I was faced with higher humidity outside my cave than inside. :-\ Then I read some threads here about fans and draping cheesecloth with a source of water....
A problem. ???
As I read about the fans, I glanced over at my old (8 years) laptop computer that hadn't been powered up in quite some time. Under it sat its nondescript laptop cooler, also unused in the same length of time.
<Momentary flash of inspiration> A solution. ;D
The laptop cooler was powered through a USB cable connected to the laptop computer. The USB cable delivered +5 volts to the cooler unit. But wait, I must have a 5 volt adapter somewhere in the house. Ta-da!!! I did. I opened up the cooler just to see about reversing the fan polarity, but that wasn't possible. And in the end it didn't matter at all anyway, because the unit works just fine to solve my humidity problem. I improved the humidity from around 50% to 80%.
You see that the temperature is wrong. That too is about to be corrected. I ordered a Johnson Controls temp controller. The next question on my cheese horizon is which style will be first to benefit from the improved curing conditions. I'm really leaning towards trying the colby again. Eh, it's all good. Whichever I do will be better, I am now certain.
-Boofer-
Boofer, great idea on laptop cooler for low cost fan, I never realized they were so simple inside ;D.
My cheese cave fridge-freezer is forced air type and thus very low humidity as air is dehumidified and water goes in evaporation tray underneath fridge. Air comes into fridge via vents that are hard to put a cloth-wick over. Thus I'm using large plastic Tupperware type boxes with lids cracked. The problem with that is the boxes use up lots of room, so I can't house many fridges. Your computer fan trick could for me also. I don't have a lap top cooler but I do have a couple spare computer fans lying around. Are they also 5V, if so I just a 5 volt mini wall plug transformer, and then I need some sort of housing for the fan, any ideas?
Thx again for idea.
Good job Boofer.
My Mini Cave has them built in. The Haier NuCool fridges are all like that. No Freon! I just drape cheese cloth in the back and always have 80 to 90% humdity.
Debi, you're lucky. I wish mine had been that easy.
CH, the original cost (several years ago) of this laptop cooler was under $20. Now you could probably find one for half that or for FREE after rebate. You could probably piece one together yourself, but why bother if a workable solution is so close at hand?
I Googled laptop coolers and found one for $11.
http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=laptop+coolers+deals&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=13821217417664115607&ei=t46lSsuxMIfYsgOsg8WMDw&sa=X&oi=product_catalog_result&ct=result&resnum=4#ps-sellers (http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=laptop+coolers+deals&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=13821217417664115607&ei=t46lSsuxMIfYsgOsg8WMDw&sa=X&oi=product_catalog_result&ct=result&resnum=4#ps-sellers)
-Boofer-
I actually bought this model for the fans with that in mind. Wish they came bigger but the biggest I saw was 1.7 cuft.
Well you did a great job kiddo it should work well for you. I wonder how many fans you would need for a full sized fridge? Old computer fans would work well to.
hey debi, how often do you have to remoisten the cheesecloth? I have a small fridge that is a small wine cooler I might could do that with. And loose the plastic boxes in my other fridge. T-Bird
I might spray once a week if the cave is full of new cheese (more moisture given up by the cheeses) or every few days if the cheeses are a month old or older. I just go by the meter - when humidty starts to drop I spray the cheese cloths.
I finally solved my low humidity problem, after unsuccessfully trying the computer fan approach, described in this thread: the humidity in my dedicated small refrigerator did not go much higher than 73% at a temperature of 12 Celsius, which was too low for my Camembert. The outside humidity (here in the tropics) is around 85%.
Yesterday I found this little gadget (see pic): it's an ionizer/humidifier, which fits nicely into the door tray of the fridge. No noise at all and the humidity now goes to 90%.
Price 1,500.= Thai Baht, about 45.= US$. Quite expensive maybe, but worthwhile in my case.
Very nice Eric,
That's my solution too. About 6 months ago I bought a second hand ionizer/humidifier, connected it through a timer which alternates the on/off periods because my instrument is suposed to be fitted to a larger room then the ageing fridge. Mostly recommended.
Thanks for that photo, Eric. My humidity has been over 80% without the wetted cloth over the fans. The cheeses are providing enough moisture to get the job done. In fact, the moisture is so plentiful that I have to wipe it from the cave walls. Where is it coming from? All the cheeses in there are either vacuum-sealed or wax-sealed. ???
