Author Topic: John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5  (Read 5747 times)

Offline John (CH)

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John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5
« on: December 28, 2008, 01:40:42 PM »
Today I start my fifth Camembert making based on the recipe here, (interspersed with helping daughter #2 paint her bedroom), my other Camembert records here:

MAKING
  • Dec 28, 2008, 1:00PM: Poured 1 US gallon/3.8 litres of store bought pasteurized homogenized whole cow's milk from fridge into stockpot on smallest gas burner ring on stove. As milk pasteurized, to standardize, added and stirred in 1/2 teaspoon diluted CaCl2. Measured temperature at 6 C/44 F and pH at 6.0, turned gas on low to warm milk.
  • Dec 28, 2008, 1:20PM: Milk at correct temp, turned off heat, measured pH at 6.05, stirred in 1/8 teaspoon Danisco's Choozit Brand Mesophilic Starter Culture MM100, covered and set aside. Similar to Cartierusm, weighed 250 dose bag of culture a 87 grams, assumed bag 7 grams, 80 gr / (250 doses x 10 litre) = 0.032 gram/litre or 0.12 gram per US gallon, no fine enough scale, so just assumed 1/8 teaspoon was plenty!
  • Dec 28, 2008, 3:30PM: Measured temp at 87 F/31 C and pH at 5.93, rewarmed to 96 F/36 C, diluted 1/16" teaspoon powdered rennet in 1/4 cup water, trickled into milk while stirring with whisk thoroughly. Covered and set aside for curd to set.
  • Dec 28, 2008, 4:40PM: Found very strong curd set with whey already being expelled, measured temp at 94 F/34 C and pH at 5.53, cut curd into diamonds, covered to let rest and expel more whey.
  • Dec 28, 2008, 5:00PM: Ladled curds and whey into 2 hoops on mats on draining board, too much, had to wait 10 min to allow whey to be expelled before all fit into just 2 hoops.
  • Dec 28, 2008, 6:00PM, 7:00PM, 8:00PM, 9:30PM: Turned hoops.
  • Dec 29, 2008, 6:00AM: Turned hoops.
  • Dec 29, 2008, 7:00AM: Removed from hoops, patted with ~5 grams salt each. Sprinkled with few spores of Danisco brand Penicillum Candidum VS (mild), placed in cooler drawer of household fridge to mature.

AGING
  • Dec 30, 2008, 8:00AM: Day 2, checked humidity and turned 2 Camemberts.
  • Dec 31, 2008, 8:00AM: Day 3, wiped out free water, changed mats, and turned 2 Camemberts, no bloom yet.
  • Jan 1, 2009, 8:00AM: Day 4, turned 2 Camemberts, no bloom yet.
  • Jan 2, 2009, 8:00AM: Day 5, turned 2 Camemberts, no bloom yet.
  • Jan 3, 2009, 8:00AM: Day 6, turned 2 Camemberts, no bloom yet.
  • Jan 15, 2008, 6:00PM: Day 18, still no mold growth, could be due to very cold fridge or as not enough P Candid um, see picture below.
  • Jan 22, 2009, 7:00PM: Day 25, small area with mold, most not, gave up on household fridge as too cold and dry for mold to grow, placed in plastic box and put in garage as last chance.
  • Jan 24, 2008, 11:00AM: Day 27, excellent mold growth, see picture below!
  • Jan 31, 2008, 1:00PM: Day 34, cut Camembert #1 and ate for French Ploughman's Lunch, cheese not ripe enough yet, see picture below. Placed second in cool garage to age at warmer temp than household fridge.
  • Feb 8, 2008, 8:00AM: Day 42, found garage warm @ 70 F/21 C (as south breeze off of Gulf of Mexico) and that Camembert #2 had leaked a small amount of cheese, see picture below. Placed in cold household fridge as definitely ready to eat and don't want it for breakfast.
  • Feb 9, 2008, 6:00PM: Day 43, let Camembert rise to room temperature for dinner desert, cut Camembert #2 through middle, found still immature and small moist around edge, cut near edge, found ripe/moist.

NOTES
  • Mold development is highly dependant on aging room/Cheese Cave's humidity & temperature; in very dry household fridge for weeks, minimal mold, in own plastic box for higher hummidity and in garage, lots of mold in days.
  • Camembert's maturity is highly dependant on aging room/Cheese Cave's temperature; in very cold household fridge for weeks, minimal aging, in warm garage for 1 week, fully aged!
  • Household fridge's vegetable drawer is not a good Cheese Cave for Camembert's early aging stage, as no normal significant mold bloom after 24 days, as 1) low humidity (even though added water almost daily), and 2) temperature too cold.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2009, 06:12:38 PM by Cheese Head/John »


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Offline John (CH)

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« Last Edit: February 08, 2009, 08:37:44 AM by Cheese Head/John »

Offline John (CH)

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« Last Edit: February 09, 2009, 06:11:06 PM by Cheese Head/John »

Offline Tea

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Re: John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5
« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2008, 01:56:26 PM »
Fingers crossed.  Hope it works this time.

