Won't get most of my starter equipment until later this month, but I want to try making some cream cheese until then.
I'm interested to hear anyone's favorite mesophilic culture for cream cheese, or any notes anyone has about the effects of using different ones on flavor, texture, etc. I'm assuming that a culture isn't specified in the recipe on the CFO wiki because most will work fine, but I'm guessing there will be variations depending on which is used.
I decided to go with Danisco LM57 on a whim, but it looks like I'll be waiting until the end of the month to get this as well as my other stuff. I'll update when I start the make.
So it took longer than I hoped to get the equipment together, but I finally was able to give this a shot, just as an introduction to the general processes.
I'm using the cream cheese procedure on the wiki as a set of guidelines: https://cheeseforum.org/articles/wiki-cream-cheese-making-recipe/ (https://cheeseforum.org/articles/wiki-cream-cheese-making-recipe/)
Some quick notes:
-I'm using half-and-half as a base for now. Unfortunately it's UP but I figured it would be good enough for now just to give an attempt; used a half-gallon.
-Using liquid animal rennet and CaCl2 solutions from New England Cheesemaking; used about 1/8 tsp each diluted in water
-Culture is Danisco Choozit LM57. I discovered that my scale doesn't give fine enough readings to take the mass of such small amounts of culture... Because of this, I didn't have an accurate amount of culture in DCU measured, and I just went with about 1/16 tsp of the powder dissolved in water, which I hoped was something like 1/6 DCU. This part I was unsure about, since the culture itself doesn't have guidelines for how much to use, except on this datasheet (http://www.thecheesemaker.com/content/specs_LM57.pdf), which appears to recommend 1-3 DCU per 1000 L for soft cheese.
I got the H&H up to room temp (70 F), added CaCl2 dilute, added culture dilute, added rennet dilute. I took some initial data at this time just to get a baseline:
Time: 0 h
Temp: 72.9 F
pH: 6.8
This is what I gathered today:
Time: 17.75 h
Temp: 68.5 F
pH: 6.7
I'm not seeing coagulation at this point at all, though it does appear to be thicker (will coat equipment that is dunked in). I also expected the product to be more acidified at this point, since the procedure recommends 12-15 h initial ripening before moving on to draining.
I'm guessing it's something about the culture. Did I not use enough? Is there evidence that the culture is not active? I've kept it frozen since I got it, but I let it warm up before adding it to the vat.
Should I maintain a higher vat temp instead of leaving it at 70 F?
Any thoughts on these questions or on anything else here are appreciated.
Why did you use H&H? That makes it thinner from the start. After over 17 hours, your pH was almost unchanged. Probably not enough culture. LM-57 is VERY slow to acidify. A slightly warmer temp will make things happen quicker. You do NOT need to let cultures warm up before adding.
I use Flora Danica. BTW It's mentioned about 1000 times in this forum, YOU CANNOT MAKE CHEESE WITH ULTRA PASTEURIZED MILK. Try this. Mix 1/8 teaspoon of Flora Danica into a half gallon of half and half, NOT ultra pasteurized, and let it sit on your countertop over night. In the morning empty it into some fine cheese cloth and let it drain. About 1 pound of Cream cheese. Here's (http://www.getculture.com/Flora-Danica.html) a site in WI you can buy it from. Should get it quickly.
Lv9, as Al has said, it is not that UP won't work as well; it just won't work for anything other than ricotta. (I think I have read that it works for ricotta ... seems like it should, since ricotta is heated up to 180° or so anyway!)
When I need extra fat in a cheese, I can get away with adding a relatively small amount of UP cream to my non-UP milk ... but if I try to add too much, it begins to affect the coagulation quite significantly. All that to say, if you can't get non-UP half-and-half, you might try mixing non-UP whole milk with some heavy cream, and see if you can get something usable ... if you do, let us know the results!
