The cheeses that I have are all developing a more pronounced pink color now. I have done some research yesterday, but I do not have a firm conclusion yet. Most of the people, and especially the people working in the cheese industry, are saying that the pink color is harmful, the cheese should be discarded and that it can even be toxic.
''Some molds only cause spoilage, while others release harmful toxins. That's the basis for distinguishing between on the one hand, blue, green, white and grey molds, which fall generally into the spoilage category and can be cut away, and on the other hand, pink, red, orange, yellow or black molds, which are potentially more dangerous. A particular patch of mold of the "wrong" color may, in fact, not be toxic, but you'd have to send a sample to a laboratory to determine that, so it's best to err on the side of caution.''
I know that a lot of people would say that this can be B. linens growing, but from what I read, B. linens do not have this kind of pink. It is more towards orange.
One more thing that is concerning me is the smell. The smell is quite bad, but not the stinky, B. linens smell, it is a powerful earthy, damp smell.
I have tried washing the cheeses with salt, but the pink color is always coming back.
When I opened one of the cheeses, the taste was the same near the rind, earthy, yeasty. A bad taste.
It looks like it is something coming from the cave medium or from the washing brine.
The humidity in my cave is quite high (87-90% RH), but it is hard to go below that because here in the UK, this is what we have outside too. For example, now, there is 9 deg C and 91% RH outside.
1. How should the cheese smell when B. linens are developing?
2. How should the cheese smell when a natural rind is developing?
3. What is your routine for keeping the cheese cave sanitized?
If this is a harmful mold/yeast, I would have to throw away all the cheeses and sanitize the cave.
In the images below, the first cheese, which has a more pronounced pink is more of a soft cheese, wetter. The second one, with less pink, is drier.
Any advice would be highly appreciated.
Couple questions. How long ago did you make this cheese? Have you been doing any surface treatment?
If you wish to dry it some a fan can help. I assume it's still chilly there in the UK and the home house is on..humdity may be lower inside.
Hello Dorchestercheese,
Thanks for the reply.
The cheese in the first image, Monterey Jack, is 16 days old and the cheese in the second image, Caerphilly, is 22 days old.
Surface treatment: White wine brine for a few days (5-7 days) and then with 20% brine (water, salt, vinegar, CaCl2) 2-3 times a week.
I measure the humidity in the cave all the time, it has always between 85-90% RH.
It does look like some sort of b linens to me just not the typical orange or yellow ones that show up.
1) linens usually smell something like sweaty socks when they really get going
2) the rind of the cheese will smell like the linens but the inner paste will not
3)I try to wipe mine out with baking soda and water (kills molds better than bleach) every month or two unless I am having problems with molds
You can see the yeast on the surface of your cheese (the white dusty coating on the surface) so that can throw off the smell for sure. Does the pink you have seem to be fuzzy like a mold?
Hello River Bottom Farm,
Thanks for the reply.
The smell is far away from a sweaty socks smell. It smells like an old cellar.
Do you think that I should discard them all and sanitize the cave?
So the white dust is yeast. They all have a level of white dust. Should they have this white yeast? Is this removed with brine?
It is not fuzzy. It looks like it is part of the rind. If you try to scrape it with your hand it will not go off. You would need to wash it and brush it to get it off.
Any suggestion?
The yeast isn't a huge deal. I dont love the taste personally but it's not a major problem. I would just try to control it before it gets too out of hand. If it was my cheese I would wait it out, keep washing to try and contol the yeast for a while and see how it turns out. If you are still concerned about the rind when the cheese is done aging just cut the rind off. Because it's not furry like a mold I would suspect it is linens of some sort. They may not smell pleasant but let them do some work and see how it goes the smell may leave as the cheese ages too
Hi - What was your goal rind? I would think the compressor on your fridge would pull your humdity lower if you kept the door closed and lowered the humdifier's output.
It's not dangerous , it looks like b linens to me , i have had a few that were more pink than normal.
I think it was caused in my case from being a little too wet for too long .
From my understanding of it is that molds on cheese do not create toxins . I read that here from Linuxboy he explained why but it was way over my head at the time I read it.
