I'm making some traditional mozzarella using a thermophilic culture. I'm cooking the mat of curds now at 100F, and so far (45min) I'm not seeing much of a pH drop (currently at 6.35). I might've got the curds up to 110F for awhile before I drained them initially, would that temp have killed the bacterial culture? I probably just need to have patience, it supposedly takes a few hours for the drop to occur. I just thought I'd see a somewhat uniform drop.
I see that thermophilic cultures survive to 130F so that must not be my problem. Hopefully the pH will drop on this stuff, it'll go nicely with our meatballs for supper.
I also took some of the wife's meatball mix and wrapped it around a frozen tube of my ricotta. I'm going to bake that like a meatloaf and then slice it and serve with sauce. I think it'll be tasty. I need to use up some ricotta, I've got quite a bit now.
Too late, i guess you've already drained it. At this pH mozz won't stretch. The tip is to get propper pH before you start cooking.
If you raise the temp as high as 130F you'll get rubber mozz even if you hit the final pH point
The recipe says to drain and then cook the curd mass for a few hours, pouring off whey as it comes off the curd.
I'm down to pH 5.75, but its going more slowly than it was supposed to. I just wonder why this culture is not more active? What is the optimum temp for thermophilic bacteria?
For hand stretching, it is recommended that pH be closer to 5, than 5.4. Some time the curd mass is left overnight to acidify, though I haven't done that myself. My curd is kept at a constant temp of 43C until pH reaches between 5 and 5.4
Although it doesn't always work still. Tried making bocconcini last week, and even though pH reaches 5, it was still a crumbly mess. Very disheartening as I am not sure what went wrong.
How did your's turn out?
I checked my table again. 130F is appr 55C, right? IMHO it's much too high. I'm curious Lennie how did it turn out?
Finally have some news, and its good. After 5 hours I got a pH of 5.32 and decided to try working a couple small pieces. It melted together but wasn't quite there. So I waited another 30min and then checked and the pH was 5.15. I cut the curd into chunks and melted it in a bowl with some 170F water, then when I got a ball I worked it on a mat and kept it warm in a pot of water when it cooled off too much. Finally I had a reasonable ball, maybe not quite as shiny and smooth as I've had in the past but it looks good enough. Might have needed some more kneading, I don't know. I put it in a bowl of brine to cool, I'll check later to see if it will melt. That was quite a bit of work for one pound of cheese! Done just in time for dinner and the Super Bowl. Dinner includes a meatloaf with ricotta in the middle.
Looks like it could use a tad more heating and stretching but it looks okay. Good job being patient this can be an agrivating cheese to wait for.
So more heating and stretching helps? I didn't know if it would do anything more. I'll certainly keep that in mind for the next one. I knew it wasn't perfect, I've had smoother/shinier mozzs.
Heating and stretching is what makes it mozzarella...I've personally never made a cultured mozzarella all in one day. I normally cut the curd, rinse it and allow it to acidify at room temperature overnight before trying to spin it. Giving it that much time, I've never had any trouble getting smooth, shiny mozz.
I see, I was kneading it more than stretching it.
I wonder if I could reheat the ball and stretch it some more?
I would take off a piece of it and try it. Just heat a couple of cups of water in your microwave to about 175 degrees and swirl a 1 inch piece of curd in it. If it will stretch well without breaking, I think you'll have good luck with re-heating and stretching the whole ball.
I tried it and the stuff only stretched marginally. Maybe my pH wasn't spot on. I cubed the ball again and think I'll let it sit overnight at room temp, then try the heating again in the morning. This continues to be a learning experience.
Can the pH not get too low with the traditional method?
The pieces I tried to stretch needed salt but they were tasty and had a really squeaky texture.
I've made blobs of not stretched mozzarella and brought it in the physical therapy classes for rehab the next day. The heat and stretching movements are good for therapy. OF course we had to use a microwave but it worked well.
Karen, I agree with making cutured Mozz, cutting the curds and letting acidify untilo the next morning. I have never had a failure making Moz this way.
Lennie, yes the pH can get too low. You should have been ready when your pH was at 5.32. The shiny texture won't happen without stretching. You probably just needed to heat it more and stretchhhhhhhhhhh.
Thanks for the insights folks, I continue to learn and thats great.
I left the curds at room temp overnight then heated in water and stretched some more this morning. I was pressed for time and didn't take a pH (not much whey anyway), and I probably should've given it more stretching. Still, it started to look shinier and I think it was closer to the proper outcome. I salted it as I was stretching towards the end, don't know what that might do but without salt this cheese isn't that tasty by itself. Here's a pic of the final outcome for this project.