Al, at first I thought your link was going to be a site to get the non-UP half-and-half, and I was very excited, though a bit dubious about shipping it across the country, since I can't seem to find ANY non-UP half-and-half, or cream, around here. :(
Again. Why use half & half? You will have a better texture & more flavor if you use straight cream. If you want to reduce the fat & calories, try adding a little non-fat powdered milk instead. This adds protein without adding fats or moisture.
And... All of the latest research shows that "natural" fat has nothing to do with weight gain/loss, cholesterol, or heart problems. A couple of months back I was sitting in a bar in Atlanta and the woman next to me was an attorney with the FDA. She told me that the FDA is getting ready to release all new dietary guidelines. Among other things, they are no longer going to recommend low-fat diets. 1- They don't work. 2- They can be dangerous. For example: Some research suggests that low-fat diets can actually exacerbate problems like diabetes. Our bodies know how to process natural fat properly. It does not know how to deal with products like low-fat or skim milk.
Most commercial creams on the market are UP but they can work for making things like cream cheese. You can always add a little calcium chloride to help repair the damage from pasteurization.
Flora Danica or Aroma B are a much better choice for the culture. LM-57 is just Leuconostoc mesenteroides subsp. cremoris, a mesophilic culture that produces little or no lactic acid. What is does bring to the table is long chains of bacteria that tend to act as a natural thickener. However, FD or Aroma B both contain L. cremoris as well, and are a much better balance of bacteria.
Hi everyone, thanks for your thoughts. I've been dealing with illness the past few days, sorry for the delay.
Quote from: Sailor Con Queso
Why use half & half?
There is a store very close to my home that I elected to go to this time because I was recovering from oral surgery this weekend, so I didn't want to go very far. At this particular store, there wasn't enough cream in stock to make any significant amount of cheese, and the procedure I was using to guide me (this one (https://cheeseforum.org/articles/wiki-cream-cheese-making-recipe/)) led me to believe that H&H was a workable substitute if there were limiting circumstances, which there were. If it helps clarify, this make was mostly to practice the execution of the general process of ripening, curdling, separating, etc, and so even if it was unsuccessful or low quality, it still serves its purpose.
Quote from: awakephd
...it is not that UP won't work as well; it just won't work for anything other than ricotta.
Oops, chalk that up to ignorance. As it seems you've guessed, my impression was that it would affect the quality, not that it was cause a failure. Somehow, I managed not to come across that detail while reading up.
As far as letting the culture warm up, I was complying with this line from the culture's datasheet (//http://):
Quote from: DaniscoWhen stored at negative temperature, keep the satchet at room temperature for 30-60 minutes before opening.
I wasn't sure whether that would have any effect, but I figured I would just do it anyway to be safe.
I'm going to restart, probably this weekend. I'm sure I can get it to work now, thanks everyone. Will update again, of course.
Sailor, I'm intrigued by the statement that cream cheese can be made from UP cream. Actually, I'm surprised, since I thought UP just wouldn't form curds. But then again, I've never made cream cheese ... maybe it doesn't need the kind of curds that other cheeses do?
Lv9, Sailor has way more experience than I do, so I'd believe him over me. :)
Either way, I know we agree that less harsh pasteurization processes are easier to work with. There are a few stores nearby that source from local farms, so maybe I can find something... If not, well, I guess I'll just see what I can produce with UP.
By the way, I let the cream sit at ~70 °F for a few days to observe its progress. It was curdled a little after ~72 hours, and smelled a bit like cream cheese. Still too thin to remove any whey, of course. pH dropped to about 6.5 if I remember right. Data supports hypothesis, as it were...
I like that website that Al linked, by the way. Looks like the prices there are a bit lower than what I got them for, too.
If you want to try with heavy cream, and have an Albertsons near you, their "Everyday Essentials" cream is not UP. Works great in cheese!