-Boofer-
Humidity control seems to be rather weird sometimes. Here in the tropics, during the rainy season, the ambient air humidity is 85 to 90%. Inside my fridge I didn't get more than 73%, even when putting water and wet cloth in it. I start to wonder if my hygrometer is giving me the correct values.
Eric, I also don't trust my digital gauge, especailly at high readings so I've just ordered an analog one to check it.
If you have a radiant style then yes that would be strange but if you have a forced air fridge then the air is dehumidified normally with an evaporation tray underneath.
Eric, how long do you keep the hygrometer in the fridge before taking a reading? Mine goes nuts when I take it to a different temperature (like out from my basement) and it takes a long time, like an hour, for it to get proper readings again.
Well, my little cheapie Walmart hygrometer went on the fritz. The LCD display got all screwy. Apparently too much humidity. Go figure! >:(
I bought one at Bed, Bath, & Beyond today. Hopefully it will be better.
Really...when I go to turn the cheese wheels, the wax coatings and vacuum seals are moist. I guess I need to air the cave out periodically to bleed off some of the moisture.
-Boofer-
Here's the replacement hygrometer from Bed, Bath & Beyond. Unfortunately this one also has to go inside the cave and I have to open the door to read it. I'd like to get one that puts the thermometer/humidity sensors on a tether and the actual device remains outside the cave.
-Boofer-
Eric,
John is right, if you have a forced air fridge then the air is dehumidified. Since this was my problem too, I adjusted my humidifier almost to maximum and connected it through a timer, 15 minutes ON, 30 minutes OFF, around the clock. This method improved the humidity control.
Riha and others,
You may check the humidity meter calibration by putting a very saturated cloth on the meter's sensing opening for 1-3 hours. The reading is the equivalent to 100%.
Riha, my hygrometer is analogue and it is inside the fridge all the time. The thing (humidity/temperature meter) is a whopping 5 inches in diameter, so I think it might be more intended as an ornament to hang on the wall, than to measure humidity accurately.
Alex, txs for the tip. I did the test with the saturated cloth. The humidity doesn't even reach 90%. So time to invest in a new and better one.
Eric,
That doesn't mean that the meter doesn't reach the 100%, it means that the calibration is very poor. At about 90% shown, is your 100%. The problem is that the you can not be sure that if you divide the 90 in 100 units, the scale will be still linear.
Alex, guess what? When I took the hygro/thermometer out of the fridge and wanted to give it to my wife, I noticed that there were 2 holes in the back. Inside there were 2 potentiometer like screws to calibrate both the hygrometer and thermometer. I knew the thermometer was measuring correctly, because I compared it with a digital one I have. As far as the hygrometer is concerned, I followed your advice, wrapped it in a soaked piece of cloth and after waiting long enough, I cranked it up to 100%. So txs again for the calibration suggestion.
Lucky you Eric :D,
In mine I didn't find potentiometers, the inside looks like some encapsulated chip. Nothing adjustable :(.
we have a self defrost type refridge, do we need to put up Cheese cloth in this one? also where do you fiind those Vac bags, one of the companies went out of business, I guess we will have to buy a control device for temp, and a Hydrometer. THanks
Hi farmsteader, welcome to the forum!
Most fridge's thermostats will not allow them to run warm enough for a cheese cave thus many people buy an external thermostat controller. You will have very low humidity if your fridge is forced air, these types have an external evaporation tray underneath. If low humidity you will have to add it or use plastic boxes and crack the lid to release excess humidity. That's what I've been using for the last year and I finally ordered a ultrasonic humidifier that I am going to put inside. Some info on hygrometers here (https://cheeseforum.org/Making/Hygrometers.htm), I find that if condensation inside my box then too much humidity, no condensation then too little. I don't like vacuum bag sealing and am still trying to work with natural rinds for my pressed cheeses.
Boofer,
I have the same device to measure humidity that you do. Mine tells me that the cave is about 95% humid all the time and I don't have any water in it, just a few drying cheeses. That seems real high to me. Do you find your device to be accurate?
Boofer,
I just ran across your post discussing thermometer and hygrometer #3. The one I am referencing in my above is the one pictured in this post.