Followup questions for anyone.
1) Is there anything besides pH that determines the stretchiness of this cheese?
2) Can you heat/stretch too much? Does it get tougher?
3) Is the texture supposed to be squeaky on your teeth when eaten cold?
4) Can you salt the cheese or is brining the only way?
5) Does lipase affect the process? (I added double the amount I was supposed to on this one.)
I can answer a couple of your questions:
2) Can you heat/stretch too much? Does it get tougher?
Yes, you can heat and stretch it too much, which will result in a tough, unpleasant cheese. It really does get easier to figure it out with experience.
3) Is the texture supposed to be squeaky on your teeth when eaten cold?
Yep, that's fresh mozz!
4) Can you salt the cheese or is brining the only way?
I heat and stretch my mozz by using about a gallon of reserved whey with a half cup of kosher salt added to it. It adds a nice amount of salt without it being grainy. I don't typically brine my mozzarella.
I'll leave the other questions to the more scientific members here. BTW, I think your cheese turned out quite nice. Congrats!
Thanks for the answers. I'm planning to let the curd sit overnight next time, that seems like a good idea after the marathon I had doing it in one day.
Does heating in whey have some advantage?
I hate to waste anything and just figured why heat water when I had that lovely whey just sitting around? I then discovered that my mozz had much better flavor, too, so it was a win-win for me.
Quote from: Lennie on February 09, 2010, 03:01:34 AM
Does heating in whey have some advantage?
The whey and cheese will be in balance pH wise that makes a big difference. I use my whey for brining as well.
That makes perfect sense.
This cheese is pretty smooth, just slightly grainy, but has great squeak. I melted a piece over a patty of breakfast sausage this morning, it wasn't super melty but did soften a lot and browned nicely. That was a tasty sausage.
There room for improvement but this has been quite enjoyable cheese as is.
Glad to hear it Lennie. I really enjoy browning mozzarella slices and laying them over fresh sliced tomatoes with basil and a drizzle of EVOO....... Mmmmm
Gosh when is summer coming? I want a fresh tomato! :-\
I hear you, Debi. I went to check the curing fridge last night (love that fermented sausage smell), and I thought, I would really love a slice of salami or prosciutto, and a ripe roma right now for dinner. But it's not even time to start the seeds yet. I consoled myself with a piece of cheese. I am so ready for winter to be over.
That would be great. I am tired of winter too. I need to make some fermented sausages I only have 6 capricolas aging right now. Been to into my cheese lately.
I can't even think about starting tomato seeds until mid-April, as I can't plant until June 1st.
Oh, to have my own greenhouse! But then when would I have time to make cheese?
Keep up the good work, Lennie!
Karen,
Think "Hoop House" not greenhouse. Kind of like a big cold frame with a door. Mine is about 10' x 16', made with 1" PVC pipe and only cost about $400 to make.
Obviously it's midwinter and everyone is up to their eyeballs in snow. I have had hydroponic lettuce, spinach, and Bac Choi going all Winter long and have more than we can eat from just 4 square feet. Our Broccoli and Cauliflower are about 18" high. They are ready to produce as soon as we start getting more sun. Have raddishes, beets, and onions. The hoop house and cheesemaking make Winter a little more tolerable.
Hoop houses don't work here, either...we typically get about 3 weeks or more of well below zero weather every winter and a couple of layers of plastic just won't cut it, I'm afraid. I'd have to heat it to keep the soil from freezing...as our house takes 10-12 face cords of wood to heat every winter (plus LP when we get sub-zero temps), I don't think that's in the cards here.
Besides, I gotta take a break sometime!
hydroponics is something I've looked into a few times over the years and the initial expense scared me off. It appears much more popular than it was years ago maybe not as bad now. A trip to Disnet in the 70's pique my interest and has been nagging me ever since.
Sailor could you give a few more details on your "Hoop House" and hydroponics setup? Maybe we could start a new thread somewhere? Pretty please??? A)
Hi,
I am in my 4th attempt, and I left the curds in the whey before cutting overnight. PH dropped way below 5 (about 4.80). What was wrong? Thanks for your help :)
Hi Lennie,
What recipe are you using? How much rennet per gallon? how much DVI? citric acid? CaCI?
Thanks!!
You need to let the pH drop happen after you drain the curds, not before. If you let the coagulum sit, it will just make a neufchatel or yogurt type semi-lactic cheese. So cut, drain, form the curd into a curd ball and let it sit and acidify. When pH is 5.2, stretch.