Hi everyone! Im from Sydney, Australia!
Im new to cheesemaking, i havent done a course or anything, just going by the book, which isnt always accurate! So ive had a few successes and one terrible failure yesterday! I love the whole process of cheese, the waiting too! So far ive done cottage cheese (was a bit dry), a delicious fetta (family favourite ao far), ive done a few whey ricottas, did a farmhouse cheddar thats ageing, and need to wax my second one today. Ive attempted a longhorn, but the recipe was very flawed and it is awful...
We will be making a flavoured colby today with chives from my garden!
I havent attempted any mould ripened cheese, as i only have a kit for hard cheese ;-)
Hope i can get some pointers here!
Welcome Crystal, I'm in Armidale, and there's quite a number of Australian cheesemakers on this forum. Just ask, someone will come up with an answer. What is a longhorn cheese?
Lol, hi! Well, i had to google it and got a million answers and not one recipe! I think, its a kinda colby or a kind of cheddar... lol it could be called longhorn because it was originally from longhorn cows, or cos it was first made in texas or because of the shape its made in! So, as you can see i was never going to ave nuch success when no one even knows WHAT it is! Anyway, thanks for the welcome, i shall wander off to the help section and see if i can find some answers!
Hi again Crsytal,
The chives you are going to add need to be kept in the acidic whey for a while or dunked into boiling water for about 5 seconds to reduce the foreign bacteria that may ruin your cheese.
Hi Crystal,
I'm from Nar Nar Goon in West Gippsland, just out of Melbourne, in dairy country. Originally from Sydney, but no amount of money would get me back there!
I caught the cheesemaking bug about 6 months ago and like most newbies, have had my share of successes and failures. This forum is a great resource for any information about cheesemaking you need. Plenty of active Aussies here too, who can help with local supplies and ingredients. We are all learning and sharing the journey together. If you need help, make sure you post details of your recipe and photos.
Have fun! :)
Thanks for the warm welcome! I had noticed the boiling extras thing in a recipe and was planning to do that. Mine says to add the boiling liquid to the milk then the extras when you salt it?
I do have one q about curds tho, as im working from books that have no pix and are very lacking in describing what each step should.look like! Im good at waiting for.the clean break, but, when i stir the curds, no matter how careful i cut and stir, they fall apart. Theres a few 'cubes' but mostly just lumpish lookin curds... am i doing something wrong or is that ok? Ive tried adding a bit of extra calcium chlpride, which i read can help firm up curds. Ive waited longer before cutting, ive tried being super gentle with the stirring...
Crystal,
Here are a couple of photos of my camembert curds. This is typically how mine look during stirring, after letting them sit and "heal" for 5 minutes. I am lucky enough to use raw milk so I suspect if you are using store bought milk your curds might be softer and more breakable.
Hi Crystal and welcome to the forum! Many Australians here!
Your problem sound easily solvable. Let's get some info as it may have a lot to do with your milk quality / calcium deficiency, or not waiting long enough for a good set. What milk are you using? (raw? pasteurized? Ultra-pasteurized? Homogenized?) How are you adding the Calcium Chloride to it? You should always use liquid Calcium Chloride and mix 1/8 teaspoon liquid in a 1/4 cup water for each 1 gallon (4 liters) milk. Don't ever add it directly to the milk without diluting it first. (Don't worry, it won't dilute your cheese, the extra water becomes part of the whey)
When your curd smashes into lumpy substance, does your whey become milky and whiter? Or do you have a clear or green-ish whey?
Also, what is the recipe you are using? How long do you wait between culture and rennet and between rennet and cutting? (Is this for the Colby? Cheddar?). You should never mix the curd immediately after cutting. Always wait 5 minutes for the cubes to begin releasing whey and start sinking under it. Give it the first stir then (and cut any cubes that seem to be too large). Let it rest for another 5 minute and give it a second gentle stir. The curd should begin to compact and strengthen, releasing more whey in your pot/vat.
For your curd washing/cooking, NEVER add boiling water to the vat. It scalds the curd, dentures the proteins and kill off the lactic bacteria, affecting pH and extracting the butterfat. Use warm water. 160°F-180°F (60°C-80°C).
Cheese recipes are rather generic formulas that don't consider the real life variable of cheesemaking (milk quality, room temperature, strength of cultures, etc.) It is up to you to develop a sensory to interpret what is right and what should be adjusted so that the recipe will succeed in your individual conditions based on your senses: touch, smell, look.
Ok, your my hero! Lets see if we can solve this.
Im using store bought milk and a basic hard cheese recipe.
Im using liquid calcium chloride and my booklet says tip it in, nothing about diluting! It also says 1/8tsp in 8lt. So, ive been doing a 1/4 anyway assuming it was that causing my problem!
So, i will dilute it from now on
My whey is greenish or yellowish mostly, maybe a smidge milkish... lol!
My recipe for a farmhouse cheddar says culture, then after 45mins, rennet then wait 45mins, cut. Or, wait another 5 if curd isnt set. Ive waited over an hour once and still had smooshed curds!
Oh, and on the adding boiling water, i meant the water i boiled the chives in was added once it d cooled! Atleast i got one thing right!
So, ive just added my rennet but ive already added the calcium direct, so i will dilute it next time! If anyone is here in 45 ill check back during my waiting/cutting/stirring phase!
Rennet and Calcium Chloride both needs dilusion in water. It doesn't affect their strength but it gives them very good and even distribution throughout the milk when you mix them. (Imagine trying to get a few drops of calcium mixed evenly in 8 liters of milk; it's a lot easier and faster to do it with 1/4-1/2 cup and a thinner liquid.) This is especially important with rennet because it becomes active within 30-60 seconds so by then you want it to be evenly distributed already. It will really effect your yield quantity and how even your cheese is.
Milky whey is an indication of degrading curd. Your goal is to keep it as clear as possible. That means that more solids are in your curd instead of the whey. Yellow milk is more typical when the weather gets nicer and cows are grazing on fresh grass again; it's beta carotene. Green is just riboflavin. All good stuff.
The milk however may be your biggest issue actually. You want to use gently pasteurized (batch pasteurized, not HTST, UHT or Ultra Pasteurized milk which are most of supermarket milks. What does the label say?). You would also get a MUCH better cheese texture, better and deeper flavor as well as higher yield from milk that is not homogenized (also called Cream-Line). This mechanical crushing of fat golubles in supermarket milk (AKA homogenization) is quite horrendous to milk. This sort of milk also comes from cows that are often living in close quarters and treated with antibiotics which resist your starter bacteria and destroy coagulation. Moreover, if they are fed corn and silage it will produce gas that may give the cheese bitter flavors or even cause it to bloat and explode (happened to me once!). The better the milk = the better your success rate will be.
Are there any dairy farmers available for you? Can you get raw milk legally where you live? Do you have supermarkets around that sell milk that is not homogenized perhaps? I guarantee you will see a night and day difference.
Yes, use more calcium for supermarket milk. Less for cream-line/gently pasteurized milk, no calcium needed for raw milk and reduce all cultures by half for raw milk too.
Wow, your like the yoda of cheese, except u speak better lol!
Ok, ive got homoginised and pasturised milk. I can tell you now that no, i cant get raw milk, im in sydney and i know its illegal in australia. But, i can get an unhomoginised milk from the supermarket.
