I am going to bite the bullet and order a PH meter.
I would appreciate any input on where to order from , and brand or model you consider to be the best.
I'm not too worried about price , I just want to make sure it is reliable , and well suited to cheese making.
There are so many on the market , it is confusing , especially if you've never used one before.
Thanks in advance for any and all replies.
Jim.
I have a HM Digital pH200
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00132G102/ref=oh_details_o04_s01_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00132G102/ref=oh_details_o04_s01_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
I've never had a problem with it..
I've got an Extech pH100 and a Hanna 99161 dairy/cheese pH meter. Both have their advantages and disadvantages.
My experience with Extech has been spotty. First meter I got (via Amazon) wouldn't calibrate. I kept getting a replace electrode error. I had followed proper procedures per the manual to rehydrate the electrode and used fresh reference solutions. I called Extech and the technicians weren't very helpful, basically they followed the troubleshooting in the manual and it was obvious that was the extent of their knowledge....then to top it off, they said they could not replace it under warranty since I had owned it less than 30 days and I had to return it to the place I purchased it from for replacement.
Luckily Amazon makes replacements easy so back it went and in a couple of days it's replacement arrived. This one measured everything at a pH of 1.2! Wouldn't recognize the calibration solutions after the first calibration. Back it went.
Third one - same story. Amazon makes replacements easy so since others like the extech and had similar experienced I tried one more time. The fourth one calibrates and holds calibration. I don't trust the reading completely unless all milk in California has a pH of 6.85 to 6.99.....it does however show the correct ph in reference solution. It's good enough for a $85 dollar toy though and let's me keep some track of the pH curve.
Next I bought a Hanna 99161 pH meter which is specifically made for dairy and cheese use. Much more expensive (4X). Calibrated the first time out of the box. Easy to use and I like it a lot. I haven't had a chance to make cheese with it yet since I just got it a week ago but I've been measuring the pH of various things at various temps.
What I like about the Extech.
1. One piece - nothing to assemble prior to operation.
2. Has a flat electrode so it's easy to measure the pH of a pressed cheese without poking a hole in it or reserving curd to be the pH reference.
3. Relatively easy to use.
What I don't like about the Extech:
1. I really would prefer to buy it just once and get one that works. That being said, I of course don't know how long the instruments had been stored etc.
2. Extech customer service - come on, they should have sent me a fresh meter that they knew worked when the first one proved faulty.
3. Speed - It takes about 1-2 minutes to get a stable reading. I think it's because the temperature sensor is sloooooooooow. I'd rather have an instant reading and use a conversion chart rather than have to wait that long.
What I like about the Hanna:
1. Electrode is on a cable. NO chance of dropping the whole thing in a 3 gallon pot of warm milk (ask me how I know)
2. Faster time to a stable reading - takes on average 20 seconds depending on the temp of the milk and the electrode.
3. Separate electronics module makes it easier to read. I'll probably put a piece of velcro on the back and stick it to the cabinet near where I make cheese.
4. Accuracy seems much better. This device measures California milk at 6.65 which is more what I expect. (I measured side by side with the extech and the Hanna indicated 6.65 while the Extech measured 6.79. Both were freshly cleaned and calibrated with fresh reference solution. Hanna had a stable reading in 20 seconds, Extech stabilized in about 75 seconds.
What I don't like about the Hanna:
1. Cost is much higher.
2. Cost to replace the electrode is much higher also when it's time to change them.
3. Electrode may have to be poked into the cheese to measure pH during/after pressing although I'm going to play with it and see if I can make it work otherwise.
Which would I recommend? Being of the mindset that I don't mind paying more for quality I would of course buy the Hanna. It's made for making cheese. If you are on a budget though the extech is not a bad instrument providing you can get one that works the first time. If I lived somewhere that it took a long time to ship back and forth I am not sure I'd be willing to deal with the hassle. If you can go to an instrument store and demand they demonstrate it before you walk out the door then it's probably a good deal but I'd still choose the hanna.
Maybe I'm just lucky. I've had pretty good service from my Extech PH100. I thought at one time that it wouldn't calibrate properly so I called Extech and told them of my problems. They immediately sent a replacement electrode at no cost to me. In the end, I discovered that properly cleaning the electrode corrected the failure to calibrate issue.
The flat probe allows me to check my wheel while it's in the press to determine the proper point to remove it from the press (5.3-5.4).
They are available through Extech or through Amazon.
-Boofer-
I finally gave up on my Extech 110 and changed to Hanna -- not the REALLY expensive one, though. no problems so far.
I couldn't possibly be happier with the Hanna 99161. Insanely nice and easy to use. My latest make it measured my goats milk at what I expected (6.38) (and what is probably the real value) vs my exTech 100 which measured it at 6.90. Way worth the extra bucks.
I've got the same hannah model. I think it's fantastic and now that my wallet has forgotten how much I paid for it, I like it even more. I've had it for over a year now and it works as well now as when I got it. I've never had any problems with it. I make cheese every other weekend.
