Hello!
Made the second version of what can only be called a true mess today! I have no idea what I'm doing but its getting frustrating. I don't even know if I what I "produced" is edible or if I might die trying it ( I think I feel my throat tightening as I type). The first wasted gallon of milk never set up...no curds, no whey, just a very sour yogurt like smell. I got that one too hot and didn't use enough rennet, etc, etc. The second effort produced what appeared to be a clean break (looked like the text book and was quite firm). When I cut the curd however, it began to "break down". By the time I finished cutting the whey looked liked thick soup and was cloudy white. This became soup with smallish chunks which only firmed up marginally when "cooking". Straining it only made it more like yogurt. In the end I have a dry-ish, cottage cheese looking glob that I pressed just to express more of the yogurt/whey liquid. Can I eat this like a creme fraiche or is this just something else which needs to find its way to the trash? Not sure what to try next. Please help. :-[
Yep, sure you can eat it. As young it will have minimal flavour so probably best to use in a lasagna type thing.
The curd when cut is very fragile, after cutting it needs a rest period and then when I start stirring I do so slowly until they expel more whey
Here's a Wiki Coagulation Defects (https://cheeseforum.org/articles/wiki-cheese-curd-coagulation-defects/) article that may give you some ideas. Next batch try uping the rennet dosage rate again, if still a poor set and used a mesophilic starter culture then use it to make a light cream cheese, also called American Neufchatel here. Also FYI there's a Wiki: Coagulation (https://cheeseforum.org/articles/wiki-cheese-milk-coagulation/) article that explains more.
You didn't say if you are using fresh milk (raw) or pasteurized. I can only get pasteurized so I have to add calcium chloride to get decent curds.
Thank you. Maybe that's the problem (at least in part). I can only get past milk and I didnt use calcium chloride. The recipe I used said it was optional, but it was dated 2001. Maybe past milk was in a more usable condition then. I did however, order some. I want to try again, but I'll wait until I have best practice ingredients (commercial meso starter; cacl).
Thanks agian for responding. This forum ROCKS!
You may want to try different brands of milk to find what works best, too. I have to use pasturized milk for the cheesemaking classes I teach and have only had any luck whatsoever with creamline milk that is pasturized "gently" at 145 degrees Fahrenheit. Most milk plants around here cook the milk at something closer to 170. What a waste!
What kind of cheese were you trying to make? What was your recipe?
Dave in CT
I'm embarrassed to say, but I was trying to make a hard cheese...cheddar-like?? I got the recipe from D Fankhauser's site. In his defense he did say I should try other, easier things first, but that seemed too logical...too wise! ::)
No reason to be embarrassed - nothing ventured, nothing gained. I've only been making cheeses since last September, so I'm quite green. But I've been making a cheese a week since then, and I've found a lot of the pot holes in the road. One of my first changes was switching from junket tablets to rennet; another one was getting the feel of the curd, and getting more gentle. I was more ham-handed then I realized, and I handle the curd more gently now. Another was finding what local milk worked. Big difference from one brand to another. And all my earlier cheeses were rather acidic - turned out dry and crumby, but every one was better than the last. The first dozen are the hardest! Fankhauser's site is great; I've learned most from this forum, reading the archives, and Debra Amrein-Boyce's book, "200 Easy Cheese recipes" has helped me a lot. Don't get discouraged! Keep at it, and you'll be happy you did!
Dave in CT
I have found that making cheese is easy, making GOOD cheese is a bit more difficult.
It takes a recipe to make GOOD cheese-It takes a great forum to make GREAT cheese.
Thanks to all for the wonderfully encouraging words. I've ordered some supplies that I believe can help..I should have them early next week. I'm encouraged!
Same here.
I make 1-2 cheeses every wheek since 3 months ago & opened my 1st cheddar & gouda this week & it came out fantastic & I can honestly say that I don't think I would've gotten as clued up as I am if it wasn't for this forum. The best thing to do is to read some of the other people's posts & learn from their mistakes before you make them yourself, I know I did. I started with the soft cheeses first, then gouda, then cheddar & now I'm making Brie & Cambert. Going to make maasdammer & Swiss cheese next. It's also a good idea to get the tech sheets of the ingredients you use to know exactly what to do. Just something to keep in mind though... I note you said that you heated it up too much... Rememeber that too high heat destroys the rennet enzymes & maybe that was why the curd was crappy, but I agree on the CaCl.
The big idea for me is to experiment as much as possible & have fun, even if the cheese doesn't come out the way it was supposed to, that's what makes it unique, that's what makes it your OWN cheese.
Good luck!!1!
newcheemomma, they say that to make good cheese you have to start with good milk, but having good mik is no guarantee you'll make good cheese. Always go back to the milk first. It's okay to use pasteurized milk. Homogenized milk however can yield lackluster results. Ultra Pasteurized (also called UHT) and High-Temp/Short-Time (in short HTST, some may call it "super pasteurized", Highly Pasteurized and other names that attempts to fool consumers into thinking it's for their safety) - these are milks that will fail when you make curd. When using pasteurized and homogenized milk always use some Calcium Chloride (often referred to in this forum as CalCl2). The natural calcium is depleted from the milk during the violent pasteurization or homogenization processes and it needs it back. Calcium has a lot to do with how milk coagulates and curd bonds and knot together. (don't over do it though, put too much and you get curd that's too firm and chalky bitter cheese).
The other thing is, you said it's a "cheddar-like" recipe and I don't know what this means but my suggestion is to always start with a proper recipe. Make a cheddar with a recipe that has been tried and tested, and don't make it sophisticated; don't try to wash it with exotic washed, add caraway seeds or chipotle peppers, paprika, sugar, etc. Don't make it less or more salty than the recipe suggest, and whatever you do, do not change the quantities of cultures or the time of each process because it's a sure way to destroy your cheese by under/over acidification.