Its rather expensive tho, so ill make a few more mistakes with the cheap crap first ;-) then one day ill move out of the city, buy a few cows and make cheese till the cows come home! Lol, i will persist for now with this one.
I cut after an hour as its colder today and it was as set as its going to get. I did wait to stir and their holding up, but still.not brilliant. Got yellow whey today! I hope they will taste alright enough tho...
I love the science side of cheese, and will continue to.make mistakes and learn from them wth help.from this.forum!
Yoda me not. All we forum members like that speak!
I think what you are describing is one of the strangest and most typical cycles I have seen around this hobby of cheesemaking. People coming to it don't feel immersed and committed enough to justify investing in expensive milk on recipe they have not yet perfected and suspect it may all go to the trash. Sadly, that cheap milk is the exact cause behind the disappointments and dismal failures and someone who would otherwise be a great cheesemaker ends up frustrated and demoralized by the experience (especially after few good months of care). Many don't feel like making cheese anymore and let go of this great thing. In the grand scheme of things, if you intend on making a cheddar and care for it for 6 months and have the proper equipment, make the move to good milk. It's 98% of the cheese.
Aging of cheese tends to amplify qualities of milk immensely. There are nuances which you have no way of feeling when drinking milk with cookies, using it in your coffee or breakfast cereal. These will come out bright and strong in aged cheese. that's the difference between succeeding in fabricating cheese versus making cheese at home that far surpass what you get at the market, from day 1. Give yourself a chance with good milk. At least try it on one cheese. Even do a soft cheese to see how good it is. You will see a huge difference fro coagulation behavior to flavor and aroma, I guarantee it.
Alright cheese yoda, i will get organised for a quick feta next and will splurge on good milk. Ive done a feta before so atleast ill notice the difference! If my backyard was full of vegies and 6 kids (human kind) id get a goat! Maybe i should just move to the country to help suport my hobby?
Yes! Goat! Oh, if I could only have them here in the middle of New York City:)
Have you done any softer bloomy cheese, washed rind or Tomme yet? I would test the good milk with those.
Umm, no i havnt done any of those. I never even heard of them!
Actually i noticed u were in NY, where on earth do you get your milk?
Ill search for a recipe in a min, unless you know where i can find one?
Hey Crystal,
It takes a little while to catch on the the terms our North American friends use ;)
Soft bloomys are Camemberts and Bries
Cream-line is unhomogenised milk (I guess because you can see the cream line?)
All our milk is pasteurised using HTST (high temperature, short time, usually 72C for 15 seconds). We also have UHT milk (ultra heat treated) which we commonly call long life milk.
Due to our warmer climate, virtually all of our milk comes from cows that are pasture fed, with the occasional supplement of silage (fermented hay). Rarely is hard feed such as corn used here.
I wholeheartedly agree with iratherfly regarding milk quality. Even though unhomogenised is more expensive, the results will always be better. I know some Aussie cheesemakers use standard milk quite successfully, but as iratherfly says, its a shame to ruin all your hard work by trying to save a few dollars on milk. The best cheeses in the world are made with the highest quality milk.
Making Fetta is a great way to learn about curds, formation,stirring etc because the results can be seen and eaten in only day! Try different recipies and milks and see the differences you get, that way you can learn more about the process.
Good luck! :)
Ok, well as i only have a hard cheese kit i wont be attempting a soft camembert any time too soon. I do want to, but i know how much kids love it and i have 6 of the buggers, dont really want to share my hard earned cheese with them!
Ive read about cream line, but we dont have that here do we? Do you know what brand the unhomoginised milk is? I saw an organic one but it was $3.75 a litre! Is it pauls or something? I love feta and so do all the kids, plus its quick and easy and ready in a day so we make a bit of it. But,due to my cheapo milk it is never as... crumbly... as bought feta. Tastes wonderful and is usually soft and creamy tho!
Crystal, the only unhomogenised milk I am aware of here is Pauls Organic, it is expensive probably because it is organic. There may be other smaller regional dairies that do an unhomogenised, but I'm not aware of them. I think Dairy Farmers do an "extra dollop" but I'm pretty sure this is still homogenized milk with a little cream added back in.
If you want a crumblier Fetta, try increasing the length of the stirring step. :)
Right, more stirring = more crumbly? But with p&h milk it = smooshed curds..? Argh, i need to do more reading, or less lol! The kids thought my feta was perfect ;-)
It may have been the pauls that i saw, i just didnt look too well. For arguments sake, is there any way to improve my shop milk cheese.
Yes, it can be confusing at first Crystal. I suggest you go to the following link, which has an index of all the Wiki articles. In here you will find a huge amount of information about the key proceses for making cheese, as well as articles about ingredients and recipes.
https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/board,196.0.html (https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/board,196.0.html)
Don't get discouraged, anyone who can make Fetta, that their kids love, at the first attempt, has got what it takes to make a good cheesemaker! I'd try some better milk and see how much difference there is. Post some photos of your curd and you will get feedback. Lots of us actually make a "cheesalogue" while we are making cheese and post photos as we go. ;D
Good luck.
Well bob, as i dont have a computer and im on my phone i cant post pix here, except i can on fb, so i tend to do my cheesealouge (lol) on there.
Oh, and my little secret... im a chef... so im kinda cheating here. I know my way around the kitchen, but they dont teach you so much of the good stuff. I enjoy hands on food, creating something from nothing with my own hands. So ive been making butter, bread, icecream and many other things for years. But this is my first go at cheese and i love it!
Basically, if my kids eat it, its good enough. Except, one of my girls eats everything, dirt covered even. And her twin brother wont eat nearly anything. But, he eats bread, cheese, sausages and apples! So we make as much of it as we can so that atleast hes getting good, healthy, unprocessed food. Plus we grow a few vegies ourselves, and usually eat them before they get to.the kitchen!
So, ill see what i can do about milk and keep posting here and on facebook, so if ur interested message me your fb name and ill add you as mines on private ;-)
Ha Ha. Well my little secret is I have worked all my life in the food industry, in engineering and operations roles. All the big companies Nestle, Kraft, National Foods, CSR etc. I now work as a contractor in the food industry, so I get to see lots of food being made. My current project happens to be in a cheese factory, so I can get expert advice if I need it!
My kids think I'm a bit weird making cheese....they are grown up now, (17 - 21), but they all enjoy my cheeses when I offer them some! I have always loved cooking too, so my kids have developed a taste for good, home cooked food. I hope they keep it!
I'll send you my fb name and feel free to add me if you wish.
Crystal,
Let me jump in here about poor quality milk, as I've worked with it quite a lot. High temperature short time pasteurized milk is difficult to make cheese with, but there are some things that will help. As Iratherfly said, dilute your calcium chloride and stir it in quite well. I use dry calcium chloride crystals which I dissolve in cold filtered water. I use the same amount of calcium chloride crystals as rennet called for in the recipe. I make my initial curd cut a bit larger than called for, and I let it rest after the first cut for 15 minutes to firm up a bit. My first "stirring" is just nudging the curd with the handle of my ladle, making the curds just bump against each other. As they start to shrink, I try to just turn them in place, bringing the bottom to the top. As they shrink, they get sturdier and I can actually stir them, and by that time they are acting like the curd of real milk.
