days in the ripening box.

I have developed B.Linens without any issue in lysozyme-treated Alpkäse. Washed the rind and it came up as usual. I would not give up, maybe yours will show up a few days late :)

Walrus · August 02, 2021, 07:14:45 AM

Thanks :) I boosted it a little by making a b.linens wash but still no coloring (but it's only 2 days from the first wash)

Will keep you posted

Walrus · August 05, 2021, 07:54:51 PM

After a week of washing with b. linens wash, still no coloring. I'm starting to think that there's something wrong with my starter. Is there any easy quick way to tell if the starter is alive?

mikekchar · August 06, 2021, 06:19:26 AM

My experience with b. linens not showing up is that it's usually linked to the pH of the rind being too low. This tends to happen if you haven't got geotrichum (or other yeasts) growing with some vigour on the rind. If you are doing the normal "Wash every second day" or "Wash one side and then flip every day", then make sure to wash with enough force to bring up some of the paste into the schmear. This will get lactate on the surface and encourage yeasts to get started. If you are doing the "wash every 4 days or so", then what you want to do is to make sure that the yeasts are growing well on the surface. Possibly increase the temperature a few degrees and up the humidity a bit. However, it's super important to understand that generally b. linens can't grow until *after* the yeasts have had their way with the rind. The normal pH for b. linens is 5.8 and for some strains it is as high as 6.0.