You can poke the probe right into the cheese. I don't do this often, but it works just fine.
Quote from: Smurfmacaw on August 19, 2013, 02:04:38 AM
Way worth the extra bucks.
Wow, I don't know if I'd ever be
that serious about making cheese! :o
-Boofer-
I ordered the Hanna Instruments HI98108 pHep + pH Tester with Automatic Temperature Compensation, 0.0 to 14.0 pH, +/-0.1 pH accuracy, 0.1 pH Resolution.
It's a cheaper model , I will try it out , just not ready to spend hundreds of dollars on one yet.
I will let you know how it works when I get it , should be here by next week.
So far all my cheeses have been coming out fine , without the use of a PH meter , I just can't imagine a huge improvement because of one , but we'll see.
People have been making quality cheese for hundreds of years without them.
Thanks for all the replies.
Yeah...like I said, once I got over the pain...
I got mine on ebay for $325, so a little cheaper. Still, it was more than a couple months worth of my allowance...
Quote from: Boofer on August 19, 2013, 01:20:06 PM
Quote from: Smurfmacaw on August 19, 2013, 02:04:38 AM
Way worth the extra bucks.
Wow, I don't know if I'd ever be that serious about making cheese! :o
-Boofer-
I dunno, that stack of kadova molds says to me you're pretty serious. ;)
I like the old Corning pH meters that have bnc electrode connections. On Ebay there are always many 300 and 400 series meters for sale. My current one is a 320. The meters sell for $25-$75 depending on how complete they are. Half are usually missing the arm that hold the electrode. Some are missing the 9V DC to 120V AC transformer power cord. Transformers like this are available new on Ebay for around $10.
Electrodes have a shelf life and should never be bought used. Hanna sells a dairy fc200b electrode on Amazon with a bnc connection for around $120. I'm looking for a cheaper source and will follow-up when I've located one.
Rich
Rich, I appreciate you posting about this option I hadn't heard of. Yes please, do update us when you've found that cheaper source. Thanks, Kathrin
Quote from: Smurfmacaw on August 19, 2013, 09:25:51 PM
Quote from: Boofer on August 19, 2013, 01:20:06 PM
Quote from: Smurfmacaw on August 19, 2013, 02:04:38 AM
Way worth the extra bucks.
Wow, I don't know if I'd ever be that serious about making cheese! :o
-Boofer-
I dunno, that stack of kadova molds says to me you're pretty serious. ;)
Oh yeah, I forgot....
The baby Kadova moulds were $25 each (YMMV), which at the time (and now), buying four seemed like a bargain. Let's see...Hanna meter or 16 Kadova moulds? :D
-Boofer-
Quote from: Boofer on August 20, 2013, 02:03:15 PM
Quote from: Smurfmacaw on August 19, 2013, 09:25:51 PM
Quote from: Boofer on August 19, 2013, 01:20:06 PM
Quote from: Smurfmacaw on August 19, 2013, 02:04:38 AM
Way worth the extra bucks.
Wow, I don't know if I'd ever be that serious about making cheese! :o
-Boofer-
I dunno, that stack of kadova molds says to me you're pretty serious. ;)
Oh yeah, I forgot....
The baby Kadova moulds were $25 each (YMMV), which at the time (and now), buying four seemed like a bargain. Let's see...Hanna meter or 16 Kadova moulds? :D
-Boofer-
I vote both!! ^-^
I've poked around on semi-solids cheese electrodes and have some choices depending on how much you wish to pay. For those that wish to throw the dice, there is a nice Hanna 210B double junction (new returned for some reason) electrode on Ebay for $41. This is a $165 electrode and you are risking $15 if it doesn't work.
For those that wish a new electrode with a warranty, the Sensorex S175CD-BNC on Amazon is a double junction electrode for $94.50. At the moment, this appears to be the best deal. Keep in mind that both of the electrodes above don't have temperature compensation. Also keep in mind that a double junction electrode is better than a single junction electrode.
pH is temperature dependent. Meters assume the temperature is 25C unless told otherwise. Folks making Swiss cheese would benefit from temperature compensation, those at 90F not so much. The Hanna meter in the picture a couple posts above, comes with a #202 electrode. This is a single junction electrode with temperature compensation that lists for $160. Another general name for this is a 3 in 1 electrode (working, reference, temperature). These electrodes are convenient, but expensive because the pH part of the electrode will die long before the temperature sensor. On every replacement electrode you pay around $40 to replace the temperature part of the electrode that isn't broken.
On older and some new meters, the pH and temperature have separate plugs on the meter. You can buy just the temperature sensor for around $40 new and use a pH electrode without it. For those that are frugal, you can buy a dead 3 in 1 electrode and just use the temperature part of it.
I'll try one of the Sensorex elcetrodes after my current one dies.
Rich