From US based CulinaryCookware (http://www.culinarycookware.com/) I ordered a French Matfer Bourgeat brand Salometer (http://www.culinarycookware.com/salometer.html).
I found digital Salometer's but for several hundred USD, so went with this traditional glass analog hydrometer style Salometer for USD14.07 plus shipping ;).
It has a special scale for measuring the sodium chloride salt % readings of my brine solutions, plus a normal standard specific gravity scale.
While a tall test jar would be easier to see the exact measurement, this model Salometer is only 200 mm/7-7/8 in long so I plan on placing it directly in the brine as easier and faster and I should be able to see an exact enough reading for my needs.
I re-use my brine and the reason for getting this meter is:
- Salt content in cheese is critical for it's development and for my brine bathed cheeses, I was just bathing them in a small volume ratio of saturated brine, which as small was depleting in % salt as salt was absorbed by the cheese. This would have resulted in a non-consistant nor optimal % salt in my final cheeses.
- So I did some research on brines and brine salting cheeses (https://cheeseforum.org/Making/Making.htm) and recommendations are not to use saturated brine but rather brines between 18-23% which without this tool I could not measure.
I've started a separate topic for what salt % for brine bathing cheeses (https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,2080.0.html) as this thread is for Salometers.
John this is scarey. Are you sure we are not long lost twins or something? I just ordered a salometer and new pH meter from Amazon last week. I ordered the digital one though.
Oh I just noticed you didn't order a test jar. These things are much easier to read with a test jar. It's not like a thermometer where a little line moves on the scale with these things the scale stays the same it's the meter that moves. It measures by floating in the jar. You take one reading in the plain water than one in the salted water and compare. I can't explain it well without pictures but here's a link to my explainantion of using the hydrometer on my website. You'll see what I mean. It works the same way I believe.
http://www.deejayssmokepit.net/microbrew3.htm (http://www.deejayssmokepit.net/microbrew3.htm)
Debi, I assume you mean digital pH meter as the only digital salometer I could find was this one (http://www.misco.com/products/PA202-76-168.html) for USD435.
The store I ordered from had no tall test jar, so as above I was just going to place it directly in the brine.
The effect you describe is surface tension of the fluid which along with how oil or water wet the salometer is, governs how high the fluid will climb, same effect is for capillary forces and why car washing sponges will soak up water. For now I'll try and visually correct for that effect. If not I can try and find my old test jar from beer making days when I was teenager ::).
Well yes the pH tester is digital but so isn't the salinity tester - just a cheapy
EDIT: This was advertized as a salinity tester but now that it in it looks like a pool tester ... :-\ I removed the picture.
The Beverage Peoples brine page states Specific Gravity of 1.148-1.169 for a heavy brine.
I just use my wine hydrometer to make this.
Good one Wayne. I have a hydrometer someplace ...
I made a table that has the Baume, SG, and Salometer degrees, as well as various other handy information. This is for measurements at 60 degrees. For every 10 degrees F, adjust by 1 salometer degree. You can use a regular beer/wine hydrometer to make up brines without having to buy a salometer.
As I used to keep marine fish, I purchased a refractometer to monitor salinity levels like this:
http://www.northcoastmarines.com/refract.htm (http://www.northcoastmarines.com/refract.htm)
Really simple to use, quite accurate once calibrated and no parallax error or forgetting which part of the miniscus to check against!
Cheers,
Alan
I was at Three Shepherds in Warren VT and took a 3 day class that was great! If you have a chance check it out they are on Facebook too. The owner Larry recommended a Hydrometer that has a 0.0 to 26.5% scale. He also said to save your money and use Ph strips because the meters mess up due to the milk protein build up and calibration can be a pain. He did say that if you get one always check the reading against the strips once in awhile. Have you any tips or plans on setting up an aging unit of some kind?
Quote from: motochef on October 27, 2010, 02:58:27 AMHe also said to save your money and use Ph strips because the meters mess up due to the milk protein build up and calibration can be a pain.
I thought that prevailing wisdom here stated that pH strips were too lax in precision and that a .01 readout was helpful? Which pH strips does he use?
You can use any hydrometer (Baume, Salometer, SG) with my conversion chart http://www.wacheese.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=65 (http://www.wacheese.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=65) . A cheap wine hydrometer works just fine.
strips are subject to user error, but can be used if the operator is good. pH meters do need maintenance, but good meters with proper care can last for many years. I'm going on 1 ISFET probe for 7 years now, and it doesn't need that much calibration because the readings don't drift.
Quote from: linuxboy on October 27, 2010, 09:33:21 PM
A cheap wine hydrometer works just fine.
