Hi. I'm SlowRain, a Canadian expat in Taiwan. I've been teaching English as a second language (ESL) here for sixteen and a half years. My cheese-making experience is almost nil. So far I've made what I think qualifies as a paneer, a queso blanco, and a queso fresco. Raw milk and rennet are hard to find here, so it may take me some time before I go down that path. For now, I'm mostly interested in fresh cheeses.
My other hobbies are books and movies, roasting coffee, rum, the Middle Ages, fountain pens, and traditional wet shaving.
You can mail order rennet. You should be able to get it shipped to Taiwan. The main issue is to find non-UHT milk, however if you have made queso fresco, then I'm guessing you are alright on that front. If you want to experiment with an aged, acid formed cheese (which I now know should be called queso seco), check out my page here: https://mikekchar.gitlab.io/mistem-cheese/ The longest I've aged one is 3 months and it was really delicious. I recommend using a normal fridge to age it as it's hard to maintain at cave temps (it never forms a proper rind, so it's hard to keep clean). It's also ridiculously good as a blue cheese if you can find yourself a tasty blue mould to inoculate it with (my wild blue is luckily quite yummy, but this is apparently quite rare).
Thanks. There's very little UHT milk here, so that's not a problem. I'll check out that queso seco.
I should also add that I've been making my own yogurt for three years now, so I'm not completely new to this sort of thing.
You're in good shape then! I'm in Japan (also used to teach EFL, but returned to IT work on contract as it is better paying ;-) ) and have to mail order everything. It's a pain (especially since I can't get a credit card until I get permanent residence... Hmmm... I should get on that... I have to beg my wife :-) ). I made acid formed cheeses for almost exactly a year. It was quite fun and you can make some nice cheeses that way. Rennet cheeses are more fun, though, I have to admit.
Yes, you know my situation exactly then.
Is there an online store (sorry, not Amazon) that is a good deal for people making cheese overseas? And, have you had to use any local substitutes for certain ingredients or equipment? For example, I'm using tofu cloth instead of cheesecloth.
SlowRain, welcome to the forum!
I bought my initial stuff from Gavin Webber's site, LittleGreenWorkshops -- mostly because I wanted to throw some money his way. I bought a mould with it and the shipping was insane. I think I paid 1/2 for the goods and 1/2 for the shipping. However, they were well packed and although somewhere along the way *someone* seems to have tried to run it over with a truck, everything arrived in good condition. I'm going to buy a few more things from cheesemaking.com next, I think. I just need cultures and the shipping seems to be about $13, which is not *so* bad... Again, I'm trying to spread the love a bit :-) I've enjoyed Gavin's videos for a long time and I really, really appreciate all the great recipes (with detailed photos) on cheesemaking.com, so giving them a bit of cash seems like the best way to encourage them to continue.
It's funny you mention cheesecloth... I'm actually using a steaming cloth. It's really coarse and very loose weave, but it works surprisingly well. I also bought some cotton fabric from the sewing store, but I like my steaming cloth better. You *might* be able to get calcium chloride locally. It's used for making pickles crisper. I thought it would be easy to get here because Japan has a very strong pickling tradition, but alas I've been unable get it.
When I first started, I didn't have any cultures either, so for a thermophilic culture I used "Bulgaria yogurt": https://www.meijibulgariayogurt.com/ (https://www.meijibulgariayogurt.com/) I know Meiji sells milk in Taiwan, so possibly you can get it. I really like this culture for cheese. The only downside is that throws some polysaccharides so the cheese tends to get pretty slimey in the first week or so. For a mesophilic culture I actually cultured it from cultured butter (sometimes called "Normandy Butter" or "Irish Butter" since those are the two main areas with a tradition of using cultured butter). I got a brand new container of butter, took a tablespoon out (having sanitised all my equipment first!) and put it in a 500ml glass jar of milk. I brought it up to 32 C to melt the butter and then held the temp at about 25 C for a day and a half. I was rewarded with full fat buttermilk (which is essentially a mesophillic yogurt). I recultured *that* again (to make sure it was full strength) and then put it in a sanitised ice cube tray and froze it. That then went into a double bagged freezer bag. When I want a buttermilk culture, I put 2 cubes in 500 ml of milk and hold it at 25 C for about a day. It's worked really well. (Funny thought: At first I was thinking, "Oh I hope this butter isn't pasteurised"... And then I thought, "How could you pasteurise butter? It would melt!" Which made me realise that I definitely could culture the buttermilk culture from butter). As you have have been making yogurt, you'll know the drill. Just remember the thermophillic is high temp and mesophillic is room temperature.