Having said that, there is nothing like good milk. Make a batch from unhomogenized milk so you can see what curd ought to be like. Consider the expense as taking a cheese making class. It will reward you with a great curd and a successful cheese, and will be your benchmark.
There are so many variables to watch in making cheese, so shattering curd really clouds what's going on. I understand about costs, though. One of the reasons I make cheese is so I can afford to eat it. I make cheese from cheap milk, and when I can afford it I make it from good raw Jersey milk from a local farm, and many times I use a combination of the two. Even one quarter part of good milk makes a huge difference in the curd.
I've also found that larger batches work better for me. My first cheeses were one gallon batches, and it was easy to go astray on temperature and acidification. I went to two gallon batches and it was easier. I went to four gallon batches and found I had great control through the whole process.
Yes Dave, you and I have discussed it in the past. This also has a lot to do with the type of cheese you are targeting as some cheeses are more sensitive to it than others. Homoganization is a discussion in its own right so I will just say in short that there is less mineral content, there are coagulation issues and aging issues that can cause dense grainy texture or rancidity of fats with sharpness and flavor effects. It also guarantees that you make less cheese per given amount of milk and you can't just fix it by loading the milk up with more Calcium because that would just make it more grainy and give you an overly hard or even brittle cheese. There are also digestion issues with making these fat globules so small that humans can digest them freely.
As for the financials... I have a different outlook on it, but that's my personal cognition. The way I see it, I want to make cheese that is phenomenally good which I can use and savor. I am not looking to mimic the $6.99/Lbs industrial supermarket cheddar (though it has its place too). If I am going to labor my heart out at it and care for this wheel like a baby for the next 6 months I want to use my precious time wisely to raise a great aging candidate that will stand up to those $100 wheels in the best cheese shops ($24.99/Lb. x4 Lbs. wheel, typical 4"x7.5" Tomme). When you use these recipes and aim at gorgeous rind, incredibly supple texture and inspiring aroma for a truly exceptional wheel with depth - everything counts. The animal breed, the feed, the season, the milk treatment etc. If I spend $25 on milk instead of $10; so be it. Why do all this work for a second grade product? Getting the $100 wheel ouf of $25 is still a darn great deal in my opinion. Besides, good food is expensive (or I should really say, bad food is cheap).
Growing hormone-free, antibiotic-free, pasture-grazing happy cows, caring for them, milking them responsibly and processing milk that is gently pasteurized or raw so it has short shelf life - it's just more expensive than hormone driven corn eating cows that live in closed quarters, never see the light of day and are fed antibiotics throughout their lifetime. By the way, did you know that 80% of antibiotics in the US end in cow's diets?
Thanks dt, ill do some reading of the processes and about milk. I have 6 kids eating my cheese, so mostly as long as its edible, its good enough. But yes, as soon as i want a good cheese i will use better milk. Wow, cheese yoda... i grew up on a dairy farm, in the milking shed, so i know a bit about australian dairy farming. I know our cows roamed far and wide, i had to cross the paddocks to get to school. I also know we grew feed in two paddocks and never fed corn or grain as i played in the corn silo and it was always empty. Im starting to think that perhaps we were on an organic dairy farm as we never gave anything to the cows except the lucern we grew. Ive helped birth a calf (ewww). Ive ridden a brahman bull. We had horses and i went on my first big muster on my horse at 8yrs old. Was not a fan of spending the night on the ground in the bush with a few thousand cows. But, i appreciate milk and know what its like, at least on our farm, to raise cows.
BUt, i promise, over the weekend ill make a feta with good milk, but the kids will keep getting cheap milk cheese!
Oh, dave (?) Yesterday instead of stirring the first time i jiggled the pot, and i did wait about ten mins after the cut to jiggle. So tbat did help keep a bit of the curd together. But not a lot! Ill wait more and go slower on the next batch and will remember to dilute the calcium.. i make 8lt batches which is supposedly 2gal. But i know that isnt the right conversion! Cos 1 gal is actually 3.8L... would this conversion be affecting the curd since the cal and rennet are dosed for 7.6L and im using 8L?
Quote from: iratherfly on December 07, 2011, 07:21:24 PM
As for the financials... I have a different outlook on it, but that's my personal cognition. The way I see it, I want to make cheese that is phenomenally good which I can use and savor. I am not looking to mimic the $6.99/Lbs industrial supermarket cheddar (though it has its place too). If I am going to labor my heart out at it and care for this wheel like a baby for the next 6 months I want to use my precious time wisely to raise a great aging candidate that will stand up to those $100 wheels in the best cheese shops ($24.99/Lb. x4 Lbs. wheel, typical 4"x7.5" Tomme). When you use these recipes and aim at gorgeous rind, incredibly supple texture and inspiring aroma for a truly exceptional wheel with depth - everything counts. The animal breed, the feed, the season, the milk treatment etc. If I spend $25 on milk instead of $10; so be it. Why do all this work for a second grade product? Getting the $100 wheel ouf of $25 is still a darn great deal in my opinion. Besides, good food is expensive (or I should really say, bad food is cheap).
I'm in full agreement with you on this. However, sometimes lately the $25 just isn't there. Sometimes the $10 just isn't there, and we just don't eat cheese that week, we make some delicious rice and beans. I'm getting really good at that, and a lot of Indian vegetarian cooking. Probably a lot healthier without the meat, anyway. I started making things myself for the joy of it, and now I find that they were really great skills to acquire for lean times. I make the best cheese I can with the best milk I can afford at the time, so I go for the quicker ripening cheeses with the cheaper milk. Styles with longer pre-ripening times help the native lack of flavor of P/H milk, such as Lancaster or my fast ripening cheddar.
Hard times don't last forever, and then I'll be back to that wonderful raw Jersey milk! In the interim, I do the best I can.
Im in the same budget boat at you dave. I have 6 kids, 2 ten mo babies, 2 two yo babies, a four yo and an 11 yo. We go through about 50L of milk every two weeks, so i have tp get the cheapest milk. We also stick to basic staples of rice, pasta, potatos now their cheap, mince, sausages and chicken thats on sale. I have to be very creative everyday to make different dishes witb the same ingredients. We make yogurt cos its about $7L here. I buy the cheapest cheese which is cheaper than i can make it for anyway. But yes, ill keep at it with my cheap milk cheese and look for a dairy i can steal raw milk from as its illegal to sell it here. I think i might find one not too far away, maybe an hour out towards windsor... not that you guys know where that is... lol! They have a lot of grass... so there may be a small dairy out that way... i do know there is a small working farm about twenty mins from here. They do open farm days and you can take the kids up to muck around milking and getting eggs, but doubt theyd get much milk... ill check tho.
Quote from: Crystal on December 07, 2011, 08:03:25 PM
Oh, dave (?) Yesterday instead of stirring the first time i jiggled the pot, and i did wait about ten mins after the cut to jiggle. So tbat did help keep a bit of the curd together. But not a lot! Ill wait more and go slower on the next batch and will remember to dilute the calcium.. i make 8lt batches which is supposedly 2gal. But i know that isnt the right conversion! Cos 1 gal is actually 3.8L... would this conversion be affecting the curd since the cal and rennet are dosed for 7.6L and im using 8L?