Offline John (CH)

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Re: John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5
« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2008, 08:23:23 AM »
Hope so, was just my forgetfulness last time, over heated the curds and forgot to turn often enough, duh! Was still very edible :D.

What was different this time is the very strong curd I got after adding rennet. The only thing significantly different was I used Choozit MM100 Mesophilic manufactured culture rather than my buttermilk homemade culture, maybe that batch wasn't ripe enough. The stronger curd and thus cut curds, also resulted in non-uniform on sides Camembert when renoved from hoops >:(.


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Offline Tea

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Re: John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5
« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2008, 02:54:27 PM »
CH I have had that on almost every batch of brie or camembert that I have made.  I found that by the time the mould grows that most of this is covered beautifully.
Remember my little saying; Mould covers a multitude of sins!

Rather than just dumping the curd into the moulds, I now try and place them so that there are minimal spaces on the sides.  Doesn't eliminate them all but it helps.

Offline John (CH)

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Re: John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5
« Reply #6 on: December 29, 2008, 07:57:34 PM »
Tea, I know both your and my recipes call for and we both do cut the curds, but when I did some research on making Camembert they didn't have cut curds in BBC article or Camembert-Country page or Camembert-France. So I'm wondering if maybe we shouldn't cut the curds and instead gently ladle the curd into the hoops and let gravity aid in whey separation?

Offline Tea

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Re: John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5
« Reply #7 on: December 30, 2008, 02:31:38 PM »
Ch I had to smile when I read your post.  You and I are on the same wave length with this.  ;)
Have another look at the St Maure cheese recipe and note the pics that I have posted.  This cheese is made like that with no cutting of the curd, just laddling in after setting and ripening over night.  When doing this my thoughts were running in the same direction, "why can't you do this for brie or camembert"?  So I have decided that I am going to trial this recipe using cow's milk, before I try another brie/camembert and see what the difference is.  From there I was going to start experiementing on those recipes and see what changes could be made.
What do you think??  Worth a try?

Offline John (CH)

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Re: John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5
« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2008, 04:54:13 PM »
Agreed, next Camembert I make I won't cut the cheese (in making).

Offline John (CH)

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Re: John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5
« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2009, 07:26:08 PM »
Question to others Camembert makers:

See my OP above, in this batch I salted immediately after removing from hoops and then puffed a few spores onto the cheese immediately after salting.

I'm aging in very cold fridge veg drawer, so I expect slower to develop, but they are 7 days old an no visible mold growth yet. Should I re-spore and also add Geo and why or just wait?


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Offline RRR

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Re: John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5
« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2009, 10:05:46 AM »
Is very cold below 45 F? I have not made a Camembert but I had the same problem and let my Saint Mauer go longer and it did develope mold. However, I add spores to the milk at start up. It is my understanding the Geo helps prevent slip especially in goat milk, so I now use a little geo and it has reduced the incidents of slip.

Offline John (CH)

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Re: John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5
« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2009, 11:46:13 AM »
Thanks RRR, our fridge is about 42F, so guess I'll have to wait longer, my previous batches bloomed fine, but at warmer temp.

Offline Tea

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Re: John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5
« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2009, 02:40:07 PM »
RRR not sure I am understanding what you are meaning by "slip".  Could you explain please.

Offline Likesspace

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Re: John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5
« Reply #13 on: January 10, 2009, 09:46:03 PM »
Tea,
"Slip" is also what is called toad skin or frog skin on a camembert or brie. It is when after the mold forms, you disrupt (slip) the fuzz from the surface when turning or handling. I've also read that Geo will keep this from happening so I've added it from my very first batch of Camembert. As yet I have never slipped the fuzz off of one of my wheels.
John: As for how long it will take for the mold to form...... I've never seen mold any sooner than 7 days. I always put my Camembert in a wine fridge that runs between 44 - 48 degrees F. I've heard of many people who see fuzz on day six but I never have. In fact it's usually day 10 before I can truly see what I refer to as a decent covering.

Dave

Offline Tea

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Re: John's Cheese #027 - Camembert #5
« Reply #14 on: January 11, 2009, 02:16:22 PM »
Good heavens, I usually just about have a complete coverage by day 3!!  mmm I think that proves that I definately do not have these at a cool enough temp.