Scaling - Hoop & Pressing Weight/Pressure

[coco]

How large of a mold can I use before the weight used in a recipe has to be adjusted?
I would like to make around ten pond wheels, but not sure my homemade press with weights on top would work.

[wharris]

The wieght on your cheese needs to adjust every time you adjust the dimentions of your cheese mould.

The general idea is to apply the same PSI to your cheese, regardless of the size of your mould.

So, without getting into the math of it, if you find a specific PSI that you are trying to apply to your mould, you will first need to figure out the dimentions of your mould, then calculate it's area, then determine the force (wieght) required to achieve that specific PSI. (You will find many discussions and recipes here in the forum that discuss PSI)

You will discover that maintaining the same PSI, will require much more wieght the larger your moulds get.

Its all about spreading that weight out across more area.

[coco]

The recipe I want to adjust is sort of a generic washed curd, no procedure, time, or temps set in stone. The recipe calls for 1-3 gallons and suggests pressing at 40-50 pounds for 18-24 hours. I'm not looking to replicate a cheese that will taste the same each time...just looking for efficient way to use up large volume of milk.

I appreciate your help, I'm not exactly sure what I'll be using for a mold just yet. Without knowing the size, would you still be able to guesstimate a starting weight for ten pounds?

[linuxboy]

If you're not looking for consistency, why the emphasis on starting weight? Just trying to understand.

But without knowing the mold size or final cheese type or recipe, the weight you need is anywhere from 1 ounce to 3,000 lbs. Not trying to be a jerk, there are just so many variables here. Maybe if you posted the recipe you're trying to use we can evaluate it and give you some better help in terms of the possible ranges or weights for each mold diameter size. It might be you don't even need to press at all. If you settle under whey, the curd knit may be good enough by itself.

[coco]

I went digging through the cabinets and found a 11x12 ss colander with straight sides. Does that sound large enough? The holes are the same size and as far apart as my smaller mold.

The recipe I'm using I printed off o the KFC website a few years ago and I can't find it now. What I have is two pages of directions, but I'll try to condense it.
1-3 gallons milk
1/3 to 1/2 cup culture, set 2-3 hours
add 1/2 to 2/3 tsp rennet, set 45 or up to 2 1/2 hours
cut curds and set 15min to 1 hour
stir every 15 min. or so until curds settle to bottom
pour off whey to curd level and add warm water back to original milk line
repeat 3-5 times every 15min or so
drain, add 3-4 tbsp salt
press 18-24hrs at 40-50 lbs


I don't mind trying to make different cheese recipes, but you can see how this one keeps me sane on busy days.

So what do you think, should I increase the weight?
Thanks.

[linuxboy]

That's a traditional Colby recipe, with wide variation in times. A Colby needs about 8-10 PSI commercially but can be as high as 30-40 because the style is acceptable as having mechanical openings or not having them. 11x12 you mean 11"x12"? That will accommodate nearly 5,000 cubic inches of curd. A pound of colby takes up something like 150-200 cubic inches. So that mold will fit quite a lot more than 10 lbs. You will wind up making a wide and short wheel.

To get the curds to knit there, you will need either higher temps, or you will need the pound equivalent of a range from 8-10 PSI to about 30 PSI. No time to calculate that right now, maybe someone else can help on the PSI to pounds conversion.

[Sailor Con Queso]

Weight always needs to be adjusted proportionally as the diameter of the cheese increases.

An 11" x 12" is 132 square inches of surface area. So you would need to apply 132 pounds to get just 1 pound per square inch (psi).

Gouda = 2 psi = 264 pounds
Cheddar = 10 psi = 1320 pounds

You need a smaller mold or a bigger press.

[Mondequay]

Sailor, I appreciate the clear answer. I searched the posts for a formula to calculate psi>lbs and became more confused by the more I read! Is there a chart that tells me what psi to use for each cheese type?
Christine

[coco]

Thank you, my brain would have melted if I tried to figure that on my own.
I took a look at my press and weights and I'm going to max out at 130lb.
It'll have to do and hopefully make 'something' the family will eat.


My cows don't freshen for another month. I'll be around more then, refreshing myself with other cheese recipes and ideas. Till then,
Thanks again.

[coco]

Looking around I see larger wheels produce with air cylinder pressure presses. I can seem to find any directions on how to make one. Are there any directions? My husband has a metal shop and thinks he can make one for me, but like me has quite a bit on his plate at the moment and would prefer to 'follow a recipe'.

[linuxboy]

You mean make the press or make the cylinder?

If the press, you get some stainless square stock, weld it together to make a frame, and then mount a cylinder to it. Don't think we have blueprints here, but honestly, it's just a basic frame. There are pictures here if you need a starting point.

[wharris]

You need a smaller mold or a bigger press.

"Gonna need a bigger boat.."

[coco]

Making a press. 
I explained to my husband (or more accurately complained, lol) that I was going to have issues getting enough weight on my press. He suggested making me a hydraulic jack. I think this would work the 'recipe' I've posted above.
However, in instances or recipes, when I DO want accurate and consistent PSI on larger wheels it would be best to use an air cylinder and air compressor.
And he would like to know that if he builds me another cheese press for me that that he won't be asked to build another for a looong time :0) It's a valid point, might as well be right the first time.

I've found a few threads with pics, but no real explanations as to 'how' they were put together. Do you have this kind of press or could you talk him through the building process?

[wharris]

A cheese press does not have to be very complicated.  In the end, all you are doing is just pushing down on curd.

Early presses often consisted of little more than a plank stuck in a groove on a stump, with a rock placed on the other end. And the curds in a bucked under the board getting pressed.

That is a simple lever.  And that technique can be applied in an infinite number of ways. 

I simply use a 2x4 that i bolted to my wall's stud. (in basement). and instead of a rock, i hang water buckets at the end of the arm...

Some pictures of my press and others..
https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,534.msg3264.html#msg3264
https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,4150.msg32022.html#msg32022
https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,1324.msg9738.html#msg9738

[linuxboy]

Also

https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,3949.0.html

Really, just weld some stock together, leave enough space for mold clearance, mount all the hardware and that's it.