Yes, that could have an effect. Search the forum for "flocculation", and use the flocculation point to correct your rennet amount instead of a given recipe. Think of the recipe as a starting point, and then make corrections, because the amount of rennet needed is going to change with your milk, the time of year, the age of your rennet, the position of the planets, the mood of your dog, and the caprice of nature. So observe the flocculation time you get today, and increase or decrease your rennet accordingly a drop more or less at a time on your next batch.
And treat yourself to the best milk you can get, at least once, so you can feel what it should be like. That will help you get the feel of the curd. But your curd problems really sound like high heat short time pasteurization. I have one brand of milk that's like that here; I can make cheese with it, but I really have to coax it. another trick is to make cross cuts twice the size of what you want, don't make the horizontal cuts yet, and wait 10 minutes, then make your proper cuts. All this fussing about with the fragile curd can take longer, so watch your acidification. After a year of making hard cheeses, my daughter asked me to make cottage cheese, which I had never done. It's a pretty good way to get familiar with the curd process and see more immediate results. You can try different cut sizes, healing times, etc. on each batch and observe the effects, and it still comes out cottage cheese.
And if you have a batch where no matter what you do the curd disintegrates, just drain it in cheesecloth in a colander, gather up the corners and let it hang, and make an OK fromage blanc. Been there and done that trying out a new brand of supermarket milk.
Hmm, i have read a little about flocculation... ill look into it more tho. I do love good cheese so will use better milk to make some nice cheese for me, but cheap milk for the kids and cottage cheese and a few other quick ones as they are kids and dont need $100 quality wheels of farm house cheddar!
I cant wait to get some better milk now tho!
Oh, and you lost me with acidification... im guessing thats another thing i shuld be reading about...?
Hi Crystal,
Cheesemaking is all about acidification. Read my doco here (https://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,2438.0.html) to get an understanding of the acidification. Read the titles "Acidity Control Part 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5"
Our kids are own their own now, but visit frequently enough with room mates in tow, and they love soft melty cheese. I make a butterkaese for them, into which I add sazon, a seasoning mix with salt, garlic, onion, spices, and annatto. I go for higher moisture content by cutting the curd a bit larger and a longer flocc multiplier, and it makes a good grilled cheese sandwich or nacho cheese, and they love it.
As for food economy, my best friends have been my slow cooker, my pressure canner, buying bulk, and exploring traditional cuisines of less affluent areas. Grains and legumes are great protein sources, and we really like Indian and Mexican food. I find that a lot of less expensive food is really great: the trade-off is the time you put in to make it, like a slow cooked pork shoulder, or a slow simmered bean soup. Curing your own meats is another way to lower costs and raise the quality; nothing like cottage bacon nicely smoked! Home made yogurt is great, too. Look on the forum for fromage blanc recipes, it's like cream cheese, and easy to make. I've made parfaits for the grandchildren with berries and fromage blanc or quark. I know you must have your hands full with such a nice large family; but from the other side of raising them, how fast the time flew! I sometimes long for all the noise and bustle! But a weekend with grandkids usually does it for me very well!
Thanks g, ill look at them tonight. Cheese seems to be getting more complicated by the minute tho... lol.
I do love having a big family and we all appreciate pitching in with the food. I have some two year olds in the kitchen making pizza scrolls for lunch now. As this in the first year of our veggies we havent had anything to can or bottle yet, but ive been hoarding jars for when the time comes, collecting recipes and learning what i can. We dont watch much tv, with 6 kids try finding a single show they will all watch..!?! So we get them in the garden weeding, watering, hlping with the pruning etc. They help with cakes, muffins, bread, butter, shake the yoghurt, watch the cheese. They help stir dinner, and anything else we can find for them to do! Its only work if your not doing it right! Id like them to have a better appreciation of the work that goes into food and learn how to do it themselves. So that they appreciate the way things used to be, before importing chinese junk and 24hour shops and internet. Lol, tho my kids have never been to the library as we ask for books for gifts. I also crochet and sew so i make lots of what they need. And they love that they get unique stuff that no one else has! My oldest son enjoys sewing, but not the technicalities of designing the pattern and the ordering of the process. DH has no interest in anything that takes longer than the.time it takes to order maccas at the drive thru window. But hes lived his entire life in the city.
Cheese can be very simple or very complicated. Making my cheese is simple. Making it taste the same all the time, a little more complicated. making some one else's cheese: complicated. It's all about familiarity. Start with a fairly simple cheese that you like, and make it a number of times. You'll get the feel of it, the language of curd and acidity, and you'll get good at it. And the next style you take on will be all the easier. It's not like working with static materials, like metal working which I did for years. It's working with living things. It's like gardening or farming, except that the season is measured in hours. It's a delight because you can make such wonderful stuff in cooperation with the little critters, and it's a delight because there is always something new to learn, some new direction in which to venture. Wish I'd found this when I was young; I could spend a long lifetime learning this.
Lol, i could talk about it forever dave! Ill keep at it with the cheese, i dont give up on anything, except growing cauliflowers, cos i had every infestation known to man in about 3 weeks, so i cut my losses and ripped them out!
I really dont need every cheese to be artisian quality, i just want it edible so it will be cheap milk except for gifts or special cheeses which ill get unhomoginised for. Ive had a quick look for dairies near me... nada... theres big commercial ones but no small ones ive found yet. Mybe ill just buy a goat but my backyards not big enough... oh, what the hell, ill just relocate out of sydney when i win the lotto and buy a small farm!
A woman I know who has one cow gave me 10 gallons of milk, and I made her five pounds of streaky bacon. We were both happy to have the gifts, and no laws were broken.
I saw some cows the other day, but i doubt anyone in this area will do anything for a trade. People here are too stuck up and everyone wants to be well paid for no effort! Except me that is. I want to put in the effort and get something of equal effort in return! I quite like the old money system of trading, i dont like money, i dont like the economy, i dont like the global everything we seem to have nowadays... i wish we could go back to the times when people were valued for what they can do, not for what they could buy! I can do lots of things, but they have no value here.
Quote from: dthelmers on December 07, 2011, 09:32:20 PM
I'm in full agreement with you on this. However, sometimes lately the $25 just isn't there. Sometimes the $10 just isn't there, and we just don't eat cheese that week, we make some delicious rice and beans. I'm getting really good at that, and a lot of Indian vegetarian cooking. Probably a lot healthier without the meat, anyway. I started making things myself for the joy of it, and now I find that they were really great skills to acquire for lean times. I make the best cheese I can with the best milk I can afford at the time, so I go for the quicker ripening cheeses with the cheaper milk. Styles with longer pre-ripening times help the native lack of flavor of P/H milk, such as Lancaster or my fast ripening cheddar.
Hard times don't last forever, and then I'll be back to that wonderful raw Jersey milk! In the interim, I do the best I can.
Thanks Dave! I agree, though my personal preference is that if I only have $10 and not $25, I would prefer making a smaller cheese to a larger one of lesser quality. Again, that's a personal preference.