I use that, and these instructions here: (http://www.thebeveragepeople.com/pdf/webcheesepdf/Brining%20Instructions.pdf)
Quote from: Groves on October 27, 2010, 09:13:03 PM
Quote from: motochef on October 27, 2010, 02:58:27 AMHe also said to save your money and use Ph strips because the meters mess up due to the milk protein build up and calibration can be a pain.
I thought that prevailing wisdom here stated that pH strips were too lax in precision and that a .01 readout was helpful? Which pH strips does he use?
(http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs807.snc4/68792_1668464236508_1384395745_1817000_3131321_n.jpg)
These were what he used for ph testing. I'm still looking for them. I got some at a winemaker store by me. He has been making cheese for years so I'm sure that his eye is just as good! After all what were they using 150 years ago?
Quote from: Wayne Harris on October 27, 2010, 11:39:17 PM
Quote from: linuxboy on October 27, 2010, 09:33:21 PM
A cheap wine hydrometer works just fine.
I use that, and these instructions here: (http://www.thebeveragepeople.com/pdf/webcheesepdf/Brining%20Instructions.pdf)
Thanks Wayne!
Quote from: motochef on October 28, 2010, 02:00:08 AM
Quote from: Groves on October 27, 2010, 09:13:03 PM
Quote from: motochef on October 27, 2010, 02:58:27 AMHe also said to save your money and use Ph strips because the meters mess up due to the milk protein build up and calibration can be a pain.
I thought that prevailing wisdom here stated that pH strips were too lax in precision and that a .01 readout was helpful? Which pH strips does he use?
These were what he used for ph testing. I'm still looking for them. I got some at a winemaker store by me. He has been making cheese for years so I'm sure that his eye is just as good! After all what were they using 150 years ago?
As far as I know, 150 years ago they had cheese makers who did not check pH.
We have that today too. I think that there are some here in this forum that really don't need a pH meter either. Those folks use the look, feel, taste, and sound of the curd to determine its state. But then again, they made cheese ever day. I am not in that crowd.
I'm sorry. I would not use those test strips.
They are just not accurate enough. And I since many of my processes depend achieving a certain pH marker, in a certain time, I do not understand how those would effectively be used.
For example, if i were looking to determine a pH drop of pH .1, or drain at pH6.1 or salt at pH5.3. How exactly is that done?
Do you go throug a bunch of these strips till you see what you are looking for? I don't get it.
It kinda seems like these strips gives one a point-in-time, general understanding of the pH, when what most need are real-time accurate reads of the pH.
But then again, this comes from one that has never used the strips.
I could be off-base.
I get your point Wayne. Since I'm just starting off with this I find that all of this forum's information to be awesome. Are there any brands/models that you guys recommend. I think about what my instructor had said and since the class his information is all that I had to go on. I would like to find something that is cheap easy to clean and calibrate. What do you guys and gals use?
I asked Dr.Larry about Ricotta and PH meters vs the test strips here is what he said:
Hi Robert,
Thanks for the link to the forum. It is true that some cheesemakers are very reliant on acidity measurement (TA and/or pH). As we mentioned, it definitely can be an aid for gaining insight on the biochemistry of the process, and for some cheeses (e.g., mozzarella), it can help a lot with knowing exactly when a critical step needs to occur (stretching at pH 5.3).
Both Linda and I have had many years of lab experience, and understand the value of getting precise measurements. However, we learned cheesemaking from Europeans who take a sensory approach to cheesemaking. Using your eyes, olfactory sense, taste, and feel can also give tremendous insight into the process as well. We are not trying to say that one way is right and will make better cheese--but it is interesting to note that on our 1997 trip to Europe, only one out of 28 cheesemakers measured acidity with lab devices. And we have consulted with many, many farms who have had major issues with expensive pH meters, so the strips end up being a better investment.
As far as the ricotta, whenever we make mozzarella I always make ricotta from the whey, and it works extremely reliably. However, we have never made mozzarella using citric acid. I do know that when we have tried making ricotta from whey that is very acidic (below pH 4.7) it can be very tricky to make ricotta from it. So perhaps the citric acid is playing a roll. It would be helpful to know what your friend is observing and what procedure he is using. Just let us know.
When is your wife coming to Vermont? It would be great to see her (and you) again.
Keep us updated on your progress.
Best wishes,
Larry and Linda
Linda Faillace, author of Mad Sheep from Chelsea Green Publishing Website: http://www.chelseagreen.com/2006/items/madsheep (http://www.chelseagreen.com/2006/items/madsheep) Dr. Larry and Linda Faillace Three Shepherds of the Mad River Valley 108 Roxbury Mountain Road Warren, VT 05674 Tel: 802-496-3998 www.threeshepherdscheese.com (http://www.threeshepherdscheese.com)