Looks like I'm out of luck, don't see any of those near me. There IS a dairy store that sells only LTP milk (unclear whether they sell cream, I think it's a reasonable assumption though) only a somewhat uncomfortable distance from home.
I aim to get some FD to use by Sailor's recommendation. I am curious about simply increasing the dosage of LM-57, though I predict that that could throw off the texture somehow. The temptation to experiment is difficult to resist, as I'm sure many can relate with.
I have KAZU on hand. Any way that could help with this project? Seems like it's not really used for soft stuff.
LM-57 produces little or no lactic acid, so increasing the dosage won't help.
I believe it. Used for modifying flavor and texture, right? "Its primary purpose is to produce CO2 and diacetyl..."
After double checking, it looks like I recalled incorrectly that KAZU is not used for soft cheese. Could work, perhaps? I'm willing to sacrifice some while I wait to get FD.
Kazu also incorporates Lactobacillus helveticus, a thermophile. This is a great culture for making Gouda, but is not the best choice for cream cheese. But, if you are really itching to make cheese, go for it.
And so, more than three months later, here's what I got.
With Kazu:
HG of Hood light cream (UP) was used as the base, which produced what appeared to be almost three cups of product, if I remember correctly.
- ~1/8 tsp of Danisco KAZU1
- ~1/8 tsp of Danisco LM57
- Only a tiny drop or two of NEC liquid animal rennet
- ~1/8 tsp of NEC liquid CaCl2
Everything added to room temp cream in stockpot after dilution and covered. Here's some sporadic notes I took during ripening:
| T(h) | pH | Temp (F) |
| 0 | 6.9 | 69.4 |
| 8.66 | 6.3 | 69.2 |
| 11.66 | 5.9 | 68.8 |
| 13.75 | 5.4 | 69.4(F) |
| 16.75 | 5.0 | |
The curd was scooped into a cheesecloth sack and hung to drain for something like 12 hours.
This resulted in something more like just sour cream in both consistency and flavor. I'm guess this is because the L. helveticus was never really active at room temperature, so I didn't get any contribution from that, and I don't think there are any other aroma-producing cultures present.
Two attached pictures are of this product at the end of ripening and at the end of draining. It looked promising at first, but ended up being softer than I thought it would be after I mixed it. I added some salt and threw it in the fridge. I enjoyed using this stuff to make stroganov and various sauces, as well as putting it in tacos, but it wasn't what I was going for, which I expected thanks to Sailor's advice.
With Flora Danica:
This time I used 1 quart of Meijer 36% cream (UP).
The additives are the same as above, except with FD instead of Kazu obviously. Dosages are all halved since I only had a quart of base.
Procedure was the same. More sporadic notes:
| T(h) | pH | Temp (F) |
| 0 | 7.2 | 83.0 |
| 1 | 7.1 | 80.0 |
| 11.5 | 5.7 | 72.3 |
| 17.5 | 5.2 | 66.3 |
| 19.75 | 4.9 | 66.9 |
| 23 | 4.3 | |
| 36.25 | | |
I didn't have any data at 36h, that's just when the curd was hung. It took a longer time to form well enough to drain this time. I actually started scooping the curd around 18h to hang it, but it fell right through the cloth, so I waiting longer. It might have been because of somewhat low ripening temperature, though the pH was already lower than on the first attempt. After another day, I made sure to fold the cloth just to be sure, and no curd leaked through this time.
Two pictures are of before and after stirring the drained curd. I loved how creamy it turned out. Added some salt to bring out the flavor, and was happy that it actually tasted mildly cheesy unlike the first attempt. After refrigerating, it firmed up very nicely and is just generally very cream-cheese-like.
Just wanted to share my results.
Thanks for the cheese porn and story of your cheese. It is worth getting your first cheese from me. :)
Quote from: Kern on April 05, 2016, 11:06:04 PM
Thanks for the cheese porn and story of your cheese. It is worth getting your first cheese from me. :)
You honor me so! I've now been initiated.