Crystal - wow what a story about growing up. Dreamy! I hear that a lot about the milk in Australia -cows are well treated and have lots of natural resources. In the US it is very sad. Our supermarket milk is nowhere near the quality of Australian milk. That being said, the practices of homogenization and high temperature pasteurization still wreak havoc on the milk. For cottage and some fresh soft or spreadable cheeses you probably won't have many issues (except quality of curd set and a somewhat lower yield amount). The problem is more with aged cheeses or cheese that needs lots of fast enzymatic activity such as Mozzarella.
Dave and Crystal, There are two practices that both of you guys can use in combination to bring the milk back to better quality before making cheese.
The first one is called "standardizing the milk". The idea is that you can use less homogenized milk and even determine the fat content by mixing fat free milk with heavy cream. You will need to calculate the quantities before mixing so that you won't end up with a triple cream cheddar (bad idea). I have to look at my lists but I think the ratio for a good tomme de savoie type cheese is 1 liter cream for every 8.5 liter nonfat milk. (or 1 qt cream for every 2¼ gal). Having the heavy cream mixed only roughly in the nonfat milk may create coagulation that is more like non-homogenized milk. If you can combine non-homogenized cream with homogenized milk you may still stay in your budget and get that non-homogenized milk you wanted.
Sample Calculation:
1 Liter heavy cream (36% fat) = 360 ml fat
8.5 liter nonfat milk = 8500 ml
360 / 8500 = 0.042 - that's 4.2% fat milk.The second practice is called pre-ripening. The idea is kind of like restoring back the bacterium and flora properties that lost to pasteurization -(without restoring back the pathogens of course). All you need to do is simply get very fresh milk and dump some ripening bacteria (such as Flora Danica) into the jugs of cold milk. Refrigerate for 24 hours allowing the bacteria to start its magic. Make the cheese regularly the following day. Beware that the milk may be more acidic than usual so sometimes you will need to adjust your starter culture and pre-rennet time accordingly. No big deal (easy to figure out if you have a pH meter)
I have never tried it with homogenized milk but I bet it will greatly benefit these two treatments and will give you better yield and nicer cheese with deeper flavors and possibly a much improved texture. Ever tried that?
Wow, i had never thought of that, mixing skim with cream, and it makes perfect sense! it would basically be the same molecule structure as Unhomoginised milk then! I will definatly give that a go, theres a costco near me that has cream rather cheap and you can get skim everywhere! all up it will work out cheaper than the organic unhomooginised brand we have here thats for sure!
OK, so i dont have a ph tester and am still reading up on the acidity. But, i do have a very old american house keeping book that has a few basic cheese recipes in it and they all say to let the milk 'clabber'. is that like ripening? But then i read somewhere to NEVER let the milk clabber as you will NEVER get a firm curd... so much conflicting information!
I will have a look at getting some Flora Danica i think...
I didn't know Costco has invaded Down Under.
It's not exactly the same structure because the cream itself is usually also homogenized (though it's easy to get only 1 Liter non-homogenized cream even if it costs a bit more, but keep the bulk quantity of material -the milk on the cheap milk. You will save a lot). You can also experiment with butter products and double cream or clotted cream. You can also see if you can get goat's cream (goat's cream and milk are never homogenized. They are naturally homogenized coming out of the goat!). Just remember to count the % of fat as I did in my sample calculation.
For the pre ripening method, you don't need to have a pH meter. Just dump 1/16th teaspoon for each gallon of milk 24 hours in advance. Wait 10 minutes to reconstitute, cover and shake. return to fridge for 24 hours. Then make your cheese regularly and see what happens. You don't have to use Flora Danica. It's just a good multi strain mixture that wakes up many flavors in the milk. MA4000 series or MM100 series can work well too. See how it works and adjust it in the future to find the best culture type and quantity and to find the best pre-rennet time change you need to make (if any). Make a log of what you have done and when it's time to eat it follow up on the forum and we will see how to adjust and improve it for your next batch.
Whatever you do - don't let the milk clabber!
hmm, I did know that about goats milk being naturally homoginised, i have no idea where i learned that little fact tho.
Yes, the skim/cream will not be quite right but its got to be a lot better than the P&H milk yes?
Yes, we have our first costco here in Sydney, it opened earlier this year and no one was too happy, except me. I only went for the first time last week but will be going back. Although a LOT of the stuff there is the most expensive brands we have here, just in bulk with a little discount. But, we have a supermarket here called Aldi, and they are way cheaper than anywhere else. Big supermarkets own brands cant even compete, and costco cant either. Except the milk is a little cheaper, and a few other things.
I doubt ill find goat's milk anywhere, the organic supermarket chain we had here went under last year...
I promise not to let the milk clabber! I will get organised and start to write out notes when i do my next cheese, i always take pictures anyway ;)
To Iratherfly: That's a great idea adding cream to non-fat milk. I had forgotten that I had tried this with non-fat dry milk, and got a great curd. My cheddar recipe ripens the milk with MM100 or flora Danica for 3 hours at 76°f before renneting, and it develops a lot of flavor. I'll try your method, it makes a lot of sense.
To Crystal: I buy my milk from Aldi's. I didn't know they were that widespread. I thought that they were local to the north east of the USA. The milk I get from my local Aldi's is from Illinois, and is pasteurized gently and will set a firm curd without calcium chloride. Pretty good milk, all in all, and it seems to be from pastured cows as the color changes with the summer milk. Older recipe books may be assuming unpasteurized milk, so the clabbering would be OK, but P/H milk doesn't clabber, it spoils. The lactic bacteria we want in cheese is killed, but the enzymes that cause the fats to break down into short chain fatty acids are still there, so instead of forming something that looks like yogurt it forms something that looks and smells like vomit.
I'll send you a recipe that I have been using to get more flavor from store bought milk, and it ripens quite fast, like Caerphilly. A pH meter is a pretty handy tool for shortening your learning curve; I know another member here uses pH strips that measure to .5 instead of whole numbers, and that may be somewhat helpful.
Aldis! I would have never thought to go there for good milk.
Yep, aldi is here and i love it! Everything is cheaper there. But we dont have good milk anyehere, its all the same! So ill be doing a batch of skim/cream and using your recipe and will see how it goes!
Crystal,
Aldi milk in Sydney will come from either Pauls or Pura, they just get them to contract pack. Same as Woolies and Coles.
Dave, Aldi is a large, privately owned German supermarket chain. They base their business on carrying virtually 100% "home brand" products, rather than the market leaders. They source their products form both large and small manufacturers, all contract packed. However, they do need to carry some branded products where those products have significant market share. eg Nescafe coffee or Vegimite here in Aus. They operate on a low cost system, reduced store hours, minimal media advertising etc. Very successful in Europe and now spreading internationally.
Aussie milk is generally very good quality, from pasture fed cows. But, it is all HTST and homogenised, which is not so good for cheesemaking.
Oh, i dint mean to disrespect our milk, just meant its never going to be great for cheese! Lol
No worries Crystal, I just wish there was more un homogenised milk available for Aussie cheesemakers who can't get fresh, raw milk. :)
Me to bob! Its such a shame our govt wont let us have unhomoginised milk, from what ive heard tho, the homoginisation came about when we started feeding our babies bottled cows milk and needed it to be digestable! Since raw cows milk was causing so many deaths in young babies as the fat isnt digestable for then... so its good in a way... but atleast give us a choice!
