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GENERAL CHEESE MAKING BOARDS (Specific Cheese Making in Boards above) => STANDARD METHODS - Aging Cheese => Topic started by: amiriliano on September 17, 2015, 07:21:51 PM
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Hello all-
I'm trying to figure out a system for aging my triple creams (pasteurized, candidum, geo) for 60 days (I need to be compliant with FDA rules to be able to sell them). I only have one small-medium sized (4.6 CF) fridge (temp and RH controlled) that I can use. I am going to make two batches per month, approximately 14 days apart.
What are your thoughts about this process:
1) Batch A goes in at 55F and 95%RH
2) Bloom (5 days)
3) Wrap
4) Decrease to 39F and 90-95% RH
5) Batch B goes in 2 weeks later
6) Increase to 55F and 95%RH
7) Batch B blooms (5 days) gets wrapped
8) Decrease to 39F and 90-95% RH
??
Thank for any input
Cheers!
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It's not a problem unless you're trying to overlap. If you are, that might lead to slipskin from accelerating ripening at that stage?
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Yeah the point is to overlap the batches in the same aging space. That's a good point about the skip skin.
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Why do you need to age 60 days if you are pasteurizing .
Isn't that only for raw milk?
How many cheeses can that fridge hold?
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Emi----not familiar with FDA regs-----but wouldn't it just be easier to get another 4.6 fridge and controller---they can be had so inexpensively.
Qdog
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Your aging protocol is NOT FDA compliant. 39F is not considered a legal aging temperature. However, the 60 day rule is only for cheeses made with raw milk. If you are pasteurizing on site, you do not have to age for 60 days.
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Sorry - let me clarify:
The milk I'm using is bought pasteurized, but unless I pasteurize it myself in my facility, it's considered raw (crazy, I know).
I am extremely limited in the space I'm allowed to use at the industrial kitchen so I can only have one aging fridge
Sailor: are you sure? It does make sense but I couldn't find that regulation anywhere
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I don't think you get much ripening at 39º.
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You get a nice slow ripening of a bloomy at that temperature. I start my high-cream bloomies at around 50-55°F for around a week, or until well bloomed, and then they spend the rest of the time in the house fridge, at around 35°F, for about 5 more weeks ... at which time they are heavenly!
And now I find myself salivating for some more -- guess I know what I'm making this weekend!
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Fda raw protocol and it is 60 days Above 35 degrees .
But I seem to remember some one here mentioning once before about their state inspector not letting them do the cheese unless they repasteurized .
Also I think the small fridge raises the question as to weather or not any money can be made from this as it is going to be darn easy to fill this fridge up.
Are you allowed to move the cheese from the premises to another location for affinage after they are wrapped ?
I suspect that this would be allowed as long as they are kept cold in transit.
This would allow you to make 2 or possibly more makes per month if needed.
Sounds like you have an interesting project ahead of you
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@George: do you have the link to that guideline? If it's above 35 then I'm OK.
That was probably me. In PA at least, if you're not pasteurizing in a vat inside your facility, the milk is considered raw no matter what, so it has to be aged >60 days even if you started with past milk you purchased.
The money question is not a concern right now. This is a trial run in a very small side business I'm attempting. If it succeeds, I may go bigger.
@awakephd: whenever I try to age them like that, they become hard and dry. Any advice?
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The milk I'm using is bought pasteurized, but unless I pasteurize it myself in my facility, it's considered raw (crazy, I know).
Sailor: are you sure? It does make sense but I couldn't find that regulation anywhere.
Yes, you must pasteurize "in house" to qualify as pasteurized milk because you really don't know what happened to the milk before you bought it. That is also almost always a state requirement as well. I use low temperature pasteurized milk in my commercial operation, but the state actually classifies us as a raw milk cheese because we don't pasteurize in house.
39F is refrigeration temp. For some cheeses the FDA does allow aging down to 35F, but you will get almost no aging at refrigeration temps. Ironically, Listeria easily survives refrigeration temps, but can be naturally suppressed at "normal" cave temps or room temp. So, my opinion is cutting corners is a really, really bad idea on fresh cheeses.
