Hello All,
I've been trying a few washed curd recipes lately and I have been encountering difficulties performing these directions and I wanted to see how others tackled this issue.
The latest recipe a friend shared with me says to ripen the milk to 90F then, after removing 1 gallon of water - pour 150F water in over the course of 10 minutes to achieve a 101F temp. So there's a 60 degree difference in the water but I need to raise it 11 degrees within 10 minutes and pour the whole gallon in. I was unable to accomplish this last night. My temp went up to 108.
I have other recipes that are similar. Can anyone explain how they do this correctly and also tell me why we're doing this? I understand that replacing curds with water removes the lactose and gives the cultures less to work with, but what is the objective in using hot water vs cold water vs the same temp water?
Thanks!
Sam
Hello Sam. The objective is to bring your temp up slowly without going over the 101F mark. You want to replace the same amount as the amount you have taken out by volume. The 150 degree water is a ballpark number. If your whey is getting too hot too fast, add some cool water to your 150F water to reduce the temp before adding more into the make. Basically, you are 'chasing' the 101F temp and it is not a perfect science.
Quote from: Duntov on February 26, 2017, 03:44:27 PM
Hello Sam. The objective is to bring your temp up slowly without going over the 101F mark. You want to replace the same amount as the amount you have taken out by volume. The 150 degree water is a ballpark number. If your whey is getting too hot too fast, add some cool water to your 150F water to reduce the temp before adding more into the make. Basically, you are 'chasing' the 101F temp and it is not a perfect science.
Thanks Duntov, so do I need to rigidly stick to the 10 minute window that the directions give me? That's the part that makes it difficult.
Not sure what type of cheese you are making but if it calls for 10 minutes then try to hold to that time. Some Cheddars call for the temperature to increase over 45 minutes or so. In your case, try using 140F water next time.
Duntov,
It was a Gouda recipe. Thanks for the info.
FYI - from a Gouda recipe I have for a six gallon make:
"Remove 1/3 of the whey, then add water at 130 F over 15 min. for a final temp of 98-102. (Higher temp for drier longer aging cheese). This is a very important step since it also removes some of the lactose or milk sugars which can be converted to acid by the lactic bacteria."
John,
I see now that that's your name :) Would you be willing to share the recipe? I can only make 2 gallons at the moment though.
Sam
Here ya go: http://www.cheesemaking.com/Gouda.html (http://www.cheesemaking.com/Gouda.html)
Thanks John,
Have you had good results with this one? Have you aged any for more than a year?
I started making Gouda not too long ago. I opened one up young and it was okay. I have two more in the cave that will age much longer but I really can't give you an honest critique yet.
Quote from: AeonSam on February 26, 2017, 10:54:59 PM
I can only make 2 gallons at the moment though.
Quote from: AeonSam on February 26, 2017, 03:09:51 PM
ripen the milk to 90F then, after removing 1 gallon of water - pour 150F water in over the course of 10 minutes
Sam, there's the answer - the recipe you are following must be based on a larger make, probably 4 gallons. You need to remove whey as a ratio of the total milk volume - 1/4 of the total volume, if my guess on the make size is correct. Based on the two quotes above, it sounds like you removed 1/2 of the total volume, and for that ratio, it is not surprising that adding that much 150° water back brought the temperature too high. Try removing 1/2 gallon of whey next time (=1/4 of the 2 gallon volume), or, as John says, change the temperature of the water you add.
Always something to learn ... :)
Good catch Andy! Your suggestion of removing less whey is the proper course of action. If too much whey is replaced it will have a dramatic impact on the proper acidity of the cheese.
Andy,
I just realized that this was the problem and sent it to you on a pm right before I came onto the forum! That's one adaptation that I wasn't looking at. I only thought of the cultures and the rennet but it makes sense about the heat and water volume.
Thanks :P
Quote from: AeonSam on February 26, 2017, 11:13:22 PM
Have you aged any for more than a year?
An example. (https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,11729.msg100221.html#msg100221)
-Boofer-
Nice looking Cheese!
Thanks for sharing that.
Sam
Nice discussion on this topic all. I find it very helpful. I've struggled with this and overshooting target temp a small bit too. After reading here I have a better understanding on how to get this right on my next attempt.
Mike
Let us know how it goes!
Sam
I just wanted to follow up and give AC4U to the commenters on this post. I made a washed curd Gouda Cheese today which is in the press now and nailed the washed curd portion. Removed whey, added hot water to raise temp from 90 to 92 degrees and repeated process again to hit 100 degrees, nailed both temps no overshoots like the past. Thanks all for the great explanations!
Mike
Great! Now we just have to wait 2-3 months for the taste report (or 4-6, or 9-12, or ... depending on how aged you plan to take it)!