Quote from: Crystal on December 09, 2011, 01:29:19 AM
Me to bob! Its such a shame our govt wont let us have unhomoginised milk, from what ive heard tho, the homoginisation came about when we started feeding our babies bottled cows milk and needed it to be digestable! Since raw cows milk was causing so many deaths in young babies as the fat isnt digestable for then... so its good in a way... but atleast give us a choice!
Just to set to record straight: It is not homogenization, it is pasteurisation that is a must have on bottled milk. Here in Canberra, Canberra Milk's Gold Top is unhomogenized and is the best milk for buying to drink as well as cheesemaking. Other brands have also unhomogenised milk I think Pura has one.
Hi Gurkan,
Agree. Unfortunately, there are not many brands of unhomogenized milk left now. The Canberra Gold is one, made by a Bega/Pura joint venture. Pura no longer make one for the major markets. Pauls Organic have an unhomogenised, but being organic it is quite expensive. Dairy Farmers no longer make an unhomogenised, at least not in their major markets. Some manufactures have played with a "farmers best" style of milk, but these are usually just homogenised with added free cream!
There are some small regional dairies that do unhomogenised milks, but you have to be in their local area to get them.
Homoginisation alters the structure of the fat molecules right? ALso the sugar. Pasturising kills bacteria. K, so, new babies cannot have cows milk as they cannot breakdown the fat or sugar to get energy, thats what the problem was. They were basically starving to death because there was no substitute for breast milk. So along comes homoginisation, and healthier babies because the fat was more digestible for bubs! But its still not good enough for them under 12 months. Cos cows milk is meant for cow babies, not people babies :-)
Oh, gurkan, i know all ours is pasturised, but i cant get unhomoginised here either, just the $3.50L organic one, which makes extremly expensive cheese. I just mean that it would be nice to have different milks to choose from!
Quote from: Crystal on December 09, 2011, 04:04:24 AM
Homoginisation alters the structure of the fat molecules right? ALso the sugar. Pasturising kills bacteria. K, so, new babies cannot have cows milk as they cannot breakdown the fat or sugar to get energy, thats what the problem was. They were basically starving to death because there was no substitute for breast milk. So along comes homoginisation, and healthier babies because the fat was more digestible for bubs! But its still not good enough for them under 12 months. Cos cows milk is meant for cow babies, not people babies :-)
What??? Who told you that?
Babies have been living on Goat's milk for at least 8,000 years and cow's milk for 5,000 years. These milks have lots in common with human milk and babies can digest them and benefit from them tremendously. In fact, it has been in the human food chain as a main component for so many generations that the human body has developed, inherited and improved everything it needs to deal with milk long ago.
The larger fat globules in human just go through their system and come out the other way ( * if you know what I mean * ). This is actually exactly the problem with the small globules of homogenized milk: humans digest them because they are small enough and we are not supposed to do that.
The energy comes from proteins and not just sugar. Boiling or pasteurizing the milk makes it sweeter for a myriad of reasons, including killing the lactic bacteria that produces the acid, denaturing the proteins and evaporating water. Lactose intolerance is a modern problem that wasn't really an issue until industrial pasteurization and homogenization came along.
Homogenization is done purely for aesthetic reasons, to give consumers predictable uniform consistent milk and to not have them freak out when they see butterfat floating on their milk to think that the milk has gone bad. Babies with lactose intolerance or casein allergies, asthma and many other conditions are usually relieved when they are switched to raw milk where legal to do so. Cow's raw milk is an incredibly complex substance that has lost of self-protecting properties and essential bacterium, minerals, amino acids, enzymes, sugars, vitamins, proteins and fats that do miracles for human development. Sadly when it is pasteurized the balance of that substance is gone and these important things are lost or deactivated in an improportional manner giving you an entirely different substance that is no longer able to do the job of real milk.
This human intervention is favorite of the big dairy industry not because they care for our health but because they want cows that are worked like machines and milked 3 times a day, living in close quarters because space and control over large areas is expensive. They also want to feed them cheaply and pastures are not good business sense. Then they want them to produce milk against the intention of nature so they load them up with rBST. For the poor disease lovjng consition of these sickly cows they mix antibiotics in their food regardless of their health condition - just to prevent disease which may require them to care for the sick animal and time is money when a cow is a machine and not a living creature. Finally, they want an abnormal super long shelf life so that's where the ultra pasteurization comes into place. In the words of Michael Pollan: "if the bacteria doesn't want to eat it, you definitely shouldn't". By the way both the rBST and the antibiotics go straight to your kid's body. This is why they now hit puberty at 10 years old. This is also why there is now an epidemic of super bugs - infectious bacteria types that we can no longer be immune to because it had mutated to avoid these antibiotics. Other benefits of pasteurized milk is that your calcium absorption goes, well... to the toilet (pun intended). They add calcium to the milk just to keep it from separating -because so much is lost in pasteurization and the violent homogenization, then they stick a label on the milk "Calcium Added!" as if this is something they do for your health.
The whole thing is nuts but the dairy industry's response it to make everyone confused with misleading facts, listeria hysteria and fear mongering (as oppose to cheese mongering) and lots of lobbying to lawmakers to allow them to make more of these practices and drive small family farms out of business. I find it infuriating!
QuoteThrough homogenization, fat molecules in milk become smaller and become 'capsules' for substances that bypass digestion. Proteins that would normally be digested in the stomach or gut are not broken down, and are absorbed into the bloodstream...
Homogenized milk, with its added hormones, is rocket fuel for cancer."
Robert Cohen, Executive Director of the Dairy Education Board
Quote"Homogenisation of milk may make coronary heart disease more common and more serious. Fat globules in cows' milk are surrounded by membranes. Some people make antibodies to these membranes. The antibodies cause human platelets to clump together, at least in the laboratory. It is thought that this occurs in real life, encouraging clotting in patients who have the antibodies. The antibodies also bind to natural killer cells, one of whose functions is to reduce inflammation. When the antibodies are bound to them, the action of these cells is suppressed, increasing inflammation. We know that inflammation plays a part in coronary heart disease. Homogenisation breaks up milk fat globules, increasing the surface area of the membrane, which is likely to increase the antibody response. Xanthine oxidase has been suggested as the part of the milk fat globule membrane that causes the formation of antibodies, but other components may be involved."
Margaret Moss, MA, Director of the Nutrition and Allergy Clinic, Manchester UK
Quote"So what's the harm in homogenization? Cow's milk contains an enzyme of large molecular size called xanthine oxidase (XO). XO is normally attached to the fat globules in milk. However, when these fat globules are in their natural large-sized state prior to homogenization, they are not easily absorbed by the gut wall. After homogenization, the milk fat is easily absorbed, and the attached XO gains much greater access to the bloodstream.
Some researchers [such as Dr. Kurt Oster and Dr. Donald Ross] have asserted that XO, after getting into the bloodstream, directly promotes hardening of the arteries by replacing a substance called plasmalogen that is normally found there. The research supporting this connection between XO and hardening of the arteries is not clear-cut, but whether or not there is a definite cause-and-effect relationship between the two should not be a critical factor in deciding whether you should drink milk. This possible XO link to heart disease is but one more potential connection of milk to disease and premature death."