Also, when I was making the acid formed cheeses, I wanted a hoop to use as a mould. I cut the top and bottom off a plastic 500ml soda bottle and poked holes in the side (inside out) with an awl. This makes a surprisingly good hoop. You just need a bamboo mat at the bottom for it to drain. I usually put the bamboo mat on a maturation box, my cheese cloth over that and the hoop on the cheese cloth. Then I ladle the curds into the hoop. The whey drains into the maturation box. I fold the cheese cloth over the top of the hoop and put another bamboo mat on top of that. This allows you to flip the cheese easily. Anyway a 500ml soda bottle is exactly the right size for 1 liter of milk with an acid formed cheese if you want the height and width of the cheese to be about equal. A beer can will slot perfectly into the hoop, so if you fashion a follower from a piece of plastic, you can use it to add some weight. I started making another hoop from a 1.5L soda bottle, but I got tired of it and figured I might as well splash out for a proper mould.
One other thing, which I can't do in Japan, but I noticed in the UK... At a halal butcher I saw they were selling lamb stomachs. So... presumably you can get rennet from there (assuming they include the right stomach). You are probably unlikely to be able to find that in Taiwan, but you never know... In Japan, tripe is really, really popular, but I've never seen calf stomach whole. I should ask my butcher, just out of interest. Probably not cheaper than importing rennet, but it still might be interesting/educational.
[quote author=mikekchar link= (Funny thought: At first I was thinking, "Oh I hope this butter isn't pasteurised"... And then I thought, "How could you pasteurise butter? It would melt!" Which made me realise that I definitely could culture the buttermilk culture from butter).
[/quote]
Butter is pasteurized in its milk/cream form then separated and churned. Cultured butter is made the same way but meso cultures are added to the cream once separated and then ripened before churning.
Thanks. You've given me a lot to think about. Admittedly, I'm not up to speed on the science or terminology yet, just the basic steps of making yogurt & acid-based cheeses. I'll check out those websites you mentioned. They seem like good resources.
I may have misspoken when I said "tofu cloth". The package seems to indicate it's for making that radish "cake" they often eat here at breakfast.
Thanks, everyone, for the welcomes and extra information.
Ha ha! I bet you have a similar cloth to mine, then :-)
Quote from: mikekchar on June 27, 2019, 12:08:06 AMFor a mesophilic culture I actually cultured it from cultured butter (sometimes called "Normandy Butter" or "Irish Butter" since those are the two main areas with a tradition of using cultured butter). I got a brand new container of butter, took a tablespoon out (having sanitised all my equipment first!) and put it in a 500ml glass jar of milk. I brought it up to 32 C to melt the butter and then held the temp at about 25 C for a day and a half. I was rewarded with full fat buttermilk (which is essentially a mesophillic yogurt). I recultured *that* again (to make sure it was full strength) and then put it in a sanitised ice cube tray and froze it. That then went into a double bagged freezer bag. When I want a buttermilk culture, I put 2 cubes in 500 ml of milk and hold it at 25 C for about a day. It's worked really well.
If I want to make ricotta, can I use this method to make my buttermilk?
Also, we have a cheesemaker here in Taichung. He's an American who has started up his own business called Dida Creamery. I've bought a few cheeses from him before. He offers mozzarella classes every now and then, but they don't carry any of the ingredients to sell to people making it at home. Anyway, I went to see their store again today. I still don't have a source for raw milk (I don't think they're allowed to sell to the public), but I have some leads for low-temperature pasteurized milk. His wife is friendly and helpful, so I may have a knowledge resource there.
EDIT: I have to correct a comment I made above. I assumed the milk was not ultra-pasteurized because I didn't see "UHT" on the cartons. That's because it's in Chinese (duh). It turns out I'm using ultra-pasteurized milk for making yogurt, I just never thought to look at the info on the carton before.
Yes, you can make buttermilk that way (or at least I have ;-) ). Sounds like you are on the right track to get everything going!
And I may have found a source of HTST milk. Now I just need rennet, citric acid, calcium chloride, and litmus paper. But that'll all come slowly.
Ricotta doesn't need rennet, calcium chloride or litmus paper. In fact, you don't need calcium chloride unless you are using rennet.
Yeah, but I know a guy coming back this fall who used to work for a brewery and is into making kefir & yogurt, roasting coffee, etc. I'm going to hit him up for some rennet, as I know him well enough (he's bringing me a grain hand mill, too). I'm going to try to work my way up to mozzarella (and use the whey for ricotta), but I don't know a good progression from where I am right now. Any suggestions?
I picked up some citric acid and calcium chloride today, too, so I'm getting a few things in order. I never thought to ask at the shop about litmus paper, though. If I can't find that locally, I'll have to get him to bring me some.
As I'm a relative beginner, I can only tell you my suggestion. I started with acid formed cheeses and then simple semi-hard cheeses. The first 5 or s10 cheeses I did were cheeses that didn't need a lot of weight on them (in fact a couple didn't need a press at all). If you look at my Tomme thread https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,17583.0.html (https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,17583.0.html) you can see what I did. I'm currently using a small picnic cooler with frozen water bottles to keep it cold as a "cave". You have to be on top of it, but it works completely fine and cost me the equivalent of about $15 (plus a few dollars for the "maturation boxes"). The caciotta I did (https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,17667.msg135434.html#new (https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,17667.msg135434.html#new)) was super fun, though it requires a way to keep your cheese warm (I have a 15 litre pot I definitely never used for making beer back before I realised that beer making was illegal in Japan in which I suspended a 5 litre pot in which I had a mould in which the cheese was kept at a nice temp -- The same setup worked very well for cheddaring my current Caerffili).