It's really a matter of is it to your liking taste wise
I found one of the post where Linuxboy talks about molds , I think there was one other also.
https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,11559.msg89652.html#msg89652 (https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,11559.msg89652.html#msg89652)
Thanks for the link, it's a really interesting thread
I just read that pink mold on rind can be from too much moisture surrounding the cheese...?
I get this color pink on my blue cheese sometimes even travels into the holes. I eat it. It only happens to my blue..I'm guessing here but the surface even after drying a week at Room temp is still moist tacky to the touch and that cave is moister.
I noticed a very similar colour on my shop bought lunch stilton today!
Thanks for all the replies.
River Bottom Farm:
Yes, the yeast is not such a concern if kept under control. I will use a brine with water, wine, CaCl2 and a lot of salt until I get rid of the yeast and then I reduce the salt concertation until I see which works the best. That was my issue too, the taste. Yeast gave an unpleasant taste to the cheese, at least this is my opinion. And it penetrated the rind, the yeast taste was quite pronounced in the cheese. This is what I will try to avoid in the future.
Dorchestercheese:
I am mainly experimenting now. I would like to see what it means to develop a rind with B. lines, a natural rind, wine washed rind, so mainly washed rinds. But also, how to avoid yeast, unwanted molds, mites...
Gregore:
Yes, I can confirm that the cave was a little too wet. I have made some changes now and the humidity is check. Thanks a lot for the Linuxboy`s link, really useful and informative! So much useful information in here.
paul pennell:
Yes, I tend to believe the same thing now. The high humidity was the issue.
dc-k:
The weather in UK is just way too wet. Haha
Just some useful information that I would like to share regarding the humidity control. This is what I did. I added a bowl with a lot of salt (300 g salt) and some water (a few Tsps) just enough to create a white thick paste. This was placed on the left side of the fridge, and also added a bowl with plain water. I need to say the humidity stayed at 78%RH from the moment when I placed this inside my cave. This worked great for me so far. More info about this here:
http://blog.cheesemaking.com/controlling-humidity-in-your-cheese-cave/ (http://blog.cheesemaking.com/controlling-humidity-in-your-cheese-cave/)
I have also sanitized my cheese cave yesterday and bought some wood boards for the cheeses to sit on. All looks way better now.
One question:
How do you tell when yeast is growing on your cheese? Is it the white dust the only sign?
All the best!
Quote from: Raz on April 03, 2018, 04:22:45 PM
Thanks for all the replies.
dc-k:
The weather in UK is just way too wet. Haha
Don't I know it! Still, never have problems keeping humidity up ;)
Hi Raz!
I think we have a similar problem (maybe). My pressed cheeses are also developing a pink sticky rind but, the most important, it smells bad as yours. It's not like "smelly socks", it's a rancid smell.
I also have the too humid cave problem, but I guess there's something more causing it. I'm getting some help in a post I opened.
Did you find a solution? Did you discover what can cause it? Are vinegar washes helping you?
drying the surface is the best thing to do , a small fan inside the cave or take it out for a few hrs per day and run a fan towards it , use your judgement as to wether it is drying to fast or not , try to shoot for 2 or 3 days .
Vinager is just more wetness .
Thanks, Gregore!
I will follow this recommendations. Vinegar has helped though, to eliminate this rancid bad smell
The pink rind is due to high humidity. The bad smell can be yeast.
What I did to reduce this:
• Sanitized the cave
• Added wood boards in the cave
• Brushed all the cheeses to remove the pink surface from the cheeses
• Washed the cheeses with saturated brine for a few days and then reduced the brine to a 20% salt brine. Then reduce the brine until you find the lowest salt content at which the rind stays stable. If you make swiss cheese with propionic, it will be challenging to reduce the mold without affecting the development of the propionic bacteria. Propionic is very salt sensitive.
• Reduced the RH so it will always be below 90% RH. The humidity will be chosen depending on the cheese rind that you are trying to develop.
• Always keep an eye on the cheeses.
Without populating the cheese rind with the yeast/mold and bacteria that you would like to grow (for example geo with b. linens) it is quite complicated to control the exact microorganism that is developing on the rind. I still need to experiment with this.
Experimenting is the best way of understanding which options work the best.