Ben - If you're referring to the La Crosse Thermometer/Hygrometer, I've had one sensor in the cave measuring around 90%RH for most of the time with a temp around 54-57 F. The cheeses in there are waxed or vacuum-sealed and there is no added moisture such as a rag hung across the fans. The fans run continuously to circulate the air inside anyway. I have to periodically wipe the walls down to clear the moisture and any mold that starts to show. I wipe with paper towels and then sweep with a Clorox antibacterial towelette.
I have a second sensor placed outside in the weather as a sanity check. It has been cold and rainy for the past couple weeks here in the Pacific Northwest. Even when the temp is low and it is raining, the sensor measures around 94%RH ??? . Hello?! It's raining...shouldn't it be reading around 99%RH? :o
So there it is. I think after playing around with these things for a while, I am convinced it's not that far off from using a Ouija board. If you put them all side by side, they would all register something different. I know because I put the three of them that I have side by side and none of the temps or RH readings matched. Now I'm strictly talking about the lower end devices. I would expect that if you ponied up the cash for a several hundred dollar unit, you might expect to get tighter performance. But then, who's going to do that for what we use these things for? Not this cheeser.
Right now while I type this my cave out in the garage is measuring 55.9F/88%RH on the La Crosse weather station in front of me. When I push the button to check readings outside: 41.9F/82%RH. The deck outside is wet from the rain. 11:20PM.
Hope that gives you some more data to ponder... ;) .
-Boofer-
Has anyone tried using one of these ultrasonic misters?
http://www.mainlandmart.com/foggers.html (http://www.mainlandmart.com/foggers.html)
Would probably need some sort of a timer, connected...
Yes, I use an ultrasonic humidifier. It has a knob to adjust the mist intensity, in addition to that, I've connected it through a timer with working cycle of 15 min ON and 30 min OFF. I used the adjustment knob to get the desired humidity monitored by a humidity meter.
Quote from: Eric in Thailand on October 10, 2009, 04:24:35 AM
I finally solved my low humidity problem, after unsuccessfully trying the computer fan approach, described in this thread: the humidity in my dedicated small refrigerator did not go much higher than 73% at a temperature of 12 Celsius, which was too low for my Camembert. The outside humidity (here in the tropics) is around 85%.
Yesterday I found this little gadget (see pic): it's an ionizer/humidifier, which fits nicely into the door tray of the fridge. No noise at all and the humidity now goes to 90%.
Price 1,500.= Thai Baht, about 45.= US$. Quite expensive maybe, but worthwhile in my case.
Eric,I bought the exact same humidier from ebay cost me 886 baht
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120517009890&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120517009890&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT)
works really well
I was thinking of using one of these ( http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/1UHG3?Pid=search (http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/1UHG3?Pid=search) ) and drilling a hole into the side of my refrigerator to pump in humidifier "vapor"... Right now my fridge/cave has vacuum-sealed cheeses, but to do brie and camambert (among others) properly I've got to boost the humidity at times.
Thoughts?
So I picked up one of these: http://tinyurl.com/23tnh8g (http://tinyurl.com/23tnh8g) at Walgreen's... It fit very nicely in my "tall dorm fridge" cave. I will attach it to one of these ( http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/1UHG3 (http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/1UHG3) ) to finish the job... Voila! Humidty problems solved.
How big is it? Will it hold a 2-liter bottle?
Nope.. It'll only hold one of the standard 16-12 oz water bottles. I did find a little problem with it, though.. The cap threads on one style of water bottle would not work with it -- I instead had to use a different bottle with "finer" threads.
I ended up using two cookie sheets filled with water on my fridge. That gave the water enough surface area to evaporate and keep my humidity at about 75%.
Good enough for me.
Lots of small humidifier options now. Some under USD $7.00 at AliExpress
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001605120175.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.655a2850FcyUuC&algo_pvid=a3e8d6fa-6ef1-4c13-a3c0-9f7dec80fda6&algo_expid=a3e8d6fa-6ef1-4c13-a3c0-9f7dec80fda6-19&btsid=0b0a556e16058935489123310e895e&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_ (https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001605120175.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.655a2850FcyUuC&algo_pvid=a3e8d6fa-6ef1-4c13-a3c0-9f7dec80fda6&algo_expid=a3e8d6fa-6ef1-4c13-a3c0-9f7dec80fda6-19&btsid=0b0a556e16058935489123310e895e&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_)
200ML USB powered humidifier.
Found a portable humidifier on EBAY for under USD $5. I ordered one.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/402514568338 (https://www.ebay.com/itm/402514568338)