3 spaces; sidee by side on wine cooler, dorm fridge, full size fridge

[ArnaudForestier]

Hi all,

I know this has been trampled to death, but I don't know if I've seen any pros and cons for comparative aging solutions.  Basically, I intend on 3 spaces (yeah, sure.  Well, let's just say for now).  (1) drying and brining; (2) natural, mold-centered rinds; (3) washed rinds.

All will have a small fan to blow air around gently, and a US humidifier fit to need.

I used full size refrigerators in the past with good results.  I don't recall using a mini or wine cooler, but that doesn't mean I didn't use them - just can't recall if I did or not.  Of course, the 640 s.f. cave was nice, though I think the velocity coming out of the coolbot-controlled A/C suppressed the development I was looking for.  Just really, really slow development.

So, pros and cons, if you would:

Wine cooler, with compressor;
Wine cooler, thermoelectric cooling, no fan (except my "circulation" fan).
Dorm or mini-refrigerator;
Full size refrigerator;
Ideally, if staying away from a true cave, a freezerless refrigerator.  For those that have one, any tips on where you got them (I mean, used), very much appreciated.

Edit:  Guess I just have to say, it appears Pav, Yoav, Francois, Sailor, Jos/Oude Kaas - they've moved on, it seems?  Pretty lonely for tapping their minds as much as possible.   No, I really do miss them.  Anyone know what they might be up to?

[mikekchar]

I have no experience with any of those systems :-( and I live in an apartment that has not space :-( :-(  Trying to convince my wife we need a cheese cave with a house built around it, but so far our life is too all over the place to do it (I live in rural Japan, but do contract work for a UK company -- which results in a fair amount of travel).  So please come to a conclusion so that I can plan my house (I already found someone nearby with a billy goat, so my cheese oriented plans are slowly coming to fruition ;-) )

But as for your other question, reading the old threads, I really wish more of the older people would come back too.  Still, we've had a few (like you!) so I'm quite happy :-)

[awakephd]

Paul, I miss them too! But maybe they will be like you and me, away for a while due to life circumstances, but eventually returning when they are able.

As for the options you list, the only one I have personal experience with is a wine cooler with a compressor. Note, though, that mine does not include a fan - it has a passive cooling "plate" at the rear. Overall it works well for me - certainly very convenient that it does not require any additional controller, since it is the type that allows setting a specific temperature. The one drawback is that it tends to condense moisture on that back plate, which runs down to the bottom and eventually leaks out the bottom of the door. I have learned to deal with that by placing a kitchen towel draped across the bottom, which I periodically replace. Note that I have not attempted to maintain humidity; it hovers at around 70% just with the cheeses that are drying in the "cave." I either use a ripening box to maintain higher humidity as needed, and/or vacuum-bag a cheese once it has reached the point where that is possible.

There is another variation on the options you describe. You mention a freezerless refrigerator (to have just one compartment), but I've read about folks simply using a freezer - already just one compartment. Apparently it works fine with the standard controllers.

[ArnaudForestier]

Thanks both of you.  Andy, fingers crossed - always got so much from those folks!

I think that's pretty awesome you have a compressor basis but it's a radiating plate and not a fan blowing cold air in, do I have it right?  Best of both worlds seems to me - none of the downside of using a thermoelectric with its poor rep for durability, none of the issue with over-the-top airflow to stifle rind development.  Pretty cool.

I actually have a freezer, standup, that has the radiating loops webbed into the shelves themselves, and I dismissed it because my mind was thinking they'd freeze up.  I wonder what happens when you keep it at, say, 52-55F?  And use wood for shelving?  What do you think?  Certainly gives me a ton more space to work with. (Though just found an unusually large, 7.6 c.f., dorm fridge).  Anyway, if it works, the freezer would be a nice solution.  Just don't know what happens to the radiant loops when it's set above freezing.

Many thanks.  Mike, yourself as well.  I feel your pain, man.  If I hadn't in my time had a music studio, English ale bar (meaning, converted refrigerators everywhere, and one firkin on engine, at least - some in the living room, two in our bedroom, lol), cheese "caves" everywhere (those two in my bedroom?.....), my cookware (a restaurant's worth) right next to our dining table stacked on three massive lock-shelves.....well, I'd probably have more bargaining power, is what I'm trying to say.  This time around, I'm going to have to tread very  carefully or it's me with sharing the bed of the fellow below.