Thomas E. Levy, MD, JD, Associate Professor at Capital University of Integrative Medicine
http://www.onearth.org/blog/still-in-superbug-denial-the-fda-denies-petitions-to-stop-feeding-antibiotics-to-livestock (http://www.onearth.org/blog/still-in-superbug-denial-the-fda-denies-petitions-to-stop-feeding-antibiotics-to-livestock)
I have more of these if you want...
I feel sorry for your american cows, but i can promise you our cows arent treated like that. I know we dont usually feed antibiotics as we have had plenty of preventable diseases strike our dairy industry.
And im quite sure that cows milk is designed for cow babies, not people babies, lol.
What i learned of milk at college is limited to australia, not the world. Plus what i know from growing up in a dairy. But as far as milk and babies goes, its been a few months since i last breastfed my bubs, and i struggled to do it as i have a condition that causes toxins in my bloodstream from undigested protien to be passed on through my milk. After various hospital visits trying to work out why my twins werent gaining weight i was tested and profiled. Now, yes there are antibodies in raw cows milk, but they wont help our babies as they are cows antibodies, to conditions that we dont have as humans ;-)
And human milk changes by the hour, weather, moon, and hormones to what our babies need. Cows milk changes to what baby cows need... it isnt designed for babies, raw or otherwise... anyway, i didnt mean to start a debate, but i dont believe that cows milk is 'good' for babies. The World Health Organisation tends to agree with me...
I am sure that Australian milk is better than the US in terms of feed and sprawling spaces for the animal. Still, it is not antibiotic or growth hormone free and its sterilization (high temp pasteurization) robs it out of its nutritional value and active health benefits.
As for your other comment, of course nature created cow's milk for cows and human milk for humans. I have not implied that breastfeeding should be replaced with cow's milk (I agree with you and think this is a bad idea). My comment was about what you said in respect to homogenization making better milk for babies. My response was about homogenization destroys milk for everyone, not just babies but adults too.
Milk has been an interchangeable between mammals throughout history. While cow's milk is obviously designed for cows, that doesn't mean it won't work for humans. It is very common in nature to find animals that are of unrelated species breastfeed other animals and nurse them to health after they have been lost, orphaned or abandoned or don't recognize their mom. I am not even talking about two bovines such as Buffalo and Cow; I am talking entirely different specie family Cats (feline) feeding dogs (canine), horse mares (equine) nursing calves (bovine) Etc.
In developing nations it is common to find HUMANS nursing goats, pigs and monkeys. (This is even more extreme because human milk is omnivore and goats are herbivores). In other words, drinking another animal's milk is not a human invention and not a foreign concept in nature at all.
After a thousand generations of having it in our digestive system, (in both fresh, acidified and preserved forms) humans also are very well equipped to digest it and break it down properly. It is wired deep into our own makeup. Historians actually believe that one of the first reasons humans have domesticated goats some 8-10,000 years ago was to give milk to their babies. Cows would not be domesticated for another 3-4,000 years. The main difference between these milks is that human milk is more watery and less when compared to cow's milk. Human milk has the same amount of fat and about 2/3rd more lactose, but about 1/3rd the protein of cow. Out of this small protein portion, about 65% is whey protein that belongs in the water phase of the milk (vs. 20% in cow) and the remaining 35% is casein (vs 80% in cow) so for babies it would be more difficult to digest.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kambf8mfKLg# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kambf8mfKLg#)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ADuSnt6PFn8# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ADuSnt6PFn8#)
Dog Adopts Lion (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1niudLi45gw#)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Moz-LvMI62w# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Moz-LvMI62w#)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOy3E5V33q0# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOy3E5V33q0#)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IjT0IvUJ2k# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IjT0IvUJ2k#)
There is a million more of these out there. I would have put the ones of women breastfeeding pigs and monkeys but you can find them off this site I am sure...
Too true, i didnt think u were bad mouthing breastfeeding lol, i just get a but touchy. Considrring i spent months trying to feed babies toxic milk ;-)
Also, i didint mean that all our cows arent fed crap, im sure some of them are, but that the situation here is much more... 'nice' than in other countries. Anyway, theres no point in me complaining, i have no real choice in what milk i use! It is what it is, my kids drink it no matter what... except the babies for now ;-)
I love milk and dont really want to get turned off it just yet so ill keep going and pretend i never heard about he odd relationships between a woman and a pig Rotfl!!!!
Sorry to stir things up guys, wasnt my intention.
So, on to the next question... lol
Can anyone recommend an online supply of cheese cultures and such? An a book? Remember im not making artisian cheese with raw milk...
I'm on the wrong side of the world for helping with suppliers, but as for a book, I have been using "200 Easy Home Made Cheese Recipes" by Debra Amrein-Boyes. It has its faults, but I annotate it with information and pH targets I garner here. Before I start a new cheese type, I search the forum for that cheese and add notes to my copy.
Cheeselinks in Australia is good I think
As for the book - I am with Dave. Excellent book indeed. Choose based on what you are interested in doing though. What kind of cheese do you want to make?
Cheeselinks are good people to deal with. You can buy their book 'Home cheesemaking' by Neil and Carole Willman, which I would recommend along with '200 Easy Homemade Cheeses'. www.cheeselinks.com.au (http://www.cheeselinks.com.au) I've also bought stuff from Green Living www.greenlivingaustralia.com.au (http://www.greenlivingaustralia.com.au) and they are also very good to deal with. Both are helpful with advice, and they post stuff by express post with a little frozen baggie inside so the cultures don't warm up in the post. Which rather amuses me as I wouldn't think that when they receive stuff from overseas that it comes refrigerated. There's a cheesemaker in Wagga who is going to stock supplies, and Mad Millie www.madmillie.com (http://www.madmillie.com) who I haven't used but I've seen her kit in a kitchenware shop. It's a NZ company but they have an Australian branch. If you can scrape up the $$ to do a cheesemaking course (a good idea if you can possibly manage it) I've been to one run by Lyndall Dykes who is based near Coffs Harbour but has an associate in Sydney (where are you?) who runs courses. www.cheesemakingworkshop.com.au (http://www.cheesemakingworkshop.com.au). I can recommend their courses - the basic one day covers feta, ricotta, camembert, quark, yogurt, mascapone, the advanced one day covers cheddar, blue vein, halloumi, havarti, 30 minute mozzarella and edam. But there are plenty of others.
Re the milk - there's an organic unhomogenized milk (sorry I can't remember the brand, yellow container) in Coles for $2.75 a litre, and sometimes on special (but of course when it's close to its use by date). I have been mostly using standard PH milk (Coles own brand) but I take on board the discussion here about the quality of milk determining the quality of the cheese. For the last cheese I made (an Edam) I used a mixture of Coles milk and organic and I was astonished at the much better curd quality, so I'll be going that way in future. As has been noted in this discussion better to make a smaller, delicious cheese than a larger ordinary one.
While Australian dairy herds are run much more free range than many US and European ones, they typically receive a considerable percentage of their food intake from grain and hay these days, so the comments about the quality of US/European milk do apply here to some degree. I guess our advantage is that the cows can go out to pasture all year round, unlike the colder climates where they need to be stall housed and fed over winter.
Love the utube clips - that poor dog!
I don't want to be self promoting here but I am going to launch a new site that will sell equipment, instruments and ingredients. It will sell internationally. Australia and New Zealand included. Until I announce the site, I do have lots of stock so if you have any special request please let me know and perhaps I can fulfill your request.
