Mozzarella PH took 2 days to drop

[colossus127]

Hello all! Iam glad to be here and hope to learn alot in my exploration into cheese making!

So far I have made the quick mozzarella 3 times with some decent success and wanted to try the traditional method and thats where ive had some troubles.

The first time I did it I didnt have any ph testing strips and I figured I would just test out some curd every 2 hours or so. Well after about 36 hours of waiting and the curd never stretching, I figured I missed my window and tossed out the curd. This last time I had success but it was fairly odd how it happened.

I waited the traditional time and this time I had the testing strips so I was all set to go. After 6 hours it still tested around 6-6.5 so I just kept waiting. Six hours became 16 became 24 became 32 and I kept testing and not only did it test at a ph of 6 consistently, it never wanted to stretch, but it did slightly more after each wait period. So I waited for about 50 hours total, came back after 2 days of waiting and tested it and the ph was 5.1 on the dot. I heated up the whey and got my ice bath ready and it stretched beautifully!

It ended up making some fine mozzarella for my first time using the traditional method correctly. But is there any ideas as to why it took so insanely long for my curd to drop its ph?

My recipe was essentially Gavin Webbers traditional mozzarella but cut in half, as I dont usually consume a lb or so of fresh mozzarella myself before it goes bad. I also like to use Straus milk and they come in half gallons so its easy for me to do half size recipes and not waste any cheese!

His recipe is 1 gallon of milk
1/4 tsp calcium chloride
1/8th tsp thermophilic culture
1/4 tsp rennet
1/8th tsp lipase

So I cut that in half and used exactly half for it all except the thermophilic culture, it comes in little packets pre measured to do 1 gallon of milk and it all fell in, lol, so could that maybe be why? Was the culture to strong for the amount of milk and it made it take longer to drop the ph? 

And info is much obliged, thanks a bunch all!

[River Bottom Farm]

Too much culture would have caused the opposite effect (pH would drop too quickly to catch at the right point for stretching). I think the problem lies in temperature. What temp where you ripening the milk at for that long?

[aranil]

Glad to hear that someone else is having a similar experience. I've tried making Caldwell's traditional recipe multiple times, following it exactly, and every time without fail it takes 48-54 hours for the PH to drop and the curd to become stretchable. I don't mind waiting - the recipe makes delicious cheese. Am also interested in hearing theories behind why this happens.

[mikekchar]

I'm with RBF -- temp is likely the issue.  Thermophilic cultures go very slowly under about 38 C (100 F).  If you were doing it at room temp, I could well believe that it will take a day at least.

[River Bottom Farm]

LOL I just made this recepie today (a usual for me every little while) . During the ripening stage it says to hold the temp between 95 and 98F or (and this is wrong in the book) 20 to 21C Wich is way too low. If you are measuring temp in C and use the provided temps you will have a loooong ripening time. As Mike says it should be 35C to 37C for ripening. Hope that solves it for you.

[aranil]

LOL I just made this recepie today (a usual for me every little while) . During the ripening stage it says to hold the temp between 95 and 98F or (and this is wrong in the book) 20 to 21C Wich is way too low. If you are measuring temp in C and use the provided temps you will have a loooong ripening time. As Mike says it should be 35C to 37C for ripening. Hope that solves it for you.

I noticed that temperature variation in Caldwell's book as well. Every time I use her recipes, I switch my thermometer to Fahrenheit... From my end, I ensure that I hold the temp between 95F & 98F (closer to the 98 end, to be honest).

I also did a trail at one stage where I added double the amount of cultures, just for fun, and it still took over 48 hours to get to the right PH for stretching.

How much would milk fat content affect the ripening time? I know that traditionally, Buffalo milk has a much higher fat content than cows milk... would milk with lower fat take longer to ripen to the stretching stage?

[mikekchar]

It shouldn't make a difference unless you are *very* low in fat -- in which case it won't stretch at all.  However, you're testing the pH so that's not the issue.  My only guess is that you culture is bad or that your thermometer is not measuring the temp correctly.  36 C is blood temp, so if you touch the milk at that temp, it should be neither warm not cool.  39 C is a comfortable bath temp.  42 C is a hot bath temp. (Who goes to the hot springs too often...? ;-) )  If you stick your finger in the milk at the right temp, it should be just warm, but not cozy warm.  I don't really understand why you can't crank it up all the way to 42 to make it go faster, though... I wonder if there is a reason.

[aranil]

It shouldn't make a difference unless you are *very* low in fat -- in which case it won't stretch at all.  However, you're testing the pH so that's not the issue.  My only guess is that you culture is bad or that your thermometer is not measuring the temp correctly.  36 C is blood temp, so if you touch the milk at that temp, it should be neither warm not cool.  39 C is a comfortable bath temp.  42 C is a hot bath temp. (Who goes to the hot springs too often...? ;-) )  If you stick your finger in the milk at the right temp, it should be just warm, but not cozy warm.  I don't really understand why you can't crank it up all the way to 42 to make it go faster, though... I wonder if there is a reason.

All I can think of right now is going to a hot spring and putting signs up that say "this spring is the ideal culturing XX cheese," "this spring is the temperature for cooking alpine cheese curds," etc.... What a nerd...

The thermometer should be working correctly... it's quite new. Once I get a new batch of cultures, I might give taking the temp up to 42 a go, just to see. Otherwise, there will be a regular spot in the fridge for curd to rest in. First world problems, right here.

[Susan38]

LOL I just made this recepie today (a usual for me every little while) . During the ripening stage it says to hold the temp between 95 and 98F or (and this is wrong in the book) 20 to 21C Wich is way too low.

I've made this recipe (Caldwell's) 3 times now.  Twice I used the recipe's 98F and yes the time to target pH was waaaaay longer than what is suggested.  After reading this thread I upped the cooking temperature to 105F and it was quite a bit faster, but still long.  I was afraid to up the initial ripening temperature (90F) as I didn't know what effect that might have on the subsequent renneting.  But next time I think I'll up the cooking temp to 110 or so to further reduce the cooking time.  And I need to edit her recipe to reflect what temps work best. 

PS--Caldwell's developed acid fresh cheese recipe (ricotta) has similar ripening temps for the culture and no surprise that the pH fails to drop.  I made this recently and finally upped the temp to 115F (since the culture was thermo b) to get things moving along.