I think my biggest advice, though, is to start out with something fresh. I ate Tomme #1 the day after I made it and to be completely honest, it's probably the cheese I enjoyed eating the most so far. There is no need to make something designed to be eaten fresh. You can practice doing makes for your cheeses and just eat them right away -- they are still good! I made a couple of cheeses with my Dad at Christmas where we didn't even have a recipe. We just made "cheese" and it was good.
Personally, I'm holding off on the pasta filata cheeses. However, when I was in the UK (back in October and again in May), I became enamoured with Romanian Cascaval cheese (which is very similar to Italian Caciocavello -- https://cheesemaking.com/collections/recipes/products/caciocavallo-recipe (https://cheesemaking.com/collections/recipes/products/caciocavallo-recipe) -- except that it is aged differently) so I'm definitely going to be making something similar soon. Mozzarella is tempting, but I would personally avoid "quick mozzarella" as milk where I am is too expensive to make mediocre cheese. And traditional Fiore di latte (cow's milk mozzarella) looks like it's going to take a fair amount of time -- so spending a whole day making cheese and then putting it on pizza... Hmmm... I'm just not sure about it. I'll have to try it at least once, anyway. Strangely mozzarella is one of the few cheeses I can buy in Japan at a reasonable price (pecorino Romano and parmesan being the other too -- expensive, but reasonably so).
Some other cheeses that are definitely on my list are feta style and haloumi. I've done cheese curds once, but would like to do it again because I didn't do particularly well. Super high on my list is also Crescenza/Stracchino https://cheesemaking.com/collections/recipes/products/crescenza-recipe (https://cheesemaking.com/collections/recipes/products/crescenza-recipe). Gavin Webber has said that he's doing a video of this style imminently, so I may wait until he puts it up to see what he's doing, but I think the make is similar enough to the caciotta that I won't have problems with it. Anyway, all of these cheese are designed to be eaten fresh so I think they are good for getting started.
Thanks. I've also had a read through your Mistem cheese.
When I started making bread, I saw Flour Water Salt Yeast by Ken Forkish was one of two books most commonly recommended. It gave beginners insight into ingredients, a bit of history, recipes, & a way to tailor the recipes to their situation. Is there a similar book for cheesemaking?
Yes! Mastering Artisan Cheesemaking by Gianaclis Caldwell. Highly recommended.
Thanks. Are there enough beginner & intermediate cheeses in here to make it worth my while, or does it get heavy into the advanced stuff?
Hi SlowRain, and welcome to the forum! I first started out with Rikki Carroll's book called "Home Cheesemaking" and find it's a great beginner's book. It also has a lot of fresh cheese recipes, that are easy to understand and follow for people new to cheesemaking.
Very soon however I started having more questions than that book would answer (although it did answer a very many questions!) and was pointed to the book that Andy recommends. It is really great, and I do think a beginner would be OK with it, but I am glad I started out as I did. It has answered about 90% of my questions thus far (the rest have been answered by members of this forum!) and has really increased my understanding and improved my cheesemaking experiences. And yes, there are recipes suited for beginner and intermediate level cheesemakers.
So I think you would do very well with either book, or both...but if I had to recommend just one book, it would be "Mastering Artisan Cheesemaking" because it is overall more comprehensive in content.
I've never read Ricki Carroll's book, but I *often* read recipes from cheesemaking.com (which is Ricki Carroll's shop). They have a ton of recipes and all of them are quite good (although sometimes a bit hard to figure out). If you are interested to know the *why* of what you are doing and not just follow a recipe, then I think Caldwell's book is the way to go. You can easily supplement with other recipes. But if you are worried that you might be overwhelmed by technical information, then you might start with Carroll's book (which has been highly recommended to me by many, many people). I actually think Caldwell's book isn't actually technical enough for me, but I'm a bit of a strange case ;-)
Mike, I wasn't going to say anything, but now that you mention it ... :)
A key difference between Caldwell and many others is that often books will try to give a large number of recipes - 200 Easy Cheeses is one such book, and the title illustrates the point. What frustrated me very early on, with such books, is that I couldn't understand what made the difference between cheese # 48 and cheese # 132; all I could do was blindly follow the recipe.
With Caldwell's book, you get some technical information, but it is not in an overly technical form, if that makes sense - it is explained in terms that do not assume you remember any of your high school biology, but yet without being simplistic or patronizing. (At least, that was my experience in reading it.)
Meanwhile, you get a smaller set of recipes, but those recipes illustrate the key different types of cheese, and she does provide a few variations to see how that basic type can be made in different ways. You can certainly simply follow her recipes (and I often do), but you can also start with her recipe and make your own variations (and I often do that, too).
Thanks, everyone. You've given me a good direction to go.