Hi guys, sorry i went awol for a bit, trying to roll two online shops into one, work out my new overlocker, look after 6 kids, do christmas shopping, kids hospital appointments, and a million other things...
I just sent dh off to splurge on un-h milk for me today :-)
Right, books... ive seen ricki carrols book and the 200 one and couldnt choose! I think im really interested in everyday kinda cheese. For the family really, not artisian blue cheese... i think the 200 one is a bit more basic tho isnt it?
Supplies, ive got the hard cheese kit from greenliving, which is ok... but... i bought the cheese press, and i wasnt impressed... the 'knob' bit that winds it down isnt secured so as soon as you hit the follower and get a bit of pressure the knob but just lets go and winds down the shaft... but i have a trusty kitchen spanner that works ok!
So, mr cheese yoda, you will be selling some stuff... thats great! I might check it out when your done so make sure you let us know when its up so we can come have a look!!
Oh, and as for cheese courses, i dont think i can do it. Its expensive and i dont want to make half the cheeses in the courses. Ill just muddle my self through and hope for the best!
But ill get the book!
Ok ive sent the day realising that the milk is everything! Wow, i just made fetta with un h milk, its still draining. But i have about twice the curd i usually get and it set great, didnt smoosh when i stirred it! I had cubes. My cutting was terrible though and nothing uniform, so i will take better care next time to cut evenly, though i dont know how! It works so much better though.
Oh, cheese yoda, if your about, im looking for flora danica. I can get it here, but only in large amounts and im not sure ineed that much. If u want to sell me a small amount id appreciate it?
alright, i have some bad notes on todays fetta make ;-)
Note, i hadn't investigated the floc method yet, have now and will use it next time!
Im working with the book from greenlivingaustralia.com that came with my cheese kit.
8L Organic Unhomoginised Milk (Pauls Brand)
1/2 tsp calcium chloride
MO 030 starter
1/2 tab vege rennet
start time 12 noon (had to wait for DH to deliver the milk ;))
placed milk in double boiler and added the calcium.
12:21 heated to 26c then shut off heat. target temp is 30c.
12:28 reached 30c, i took the pot off the double boiler.
12:27 added starter
1:16 diluted rennet and added, stirred 1 min- temp 28c so i put the pot back on the water
1:56 had great clean break, so cut into 1.5cm cubes... sort of... how on earth do you get such clean neat cubes?
temp was 29c, let sit 10 mins. (OK, the whey was rather milky... i used the good milk i swear!)
2:10 stir 20 mins
stand 5 mins, was a bit longer as i got sidetracked ;-)
2:40 drain curds (OMG, my collander didnt cope! I had to drain some curd, then put it in a bowl, drain some more, transfer, then a whole nother collander full~ I never get that much curd from P&H milk, thats really over double what i usually get! Awesome! And, it helped me justify to DH spending $22 (!!) on milk... Told him it makes twice as much cheese ;)
tied up to drain for 4 hours
7:30 ish- put curds in press @ my best estimate of 6kg... no idea really how much pressure im putting on. but i have a very handy FIL who i am in discussion with about a custom made cheese press....
8:20 removed, turned and repressed (i did this because it was sloped and i dont like the rough top the cloth and follower leave.
so its pressing now. i actually tried the curd before it went in the press, so did the hoard of cheese fiends i call my family. we were testing for texture and i must say its much firmer, more rubbery. not soft smoosh like my last cheeses. Also i noticed when i was putting it in the press that the curds still had a lot of cubish shape, which im assuming is how it should be! So my goal is to get the same look as shop fetta with the spaces in it. Its due to come out of the press at about 1:30am... but since i have a life i'll leave it in! Oh, also ive noticed my cheese press doesnt keep constant pressure, once the cheese starts to compress and shrinks the press doesnt move down with it as its a winder one. i know this is causing a problem as the pressure is never constant and im always guessing anyway. so i figured leaving this one in all night wont make a stack of difference as its not technically going to be 'pressed' all night!
Another note: I didnt add lipase... I wasnt sure if i could still use the whey for ricotta if i put lipase in?? If some one can answer that id really appreciate it!
So, thats what i did! If i made a mistake point it out! If i did some thing right point that out too! I did dilute the calcium chloride. And every one commented on the nice cubes of curds, for once it didnt look like smooshed!
Hi again,
Just took my cheese out the press, cut, salted and put it in the fridge:
I like the texture but maybe pressed too hard as its not as loose as id have liked. it tastes really salty for now, cos i just ate it with chunks of salt all over it ;)
Nice work Crystal! The unhomogenised really makes a difference doesn't it!
A couple of points, I don't press my Fetta at all, just let it drain in the hoops overnight. My hoops are square baskets and I get about 1.2kg cheese from 8 litres milk. I fill two baskets. The texture of my Fetta ends up being much more open as I dont press.
I can adjust the 'crumbliness" of my Fetta by varying the amount and strength of stirring. More, stronger stirring gives drier curds, which translates into more crumblier, open texture.
I use lipase, it adds an extra sharpness to the Fetta which I like. I don't bother making ricotta from the whey anymore, too variable results and I'm not keen on the flavour.
I brine my Fetta rather that dry salt. After removing from the hoop after overnight draining, I just place the blocks into a 12% brine solution. When I need cheese, I just cut off what I need and return the rest to the brine.
Congratulations again on your first Fetta, looks fantastic! :) :)
Wow, i considered brining, decided not too lol. And i only have a round basket so thatll have to do. I think ill be a bit more vigorous with my stirring next time and wont press. Though the gaps in yours arent much more than what i got. But i would like more gaps next time. Oh, and this is my second fetta. I like it!
I will put lipasein the next batch just to see what the flavours like i think!
Thanks for the help and ill let you know how the next cheese goes!
Quote from: Crystal on December 15, 2011, 05:34:57 AM
Ok ive sent the day realising that the milk is everything! Wow, i just made fetta with un h milk, its still draining. But i have about twice the curd i usually get and it set great, didnt smoosh when i stirred it! I had cubes. My cutting was terrible though and nothing uniform, so i will take better care next time to cut evenly, though i dont know how! It works so much better though.
Oh, cheese yoda, if your about, im looking for flora danica. I can get it here, but only in large amounts and im not sure ineed that much. If u want to sell me a small amount id appreciate it?
Sorry Crystal, I haven't been on for a few days. I am so glad you did that experiment so at least you got to see the difference between the milks!
As for Flora Danica - it is usually inexpensive and comes in quite large bags. There is a competing product called Probat 222 that you can look for. Another good replacement for it would be MM100 (It's a mix of 3 of the 4 strains that go into Flora Danica). It has less of that buttery flavor and less gas production. There is also MA4000 which has those 3 out of 4 mesophilic strains that go into Flora Danica and a 4th strain which is thermophilic (acts as a stabilizer in mesophilic recipes so a Camembert for example takes longer to age but is less runny and is in ripe state for longer time before developing ammonia). This said, MA4000 series is really made for Tommes and the likes
right, lots of mmmmmmmm's lol. Thanks for the info. i did find some cheaper and locally, just have to go and get it. i think ill get the fd, as its used in a few other things. Cultured butter etc... ill slowly collect some others...