You should carefully study the Federal Food Code, especially Federal Regs section 21 CFR 133 (http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cdrh/cfdocs/cfcfr/CFRSearch.cfm?CFRPart=133):
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Sailor - much appreciated. Just to clarify - I am not trying to cut any corners at all. This is a type of cheese which can be aged to 60 days as required, but has to be aged at lower temps. The question of what constitutes refrigerator vs aging temp is still unclear to me. I've read that FDA page several times and still can't see where it'seven addressed. Maybe it's elsewhere?
Thanks,
Emi
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Found it: "If the dairy ingredients used are not pasteurized, the cheese is cured at a temperature of not less than 35 deg. F for at least 60 days."
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Heed what sailor is pointing to as there is much new evidence that cooler temps allow the bad things in milk to get a foot hold and the good ones to be suppressed in milk and in cheese .
The more,you can stabilize the curd to allow for higher temp affinage the safer your cheese will be.
Also consider that our cutlure lives in such a sanitized world that any one that is providing a product that is not made in a lab somewhere is at a greater risk of getting the public sick as they are already on the edge as far as health goes .
My wife forces me to eat kefir and other home cultured critters every day and we never seem to get sick , add to that our home garden for veggies and local farmers market and we are full to the brim with wild organisms .
I look forward to hearing about your adventures
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Amiriliano. Just because you can do something doesn't mean that you should. The Federal Food Code states that 41F or below is refrigeration temperature. This is not generally accepted practice for aging any cheese PROPERLY. IMHO you are trying to cut corners. As I said, Listeria survives quite well at refrigeration temperatures.
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Thanks George. I have been reading a lot about it and having a background in science and bio-medical research has been very helpful. I am definitely going to heed Sailor's advice. From what I've been reading, there are two major factors that can promote listeria contamination:
1) Use of unpasteurized milk
2) pH
Although the FDA doesn't recognize the milk I will be using as pasteurized, it actually is. It is pasteurized and transported at the right temperature from the purchase point to the manufacturing area Used within 30 minutes of purchase). The pasteurization significantly decreases the risk of Listeria contamination, especially since I am not using any milk tubing to or any other transport. The pH I plan to control as best I can.
But I'm definitely taking Sailor's advice as well and will see what I can do to increase aging temp.
I have found this book to be immensely helpful and thorough:
http://www.amazon.com/American-Farmstead-Cheese-Complete-Selling/dp/1931498776/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1442941176&sr=8-1&keywords=american+farmstead+cheese (http://www.amazon.com/American-Farmstead-Cheese-Complete-Selling/dp/1931498776/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1442941176&sr=8-1&keywords=american+farmstead+cheese)
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@sailor: do you have a reference to something I can read regarding Listeria promotion in colder temps? I haven't seen that so far in anything I've read. I trust your opinion as you actually do this day in and out but would love to be able to read it.
Thank you for helping me,
Emi
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Amirilano,
Are you wanting to do this for personal use, within a restaurant environment, or commercially? My advice to you is different depending on the scenario.
Cold temps don't "promote" Listeria, but they don't discourage it either. There are several strains of bacteria that we use in cheese making that produce natural antibiotics (bacteriocins) at normal cave temps or room temp. These natural antibiotics can significantly retard or prevent Listeria growth (they also retard Clostridium and prevent late blowing).
Several studies conducted at the U of Wisconsin show that room temperature cheese is actually safer than refrigerated cheese because of these natural antibiotics. As such, Wisconsin has declared most hard, and semi-hard cheeses made from pasteurized milk to be legally "shelf stable" and do not require refrigeration at all. I am currently in discussions with tech people at the FDA to recognize the shelf stable non-refrigeration concept nationwide. There are hundreds of online references, but here is a place to start:
Listeria, Cold Temps, and Natural antibiotics (http://www.foodsafetynews.com/2015/08/listeria-and-bacteriocin-producing-starter-cultures/#.VgGl_dK6fGh)
FYI, my early background was in clinical microbiology.