Specifically for rennetting: Always use the prescribed amount and strength of rennet. Combine rennet in gentle but brisk and full movement. Don't incorporate air in to the milk and bubble it. You need to thoroughly combine the rennet throughout 100% of your milk in under 30 seconds and then let it rest completely. Don't leave any instruments in it like a thermometer or ladle. Make it a rule to not touch the pot or milk from the moment you are done combining the rennet to the moment you cut it. Walk away! No heating it up or cooling it down, no putting fingers in it to see if it breaks before it's time to check, no moving the pot, no cooking next to it. Just leave it alone.
Once you make a bunch of proper cheeses like basic simple good Cheddars and you have a feeling for the temperature, the curd, the right milk and salting processes, you can begin to make your own personal variations on it, from a change of process to flavor additions or changes in cultures as you seek a combination which you personally really like. But cheesemaking is for patient people. you have to go through a few basic good ones before you move on. This is one of the reasons I don't advise people to start with Cheddars; you will have to wait 3 months for each one to know if you did it right or not. Much easier to start with a 3 week Camembert recipe. you would be at your 4th Camembert batch by the time you taste your very first Cheddar, and waiting 3 months to taste your first cheese will kill you. Eventually you will give up and taste it after 1 month and it will be sour and bland so you would think you failed...
I started out making using Fankhauser as a guide for making cheese, too. Nothing wrong with it - he's got great suggestions for making cheese without it being a pricey venture. I needed to start out on the cheap to make sure it was something I really wanted to do before I invested any money in it.
Patience is key with cheesemaking. I recommend starting out with simpler cheeses that you can eat fresh - American Neufchatel, cream cheese, Queso Fresco, etc., then move on up to cheeses that require some ageing. While your aged cheeses are ageing, make more fresh cheeses to keep from becoming to impatient to try the cheese. A good first aged cheese is Lancashire. It is a cheddar type that has good flavor in 4 weeks and even better at 8 and 12 weeks.
If you do happen to cut into a cheese before it's time, just re-wax or vacuum seal it up, put it in a place that you can forget about it for a while, and dive into making cheeses. When you come back to it, it will probably have improved in leaps and bounds.
Just don't give up - this is a great hobby and even a career for some of us.
What the heck. Might as well chime in here.
Quote from: iratherfly on June 05, 2011, 09:54:09 PM
Specifically for rennetting: Always use the prescribed amount and strength of rennet. Combine rennet in gentle but brisk and full movement. Don't incorporate air in to the milk and bubble it. You need to thoroughly combine the rennet throughout 100% of your milk in under 30 seconds and then let it rest completely.
Good tips from iratherfly.
I'd just like to add that you should dissolve or mix the rennet with cold, clean (filtered or distilled) water just before you are ready to add it to the milk. If it sits for a while, you risk losing its potency.
-Boofer-
Good point Boofer. If you don't dilute the rennet you will have a few drops of it only and they will catch the milk only wherever they fall but if it's diluted over a half cup of water than it can easily be distributed evenly throughout the entire volume of milk. A good rule of thumb is to dilute rennet with 20x its volume worth of water. If your recipe calls for 1/2 tsp for example, than 20x that would be 10 tsp of water, (which is about 3 tbs or about 1/4 cup).
MrsKK is right too. I would also suggest to augment your fresh cheese with first aged cheeses that are short terms such as Colby or Jack which are simplified cheddars (less steps, no actual cheddaring happening)- can be ready in as little as 4 weeks.
I never have to re-wax because I have enough cheese in the cave that I can hold on and wait and never have to taste a cheese before its time. Re-waxing or re-vacuuming are option you only have with waxed/vacuumed cheese of course. It's a luxury you don't get when making any aged cheese with real rind so it's a bad habit that I would stay away from. (You can taste prematurely a rinded cheese if you have a cheese trier and know how to use it and plug the holed)
Fankhauser has a reason for starting at the beginning instead of jumping ahead. I am still making fresh cheeses, hope to go to aged cheeses soon, but I have not failed yet. Those first cheeses may be boring, but I have been successful so I went and bought a kit, and a book, and another book, and some molds, and some cultures, and some Penicillin Candidum, and and and
Now, I just need time to take my chevre to the St. Maure-type step.
and maybe try some of the farmhouse cheddar types from recipes I found at the Keeping a Family Cow forum
and and and
(yeah, I'm turning into a cheesemaking addict already)
Quote from: ilvalleygal on June 23, 2011, 06:40:30 PM
Fankhauser has a reason for starting at the beginning instead of jumping ahead. I am still making fresh cheeses, hope to go to aged cheeses soon
I recently made my 30th cheese and have yet to make a fresh cheese. Looking forward to it down the line though. ;)
-Boofer-
Just made a beautiful cheddar (although not sure how to age this one since I dont have a cave yet). Have made a cottage and some labneh and a farmhouse chesse. Thanks MrsKK for your wonderful perspective. That's the method I've gone with and we seem to have some success in learning more about cheese and patience! Now just how to make bigger wheels of cheese!
Boofer -- with the cost of the milk, I'm glad this time I started at the beginning.
And, I have no patience for waiting months to try something. But, I have been looking at turning an ice chest into a "cave" of sorts. Unless someone around here just happens to have a wine cooler or dorm fridge that needs a new home.
So much to learn, so much fun too
It really doesn't matter where you start as long as you exercise your creative juices, learn a little along the way, and maybe even produce a nice cheese. ;)
-Boofer-