[awakephd]

Mmm, coils in the shelves. I'd say if you put wood on top of that, there should be no problem, but that's just a guess. I don't recall exactly what folks said about using freezers, but I distinctly remember that some thought it was the best. Buried somewhere in the bowels of this forum ....

Yes, best of both worlds on my wine cooler - and I got it for $100 used on Craigslist, so inexpensive as well!

[scasnerkay]

I did have a freezer with coils in the shelves as a cave for about 1 year. I bought it new, and the compressor burned out just after the warranty. The big problem with it for me was way too much humidity! I got some absorbant canisters, and had to dry them frequently to re-charge them. But the bigger problem with water dripping off the coils!! This seemed to happen only on the top coil, so I rigged up a diversion for the water with a sheet of plastic.

Next phase was 2 large dorm size refrigerators. One had a small freezer insert which tended to drip, so that was for when cheeses were more than a month or two of natural rind and could be vacuum sealed. The other was perfect! I used a humidifier from perfect cheese, and was able to manage well except for space.

Newest phase is a slightly used "True" beverage fridge from a hardware store going out of business. I don't think I can ever fill this one up!! Even though the cool air is circulated with a fan pointing down on the cheeses, I have not experienced any drying problems. In the winter I have removed the humidifier because I was consistently above 95%. As the temp warms now and the cooling runs more often, I will put the humidifier back in.

Next stage is finding some additional room in the garage for the dorm fridge so I can add blues to the makes!!

[awakephd]

Hi Susan,

Good to see you are still active on the forum! And great that you can correct my half-remembered (half-baked??) information with personal experience. Now that you have shared this, I seem to remember reading what you said above - maybe an earlier post from you! Paul, my apologies for steering you wrong ...

[ArnaudForestier]

Thank very much guys, gives me another option to think about.  I'm really happy that, knock on wood, the basement (internal room in basement, so no walls are outside walls) holds a nice temp - right around 51F.  RH is low, of course (56%) and I'll have to resolve that.  But for a natural cave which I'm eager to try, I don't think there's going to be an issue with molds.....let's just hope they're not fuzzy little black patches!

[ArnaudForestier]

I had forgotten to mention that, anticipating building a cooler for a "real ale" setup, and engine and a firkin, I ripped the guys out of a dorm fridge and had planned to put it in a cabinet I either adapted or built.  Easier with an ale fridge than this, I would think, as here, I need to make doubly sure everything is sealed and insulated like crazy.  What do you think?

[Tiarella]

Hi All,  I may start a new thread also but this one is kind of what I'm needing.  I narrowly missed getting a professional cheese aging upright bridge type thing from a cheese maker going out of business years ago and now I want to buy one but have no clue what it was, brand, etc.  Any ideas?  I actually have some money to buy it with, rare I know, so finding brand names and models and then looking for used or new versions of it.  Any ideas? 

As for catch up news since I haven't posted in ages:  I'm pretty much done with Lyme and the collateral damage from living with an angry man for years.  Happy farming by myself or with a new partner and I have lots of milk to make cheese with.  My Kinder goats are producing well and when the last of the spring kids are weaned I'll have a big issue trying to figure out how to use all the milk.  Right now I'm just making a lot of chèvre since there's a lot of farm work to manage and cheese-making has to fit in around the edges. 

For any new forum members you can see some photos of my cheeses at my farm website (not updated) www.sovereignhillfarm.com   There is also a thread somewhere here with a tutorial for shiitake Brie style cheese.  Lots of photos for that.

Hopefully someone has ideas for me for a cheese aging fridge.  I might make a root cellar with a cheese section but that'd not have any proximity to a sink for washing hands in between cheeses and in winter there'd be snow drifts to scale carrying cheese back to the house to attend to.

Thanks in advance, Kathrin

[awakephd]

Kathrin, I don't have any help to offer with the cheese cave, but so glad to see you on the forum, and glad to hear that things are moving in a positive direction for you.

[Tiarella]

Kathrin, I don't have any help to offer with the cheese cave, but so glad to see you on the forum, and glad to hear that things are moving in a positive direction for you.

Thank you, Andy.          I may not post much until I get into at least some adorned Caerphilly cheesemaking.  I still do hope to find info about cheese aging fridges I can search for.

Blessings, Kathrin