Author Topic: Kluveromyces marxianus?  (Read 1843 times)

Offline ArnaudForestier

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Kluveromyces marxianus?
« on: January 30, 2019, 04:08:02 AM »
I'm looking at the http://www.coquard.fr/fr/catalogue/cat-coquard-2019.pdf, and happened to come across a "tomme blend" in their cultures section.  This only has DH, B. linens and Kluveromyces marxianus.  They describe the blend as one for a "tomme, with dry rind."  They have another culture, their Pyrénées blend, with "Brevibacterium linens, Debaryomyces, Brevibacterium casei et Geotrichum."

Does anyone anything about this Kl. marxianus?  I've never come across it but they have me interested.

Another interesting thing is that they have two Penicillum species specifically recommended for tommes: Penicillium NALGIOVENSIS, which they describe as adhering well to the cheese, limits mucor, particularly good with pressed tommes.  The other, Penicillium gris, really interests me because before I stopped making cheese several years ago, I really wanted to develop a good tomme grise or variant - Tome de Lullin (also described by Androuet as having a dry crust), any grey cousin.  With either one, they recommend blending with DH.

If it helps, the NALGIOVENSIS is listed as "SIGMA 41" and the P. grey is "SIGMA 43."

Does anyone know if the P. grey is commonly available here in the States?  Does it go by another name?

Many thanks.
- Paul

Offline mikekchar

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Re: Kluveromyces marxianus?
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2019, 08:00:59 AM »
I don't know the answer to your question, but the b.linens has me interested.  I wouldn't have thought you'd want that in a tomme.  Don't you *want* mould to encourage a natural rind?

Offline ArnaudForestier

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Re: Kluveromyces marxianus?
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2019, 03:01:21 AM »
Hi Mike, well, first let me tell you, anything I once knew has in the large part go lost, so grain of salt, etc.   If you haven't read them, look up the work of FRANCOIS, linuxboy, and I'd rather 'fly.  I did do a number of trials and thoughts on the style, because I'm pretty mad for it.  If you read any of that, I hope it was helpful.

Firstly, and forgive if you know all this - but though the Savoie tommes contains some corynebacteria, and sometimes express B. linens, even with heavy mold rinding, the Savoie is a very mold-centric cheese, as it looks like your.  As usual, you can achieve any rind, almost, if you create the right environment, allowing them to out-compete.  I've been playing around French world and they use a couple of Penicilli I'd not heard of before,

If the Savoie is mold-based, the Pyrenees version is washed rind and there you see so much more of the lines-type species, and washing generally.  First of alll, in their essentially farmhouse tomme blend, they use much of the same as (we use another species, I think, can't recall - arthobacter nicotanae?), but the use Kl. marxianus.  Presumably in lieu of what we are accustomed to, KL 71.  I am just now digging some so again, take this for salt, but I don't believe there is much morphological or biochemical, etc., difference between these two Kluveromyces species. I could be totally wrong, but a good farmhouse culture will get you going.

However, I was intrigued by the Coquard material:

Quote
SIGMA 41 Penicillium NALGIOVENSIS (lyophilisé) 500 L Pâte pressée 005DAC
Moisissure blanche. Adhère bien au fromage, limite le Tomme de pays
développement de mucor. Très adaptée aux pâtes pressées.
SIGMA 43 Penicillium gris (liquide) 500 L Tomme de pays 005DCC
Moisissure grise pour croûtage Tomme.
A utiliser préférablement en mélange avec sigma 21 ou 22.

-it's the second one, "biforme" or here, "gris," is the one that has me particularly geeked.  I don't know if we can get it here in the States but I'd love to try.  I think Mycodore and Mycoderm are cool (though Mycoderm is way too prohibitive for me), but I would like to go about inoculating a cave with this gris and others.  About 92%, and 54 F.
- Paul

Offline mikekchar

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Re: Kluveromyces marxianus?
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2019, 09:51:19 AM »
Cheers!  I'm still learning a lot and have a lot more to learn :-)  I guess I've only had the Savoie kind! Now I'm even more interested in this style!  Washed rinds are my favourite, but I've started to get sucked into Tomme and I really want to make one (no appropriate cave at the moment, unfortunately).  The cave has preliminary spousal approval, so maybe I can get started in the summer :-)